WHAT ARE THE BASIC PROBLEMS IN LORDSHIP SALVATION?

[Steven_15]

Lol, I'm ignorant for asking you to substantiate your points? Okey dokey.

I dislike LS almost as much as I dislike poor arguments.

Acts 16:31: "They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household."

 

[Rob_BW]

You belong to lordship salvation. People have identified your disguise. Read the OP Again.

You have shown you have no interest in honest discussion by making ridiculous claims against me even after I've posted ample proof that no, in fact, I do not support the LS view. Multiple threads on this site prove it. So why dig your heels in and continue with baseless accusations?

 

[Steven_15]

You have shown you have no interest in honest discussion by making ridiculous claims against me even after I've posted ample proof that no, in fact, I do not support the LS view. Multiple threads on this site prove it. So why dig your heels in and continue with baseless accusations?

Romans 10:9: "if you will confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved".

Repent by believing.

 

[Rob_BW]

Romans 10:9: "if you will confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved".

Repent by believing.

I've seen how you react to criticism, but let me give a word of advice before I exit this thread: the board takes a rather dim view on questioning the salvation of others. Since accusations appear to be your go to, it would be advisable not to cross that line if you enjoy posting here.

 

[Steven_15]

I've seen how you react to criticism, but let me give a word of advice before I exit this thread: the board takes a rather dim view on questioning the salvation of others. Since accusations appear to be your go to, it would be advisable not to cross that line if you enjoy posting here.

The board has a great view of scriptures. So better keep your advice to yourself and don't criticise God's word. Caution!

 

[xlsdraw]

This forum has seen a spike of new posters coming in over the last year with divisive characteristics. No sense of fellowship. Debate is veiwed scripturally as evil when it is used to divide the body. It seems that almost all threads these days fall into this trap. IMO, it is a sign of the times.

 

[Steven_15]

This forum has seen a spike of new posters coming in over the last year with divisive characteristics. No sense of fellowship. Debate is veiwed scripturally as evil when it used to divide the body. It seems that almost all threads these days fall into this trap. IMO, it is a sign of the times.

Resd the OP and reply. If you have no meaningful reply keep yourself out.

 

[xlsdraw]

Resd the OP and reply. If you have no meaningful reply keep yourself out.

Exhibit A.

 

[Dave G]

What are the unbiblical theological inconsistencies in Lordship Salvation (LS)?

It tends to make grace into works.

It front-loads the Gospel and gives people false assurance in a system that, if followed "religiously", guarantees eternal life based on those works... not on the grace and mercy of God that produces a change in the hearts and minds of the ones He has decided to show that grace and mercy to.

In other words, it takes the believers eyes off the grace and mercy of God through Jesus Christ, and places those eyes on their performance, not His performance on their behalf.

Promoters of LS tend to look at other's faults while hiding their own sins in view God's command in Mathew 5:48 and accusing/judging other christians in the name of church discipline.

I agree, and I see this:

Church discipline is intended to gently call out the sinful deeds of fellow believers, in an effort to get them to examine themselves to determine whether they be in the faith.
It is intended as exhortation and admonishment that, if one is saved, they should be actively seeking to obey God, not to disobey Him.

It is done with the full knowledge that we are all broken messes, but broken messes indwelt with the Holy Spirit who can and does overcome the deeds of the flesh by His power.
See Romans 8 and Galatians 5.

Lordship Salvation seeks to place the burden of keeping the Law on the believer, not taking into account their broken condition, the fact that the flesh and spirit are at war with one another, and the fact that spiritual growth takes time.
It overcompensates by decending into legalism and promotes a culture of "they must be unsaved, or they would be obeying God more" by those who have been fooled into believing it.

Basically stated, there is a difference between Puritanism, and the Bible... which is written to those who have believed and loves on one side, and firmly corrects on the other.
For example, chastisement is real.
God's reproofs are real.

But He commands that all believers walk worthy of their calling and election.

You belong to lordship salvation. People have identified your disguise. Read the OP Again.

I think you'd need to actually have a long conversation, whether in type or in person, to determine what Rob believes, Steven.
For now, I also think that you are jumping to conclusions.

Firstly, I suggest that you define "Lordship Salvation".
Next, present what you believe, from Scripture, is actually wrong with it.

 

[Yeshua1]

What are the unbiblical theological inconsistencies in Lordship Salvation (LS)?

Promoters of LS tend to look at other's faults while hiding their own sins in view God's command in Mathew 5:48 and accusing/judging other christians in the name of church discipline.

They tend to excuse their own sins as "unknown".

They seem to believe that it is their sin confessions which enable them to have fellowship with God. Thus they deny the faith in grace given through Christ's atonement which enables them to fellowship with God!

You may post your opinions & the hardships you had faced with the legalists. Lordship Salvationists need not answer.

Apostle John disagrees with you about the need to confess and repent of our sins before God still after saved! Not a LS thing, a bible thing!

 

[Yeshua1]

I'm not sure what you're asking.

Ignoring our own sin while focusing on the sin of others is specifically dealt with in Scripture. When you said excusing sin as unknown, I'm not clear on what that means either.

Of course, if you would provide examples instead of mere accusations, then maybe it would clear things up.

he is still mad that I dared to call out in one of his posts a couple living together in sin who were also in leadership position in local church! I was not able to do that per him, as I was not "perfect as the father is" yet!

 

[Yeshua1]

If you believe there are no grave theological flaws in lordship salvation theory, this thread is not for you. You can keep yourself out.

The main problem that I see in the LS theology would be a confusion and a blending of Justification and sanctification, but the aim to have us accept the Lordship of Jesus over our entire life is commendable!

 

[Yeshua1]

It tends to make grace into works.

It front-loads the Gospel and gives people false assurance in a system that, if followed "religiously", guarantees eternal life based on those works... not on the grace and mercy of God that produces a change in the hearts and minds of the ones He has decided to show that grace and mercy to.

In other words, it takes the believers eyes off the grace and mercy of God through Jesus Christ, and places those eyes on their performance, not His performance on their behalf.

I agree, and I see this:

Church discipline is intended to gently call out the sinful deeds of fellow believers, in an effort to get them to examine themselves to determine whether they be in the faith.
It is intended as exhortation and admonishment that, if one is saved, they should be actively seeking to obey God, not to disobey Him.

It is done with the full knowledge that we are all broken messes, but broken messes indwelt with the Holy Spirit who can and does overcome the deeds of the flesh by His power.
See Romans 8 and Galatians 5.

Lordship Salvation seeks to place the burden of keeping the Law on the believer, not taking into account their broken condition, the fact that the flesh and spirit are at war with one another, and the fact that spiritual growth takes time.
It overcompensates by decending into legalism and promotes a culture of "they must be unsaved, or they would be obeying God more" by those who have been fooled into believing it.

Basically stated, there is a difference between Puritanism, and the Bible... which is written to those who have believed and loves on one side, and firmly corrects on the other.
For example, chastisement is real.
God's reproofs are real.

But He commands that all believers walk worthy of their calling and election.

I think you'd need to actually have a long conversation, whether in type or in person, to determine what Rob believes, Steven.
For now, I also think that you are jumping to conclusions.

Firstly, I suggest that you define "Lordship Salvation".
Next, present what you believe, from Scripture, is actually wrong with it.

I do know that the scriptures teach to us to call in those of us in position of leadership and authority who remain in open sinning though!

 

[Yeshua1]

Romans 10:9: "if you will confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved".

Repent by believing.

And once saved by His grace, continue to confess and repent of the sins The Holy Spirit convicts us over!

 

[Revmitchell]

Resd the OP and reply. If you have no meaningful reply keep yourself out.

We do not have to keep ourselves out. You show up on a board where you do not know anyone and engage is personal attacks only because you do not like their responses. He was right you need to avoid questioning other peoples salvation. My prediction is you will not last long on this board.

 

[Reynolds]

The main problem that I see in the LS theology would be a confusion and a blending of Justification and sanctification, but the aim to have us accept the Lordship of Jesus over our entire life is commendable!

I see the accusation of "blending of justification and sanctification" as a misunderstanding of L.S.

 

[Reynolds]

he is still mad that I dared to call out in one of his posts a couple living together in sin who were also in leadership position in local church! I was not able to do that per him, as I was not "perfect as the father is" yet!

Agreed. The Bible does not say not to call out sin. It says to get the board out of your eye before you worry about the speck in the neighbors eye. As far as I know, you dont have a board in your eye.

 

[Yeshua1]

I see the accusation of "blending of justification and sanctification" as a misunderstanding of L.S.

The "If Jesus is not Lord over all, then He is lord over none" thing!

 

[Yeshua1]

Agreed. The Bible does not say not to call out sin. It says to get the board out of your eye before you worry about the speck in the neighbors eye. As far as I know, you dont have a board in your eye.

we all have sin issues to deal with even as Christians, but if we need to reach a sinless perfection state before can address sinning among leadership in a church?

 

[InTheLight]

Wait and see.