Was Jesus A Man Before the Incarnation?

[webdog]

Very true, Sister Marcia!! The false doctrine that teaches that Jesus was a man before His incarnation reaks of Mormanism!!!

False doctrine, eh?

Dan 3:25 He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

Joh 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

 

[El_Guero]

Very true, Sister Marcia!! The false doctrine that teaches that Jesus was a man before His incarnation reaks of Mormanism!!!

Amen! Amen! Amen!

 

[blackbird]

If Jesus were a man(flesh) BEFORE His incarnation-----what of the verse, "And the Word was made flesh and dwelt among us . . . "--John 1:14

Where did the flesh He possessed BEFORE incarnation "go" when He took on incarnated flesh???

When He took on flesh in verse 14-----it was for the very first time His very own personal flesh--and He will possess that flesh throughout all eternity!!

 

[webdog]

I addressed that earlier. "Flesh" means "meat" in the greek...something corruptible. The Word DID become flesh, which is the only way that He could have died for us. Let Bible explain Bible...
1Co 15:50 Brothers, I tell you this: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, and corruption cannot inherit incorruption.

When He took on flesh in verse 14-----it was for the very first time His very own personal flesh--and He will possess that flesh throughout all eternity!!

Christ will NOT possess the corruptible body similar to ours throughout all eternity, as this goes against the very Scripture above! When He rose, His body was made perfect...but was still a body. This will be true for believers, too. Our bodies will be like His. I think it's a stretch to say that Christ NEVER had a perfect body in Heaven prior to becoming "flesh". This would insinuate that Christ is bound by our time. He is the Lamb slain before the foundation of the world, a very clear statement showing His omnitemporalness.

 

[Jarthur001]

False doctrine, eh?

Dan 3:25 He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

Joh 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

Hello webdog..

You keep using verses out of context.

1st this..

Gen 18:1 Then the LORD appeared to Abraham at the oaks of Mamre while he was sitting in the entrance of his tent during the heat of the day.
Gen 18:2 He looked up, and he saw three men standing near him. When he saw them, he ran from the entrance of the tent to meet them and bowed to the ground.
Gen 18:3 Then he said, "My lord, if I have found favor in your sight, please do not go on past your servant.

Now this....

Dan 3
25He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

Please show me why you think God has a Body in this verse.



In Christ...James

 

[Andy T.]

Webdog, if Christ's incarnate body existed before he was born, what age was it? Was it when he was 1, 5, 15, 25, 30, or any age inbetween? Which leads to the next question, since Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever, why did his body change when he was on Earth? He started out as an infant and then grew to a man. Gasp! - he changed! How do you deal with that truth with your strict omnitemporal-make-God-into-an-immovable-static-object-thing?

 

[El_Guero]

Smithian heresy.

Jesus was not a man before His incarnation. He was not the brother of satan (another smithian heresy along that same line).

Looking like a man only means that you are standing upright and don't look like a cat or a bull ('gods' in the ANE).

Jesus was the great I am . . . He was the King of Kings and He was Lord of Lords.

He was, He is, and He will always BE.

 

[webdog]

Please show me why you think God has a Body in this verse.

Other than the fact that He is described as a man?

Some people on here are sounding awfully gnostic to me.

 

[webdog]

Webdog, if Christ's incarnate body existed before he was born, what age was it? Was it when he was 1, 5, 15, 25, 30, or any age inbetween? Which leads to the next question, since Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever, why did his body change when he was on Earth? He started out as an infant and then grew to a man. Gasp! - he changed! How do you deal with that truth with your strict omnitemporal-make-God-into-an-immovable-static-object-thing?

What age was / is His perfect body? Why put an "age" on something that is eternal? What "age" will our bodies be when we are resurrected? Some will never come to the conclusion that God (Jesus included) is omnipresent. Andy, working within time does not mean Christ is BOUND by our time. He did grow as a human...within TIME...our time. If He continues to grow...how old is He now?

 

[webdog]

Smithian heresy.

Jesus was not a man before His incarnation. He was not the brother of satan (another smithian heresy along that same line).

Looking like a man only means that you are standing upright and don't look like a cat or a bull ('gods' in the ANE).

Jesus was the great I am . . . He was the King of Kings and He was Lord of Lords.

He was, He is, and He will always BE.

Who ever said anything about being the brother of satan? Please explain how one can "look" like a man...stand upright as you say...without a body?

 

[Jarthur001]

Other than the fact that He is described as a man?

Please show me where this is done?

 

[webdog]

Where what is done?

You keep accusing me of posting verses out of context. Show how.

 

[Jarthur001]

Please show me where this is done?

Where it says God has a Body.

or..

where it says Christ had a body before He was born

 

[webdog]

...once you show me how someone described as a "man" means they do not have a body....

...and a "non bodied form" can eat...

...and a "non bodied form" can stand and walk...

...and a "non bodied form" can wrestle...

 

[Jarthur001]

Other than the fact that He is described as a man?

Some people on here are sounding awfully gnostic to me.

Gnostic believe that Jesus only came in the Spirit....Jesus did not have a physical body.

No one that I have seen holds to this. But you seem to think His body always was.

 

[El_Guero]

God can do anything that He wants to.

 

[Jarthur001]

God can do anything that He wants to.

I would agree. But before we can hang things on God as something He does, we can only make the statement you just made above and leave it at that. Other wise we must find Bible support.

 

[Jarthur001]

...once you show me how someone described as a "man" means they do not have a body....

...and a "non bodied form" can eat...

...and a "non bodied form" can stand and walk...

...and a "non bodied form" can wrestle...

Where is this verse?

 

[Andy T.]

What age was / is His perfect body? Why put an "age" on something that is eternal? What "age" will our bodies be when we are resurrected? Some will never come to the conclusion that God (Jesus included) is omnipresent. Andy, working within time does not mean Christ is BOUND by our time. He did grow as a human...within TIME...our time. If He continues to grow...how old is He now?

Ah, so you admit that Christ did change! You deny his immutability!

This is all rhetorical. I don't believe you deny his immutability by admitting that he grew from an infant to a man. But neither can you charge others of denying his immutability by saying that Christ was not flesh and bone before the incarnation. If God is static like you propose in many of your statements, then Jesus would have just appeared on the Earth as a full-grown man and would have never aged.

 

[Andy T.]

Maybe the mormons have one thing right, after all, even a blind squirrel finds a nut from time to time.

Actually, this would the second nut that the Mormons have found that you agree with. The other is that Jesus goes around preaching to native tribes in the jungle where no missionairies have gone.