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What did Jesus do? A Biblical case for using the Law in evangelism
- Thread starter evangelist6589
- Start date
You fail to respond to my question, the OP, and the title of the thread.
You simply respond in your typical fashion of hitting dislike and disagree icons. Hmmm, fits your name doesn't it?
Now, demonstrate in the passage (chapter and verse), where Jesus refers to the Law (i.e., Decalogue), specifically, showing Nicodemus that he is a sinner in violation of one of those Ten Commandments.
That is what this thread is all about.
It is not about your rabbit trails and red herrings.
You are wrong. JoJ gave Christ speaking to Nicodemus as an example of evangelizing without using the Law, as have others. There are other examples in the NT as well. Go back and read through this thread. The fact that you have not conceded this point is quite enlightening.
Yeah right, DHK goes off topic. Look at this:
http://www.baptistboard.com/threads...-law-in-evangelism.97706/page-11#post-2199676
Let's try one more time Icon.
I have summarized the OP for you:
Before we dive into what Jesus did lets focus on some other characters in the Bible and examine what they did. Lets first examine John the Baptist and see what he did.
Notice that John did not preach God's love but rather preached the law and the divine wrath of God.
Next lets look at what Peter did. On the day of Pentecost his audience was made up of "devout men." Peter told these men that they were "lawless" and had violated God's law
The apostle Paul also believe in the biblical principle of Law
Next we will look at what Jesus did and how he also used the law in evangelism.
Next the Title of the thread:
What did Jesus do? A Biblical case for using the Law in evangelism
--Now we have the OP, the Title, and the last statement of the OP, which reads:
"We will look at what Jesus did and how he also used the law in evangelism."
In John 3, he didn't use the law in his conversation with Nicodemus did he?
Your hero does it all the time...sorry if it disturbs you. Good post ....if you take time to understand it maybe learning will happen.
60 posts?? A little lazy eh? We are now closing in on 250 posts! Why not just read the thread.
DHK
I use those things available....nothing wrong with that is there?
off topic
Jesus is teaching the teacher what He did not know....pull up a chair and learn from Him.
The thread is not about Nicodemus. His name was not mentioned in the first 3 pages.
You are not looking for an answer. I will answer those who want an answer. You are welcome to hold your error....I will once again let the reader decide.
I have responded to the OP. earlier I answered with the samaritan woman post.....so you are mistaken again.
I use those things available....nothing wrong with that is there?
off topic
Jesus is teaching the teacher what He did not know....pull up a chair and learn from Him.
The thread is not about Nicodemus. His name was not mentioned in the first 3 pages.
You lack the capacity to process this information as I pointed out earlier....so the answers go right past you, but others receive it.
You are not looking for an answer. I will answer those who want an answer. You are welcome to hold your error....I will once again let the reader decide.
You avoid Scripture in the light of the OP.
I gave you Acts 13. You went as far as you could with it and then gave up.
Now we come to John 3. You go as far as you can, and now you must give up here as well. Why?
Because you know you are wrong. The only thing you can resort to now is to hurl insults and use disparaging icons.
You now complain that the conversation between Nicodemus shouldn't be in this thread as if it shouldn't be in the Bible. You can't deal with Scripture. Jesus doesn't use the Law in speaking to Nicodemus just as Paul didn't use the Law in Acts 13. You fail in both cases. You get upset and resort to a string of disagreeable and dumb icons to show your frustration.
Yes, he was a master of Israel. Jesus taught him spiritual truths. No mention is made of the Law.
Read the OP; Read the title.
The thread is about the Law as it relates to evangelism. In John 3 Jesus "is evangelizing" or telling the truth of eternal life to Nicodemus.
More ad hominems--the sign of the inability to debate. I have answered all your objections. You are simply frustrated.
DHK
I have dealt with it early on....
Actually...I offered Acts 13 in post 95......are you allergic to truth? I answered and your response avoided what i raised showing you really are not looking for an answer.
Jn 3 is off topic....I do not see it as evangelism as much as correcting of a false teacher.
I speak honestly DHK......others like it, you do not.
monster strawman alert.....DHK again; reader beware-
Where did I say it "should not be in the bible?" Post where I said this or repent of once again speaking a lying false witness against a believer. I said no such thing. Saying i did is a LIE.
Not with people who do not want an answer.....when you post like this, people no longer read the thread, so you should stop.
Jesus was revealing heavenly truth which Nicodemus could not understand. Looks like you cannot welcome it either.
It has been shown already, others liked it , you do not.
You can say what you like, your comments are void of substance.
yes and I have offered on it several times.
Whatever Nicodemus thought about it was sort of like you and your posts....wrong. Jesus corrected him.
I just speak what i see...you posting falsehoods, disrupting threads, bearing false witness like you did here....Or have you found a post that i made that suggests Jn 3 should not be in the bible???? still waiting for that one.....RoflmaoRedface
Cautious
RoflmaoRoflmaoRoflmao
I have dealt with it early on....
Actually...I offered Acts 13 in post 95......are you allergic to truth? I answered and your response avoided what i raised showing you really are not looking for an answer.
Jn 3 is off topic....I do not see it as evangelism as much as correcting of a false teacher.
i went initially to the samaritan woman, a clear evangelistic section. An explanation was given. many liked it, you did not.
I speak honestly DHK......others like it, you do not.
monster strawman alert.....DHK again; reader beware-
Where did I say it "should not be in the bible?" Post where I said this or repent of once again speaking a lying false witness against a believer. I said no such thing. Saying i did is a LIE.
Not with people who do not want an answer.....when you post like this, people no longer read the thread, so you should stop.
Jesus was revealing heavenly truth which Nicodemus could not understand. Looks like you cannot welcome it either.
It has been shown already, others liked it , you do not.
You can say what you like, your comments are void of substance.
Not at all.....I just comment on what I see.You do not like it, others do.
Do you think as THE TEACHER OF ISRAEL he might have known what the law said? Just a guess that he might have.lol
yes and I have offered on it several times.
Nicodemus is in the covenant already...why would he need to be "evangelized'?
Whatever Nicodemus thought about it was sort of like you and your posts....wrong. Jesus corrected him.
I just speak what i see...you posting falsehoods, disrupting threads, bearing false witness like you did here....Or have you found a post that i made that suggests Jn 3 should not be in the bible???? still waiting for that one.....RoflmaoRedface
CautiousRoflmaoRoflmaoRoflmao
not at all friend.....nice try though.
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Really? Please demonstrate from Acts 13:14-41 where Paul used the law in his sermon to convince his audience that they were sinners.
John 3 is one of the most popular passages used by preachers and evangelists to witness to people. You should know that. It tells people that they "must be born again." Unless one is born again they cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven. That spiritual truth is not just for Nicodemus, but for every one of us.
The fact is that Jesus never used the law.
The conversation continues down through verse 16, probably the most quoted and used verse in the Bible as far as evangelism is concerned, and yet there is still no mention of the Law.
John 3:16 is the gospel in a nutshell. Let me remind you what it says:
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
--And yet you continue to affirm this is irrelevant to this thread.
I haven't checked but I don't remember commenting on John chapter four.
You are responding to your ridiculous overuse of disparaging icons. And you call that speaking honestly??
John chapter three is an integral part of this discussion. Now listen again to what I said:
You keep insisting that it should not be a part of this discussion AS IF it should not be a part of the Bible. Do you understand what I said? I did not lie. If you think I did perhaps you need to study the English language more.
Paul was revealing spiritual truth to the jailer when he said:
"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved."
Paul also revealed spiritual truth in Acts 13:14-41.
Peter revealed Spiritual truth to Cornelius in Acts 10, and also on the Day of Pentecost.
Every person who has ever been witnessed to in the world has had spiritual truth revealed to them.
That is what evangelism is all about--spiritual truth being revealed to the unsaved!!
Again, you have yet to show where Paul used the Law in his sermon in Acts 13:14-41. Not you, not anyone else. You simply gave up and declared yourself right. Typical.
I say what I believe to be true and you still have not refuted it. Here are the facts:
1. Jesus did not use the Law with Nicodemus.
2. Paul did not use the Law in Acts 13:14-41.
--You have not offered one iota of evidence to the contrary. Why do you carry on like this?
That is a red herring; one of you many bunny trails.
The important fact to note is that in the passage Jesus did not refer to the LAW in his conversation with Nicodemus. You might make a case for it when Jesus spoke with the rich young ruler, but not with Nicodemus.
And concerning the OP, you have not demonstrated that either Acts 13 or John 3 have anything to do with the law. You have failed.
Accordingly then so was Ahab and Jezebel? Is that what you mean? What covenant?
But let's look at your belief a little closer.
Nicodemus came to Jesus. He wasn't saved, but an "unbeliever," and needed to be born again.
Nicodemus was also a member of the Sanhedrin, the very group that condemned Christ to be crucified. Had Nicodemus's life been changed, regenerated, at the time of that conversation he would have left the Sanhedrin as Saul did. Becoming a disciple of Christ and staying as a member of the Sanhedrin do not go hand in hand. If he was born again he was a "secret believer," if you believe in such a thing, and his life was not changed one iota. In fact when the Sanhedrin gathered together to condemn Christ, Nicodemus never said a word against it. So was he saved, regenerated? Doesn't sound like it!
The only time that the gospels give any evidence of spiritual life in Nicodemus is AFTER the death of Christ, when Nick and Joseph of Arimathea claim the body of Jesus and then along with some of the women take it to bury it in Joseph's sepulchre. NO, he wasn't a regenerated man. Jesus told him that that was his problem in the first place: "You must be born again."
1. He did not correct him with the law, which is the point of the OP.
2. He did correct him because, though he was a teacher, he had no spiritual life in him.
Ad hominems are not pointing out falsehoods, neither posting disparaging icons.
Even here you are leveling a false accusation against me due to a lack of understanding.
Correct. We who have been saved have been placed in Christ.
No disagreement up to here, mon ami.
The picture the Sabbath painted by God was to show us our rest is in Christ and Christ alone. There is no rest in any other. The Sabbath was a picture of Christ. Just like the animal slain in sacrifice was a picture of Christ. So we have entered into the true Sabbath, Christ, when we our saved. So the Sabbath is given to all believers.
Again, Sabbath means 'rest', and we who are saved have been given Sabbath, 'rest'...
John of Japan I will reply to your posts by the weekend thanks for your patience.
I'm not sure why you are quoting this post here. I disagree with nothing you've said. And I stick to what I said: Jesus did not quote the law (Ezek is not the Law) and He did not quote from the OT. Look in your UBS Greek NT. It puts in boldface all quotes from the OT. There are none in John 3.
The thread is about the moral law specifically, and Jesus did not refer to the moral law in dealing with Nicodemus. Simply because Jesus referred to the OT does not mean He used the moral law in witnessing to Nicodemus.
Again, neither Ezekiel nor the Psalms were called "the Law" by Jews. Numbers is in the Law, true, but 21:9 is not moral law, and that is the subject of the OP.
Wow. I have never in my 60 years of Christian life heard this one. The idea that John 3 is not about salvation, and Nicodemus was already born again, is a completely new one to me. I'm really scratching my head here.
So then, would you say that being "born again" is not about salvation? In particular, how do you handle vv. 14-16 about Jesus being lifted up, and people believing in him receive eternal life? And that bit about being saved in v. 17, and condemned in v. 18, what in the world is that about if not eternal salvation?
I'm curious enough about this that I started a new thread with a poll. Join me there.
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JOJ
Did I say jn3 is not about salvation?
Jesus was correcting the lack of understanding Nicodemus had. Jesus explains how salvation is the work of God, Nicodemus had an Arminian kind of misunderstanding.
Some soul winner had probably given him the Hebrew version of the 4 spiritual flaws.
Scratching your head alot......try selsun blue.
The op is about Jesus using the law in evangelism. ...not about Jesus revealing the work of God in salvation from a heavenly Divine perspective. So this jn 3 posting is off topic.
The enabling work of the Spirit is essential for anyone to get saved. That is why we do not have to try tricks,gospel puppets, clowns, and stories instead of the word preached to get an emotional decision about the facts of the gospel .
Whatever Nicodemus taught.....was confused thinking like you 3 Amigoes. .....as Paul in scripture describes the active obedience of Jesus law keeping on behalf of those He actually died for.
By the way.....Numbers 21......and Numbers 19...are in the OT.
Wait. So John 3 is about salvation but Jesus was not evangelizing? Really? So Nicodemus was already born again even though Jesus told him, "Ye must be born again"?
Thanks, but I use "Head and Shoulders."