LadyEagle said:
Well, it looks like we are going to continue to talk about slavery on this thread, instead of the OP. That being the case, who gets the blame for the blacks and arabs who SOLD and KIDNAPPED the black African slaves to the Europeans and Americans? No one ever mentions that fact - it's always the "white" man's fault. Sorry, but this peeves me.
And, like someone indicated earlier, while we get all self-righteous and sanctimonious and pat ourselves on the back because we have legally abolished slavery in this country, we still contribute to the world-wide problem of slavery, human trafficking, when we continue to indulge our materialistic appetites by buying cheap goods at cheap prices (like Wal-Mart) from other countries (like China). So we are all guilty. As guilty as the immoral elected leaders who talk about the problem, but encourage it to continue by granting Normal Trade Relations with countries who practice not only slavery, but human rights violations of all kinds. So we are all guilty and have nothing to feel sanctimonious about. And no, we didn't have this situation back in the 1950s and 1960s.
Now will someone explain to me how the historical American slavery that was abolished decades ago, has contributed to the present moral American decline of taking God out of the public square, the genocide of millions of unborn American babies in the womb, gun violence and shootings in our public schools, increased rapes and murders in our neighborhoods, increased use of street drugs among our young people, the highest divorce rate in America's history, resulting in the most single parent families in American history, AIDS epidemic, "gay rights" and more? Who wouldn't long for the Mayberry of yesteryear?
Excellent post Lady Eagle!:thumbs:
Yes, the thread strayed from the O.P. which I noted to gb93433 as it was to become a slavery or Civil War debate thus adding little to the O.P. I apologize for somewhat continuing but would like to re-direct in a better fashion.
Slavery is a legitimate issue to discuss on moral grounds as gb93433 brought up; however it had little to do with the O.P. as it was presented. If it had been presented as "
You cannot argue America was a greater moralistic nation at any time during slavery", then it could have added to the discussion.
Only there is great fallacy with that stance because slavery is not the greatest moral issue America has ever faced. That would also presuppose many of us feel America was at its greatest moral level during its earlier years and not at some other point. After all, slavery ended some 130 years ago in America and we continued to grow as a Christian nation or society. It is in part why it ended.
Again this is easily shown with the introduction and continuance of many laws, Supreme Court decisions, Presidential/Congressional acts and societal attitudes, which were based on Christian morals. A pattern which continued until the 1960's when many of these traditions began to come under attack; leading to the removal of the Ten Commandments and Voluntary School prayer, to the eventual usurpation of State rights with the legalization of abortion, the forced introduction of Darwinism and outlawing of Creationism, etc, etc, etc.
At no time in American history, until recent decades, did you have such ferocious and across the board attacks on these many historical and long standing values of American society and our Christian heritage. Otherwise, I invite anyone to show differently! This continues further, with attempts to remove the Ten Commandments from other Government buildings, attempts to remove Crosses from public and historic cemeteries, to attacking the Pledge of Allegiance and "In God We Trust". Attempts in introducing classes for which children are not only taught to accept "alternative" lifestyles but that such is normal and equal to any other lifestyle, to removing Christmas songs and plays from schools or other public attacks on Christmas, to promoting gay marriage, etc, etc.
As bad as slavery was, what Christian would argue that it is worse or even equal to the killing of millions of unborn children each year: or the solicitation and rape of women and children as found today?!!
That is only an argument you will get from atheist and the like. It is such that was never an accepted practice in American society as clearly shown with the moral laws opposing it and the many other un-Godly issues. Therefore our Forefathers, grand and great grand parents, were up a moralistic leg on us. As many laws and attitudes as the above, have been relaxed or abolished all together, in our lifetime. We are greatly to blame, as many Christians refrained from getting involved with politics and such. If we cannot even agree on how to stand on abortion issues, then how are we to unite in changing our society back to a more Godly nature? We cannot even agree that should be an objective, though God clearly shows He judges and blesses nations according to their nature. He expects us to bring His word to the world, how disappointing it is we cannot even bring it to our own nation!
As bad as slavery was, one thing that was not mentioned is, those blacks and indeed Indians were introduced to the Lord, with many finding salvation through Him! If we truly believe what we say and can rejoice in the salvation of others', then you cannot argue nothing good came of it. As black congregations arose and thrived from the Founders day and as surely God saw to it. I believe slavery is wrong as Jesus taught us the Golden Rule,
"do unto others as you would have done unto you".
But it cannot be as bad as what we witness today and the sanctimonious attitude we take in thinking we are clean of slavery and such exploitations, or even racist attitudes. It takes good people as Lady Eagle and others' in reminding us of this.
The O.P. is correct in that we have not gotten better or even maintained a good moral standard but in fact have gone down; as easily shown through abortion, illegitimate birth rates, and divorce rates alone. This is not to say America is a lost cause or that we are a bad people, as I still believe we have a huge heart! God often punished His chosen people Israel, lead them into and then out of slavery, and eventually split them into many nations.
The point is to remind us in being diligent to serve as good Christian examples and in attempting to preserve the Blessings of our Lord unto us as a nation. God knows our family through many generations, as many many others', have given in service for our great Nation. We should honor their memories in preserving what many fought and died for, in standing for the Lord and continuing to ask for His much needed guidance.
The O.P. is correct, but we truly have the ability to correct that.
Take care and God Bless America! God Bless you and me as we honor Him!:jesus:
