I would probably list Christ's death, burial, and Resurrection as The Decisive Act in all of History.
God bless.
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What do Preterists believe about 2 Peter 3
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I would probably list Christ's death, burial, and Resurrection as The Decisive Act in all of History.
God bless.
I can agree with that, was thinking as more in the most decisive event yet to come in history.
...as did they the birth, life, crucifixion, resurrection, ascension, and return of Matthew 21:40-45 (and many others) which ushered in the new heaven and new earth of the new covenant in which we are now new creatures.
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Has to be the Second Coming in order tohave the new Heavens and earth though!
John D. Wright
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If Israel doesn't rule this earth in a millenial reign, why should I believe anything God says. He made that promise to Israel and I personally think he will keep it. Rev 20 is pretty clear that there will be a reign on this earth for 1000 years with Christ as King.
And while I do believe 70AD was God's judgment on the nation of Israel, it was no second coming. Matt 24:29-31 indicates that all the nations of the world will mourn. Is that really true in 70AD? Of course not. He gave us the signs of the coming of the son of man. He told us what to look for so we wouldn't make a mistake. Those signs didn't happen in 70AD.
And while I do believe 70AD was God's judgment on the nation of Israel, it was no second coming. Matt 24:29-31 indicates that all the nations of the world will mourn. Is that really true in 70AD? Of course not. He gave us the signs of the coming of the son of man. He told us what to look for so we wouldn't make a mistake. Those signs didn't happen in 70AD.
Did you see my reply to you - post #19 in the Reigning with Christ during the Millennium thread ?
The HNV has for 24:30
and then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky. Then all the tribes of the eretz will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky with power and great glory.
While not a Greek expert, the Greek is more specific then your "nations of the world" - the word translated "nations" is normally translated "tribes" while the word for "world" id a general word for "land" or even "soil." The HNV is I believe correct as it indicates that it's tribes of the land of Israel who mourn - as they certain did in AD 70.
We have access to Strong's Greek & Hebrew numbering system through the blue letter Bible. I link here a list showing the usage of the word variously translated "tribes" or nations."
The same applies to Rev. 1:7 which is a quote from Mat. 24:30.
As Jesus asserts -
33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. 34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
we should expect the destruction, & the signs he has given in detail to take place before the event - so the Christians can be warned & flee the city before the destruction. History records that they did. It what way was there a visible "coming" of Jesus before the destruction?The question remains, "What about And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. ??"
Obvious we cannot claim a sighting of the Lord Jesus through the clouds in AD 70.
Another problem is the way Jesus quotes the prophecy of Daniel 7 in Mat. 26 -
13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.
64 Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
64 Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
The direction of "coming" in Daniel is up. When Jesus ascended he went up through the clouds. How would his accusers now long dead, see him? I believe they, & the tribes of the land, would see him by the signs of his Kingship. Fully vindicated as the Son of God, the Messiah.
He gave signs to warn the Jerusalem believers when to flee the city. They saw them & fled. The unbelieving Jewish leaders saw the same signs - even witnessing the miracles of Jesus - after his resurrection they made up lies about the empty tomb, rather than believe. He gave them nearly 40 years to repent but they continued to scoff. They had the sign of Jonah explained to them, & continued to scoff.
Which takes us back to 2 Peter 3.
Thank God not everyone is delusional.
Let's rephrase that - Matthew 21:40-45 (and many others) was a coming, as God came to Israel many times, often veiled by clouds, during their history. These "comings" are not Jesus final return for resurrection & judgment, & to establish the NH&NE.
So say you.
The scriptures know of but ONE second Coming, and that will be seen by all, and know by all!
Is the writer of Hebrews referring to two different 'comings' here?:
28 so Christ also, having been once offered to bear the sins of many, shall appear a second time, apart from sin, to them that wait for him, unto salvation. Heb 9
37 For yet a very little while, He that cometh shall come, and shall not tarry. Heb 10
This is one of the key passages that convinced me there could not be comings (plural). Clearly, the first coming was His bearing the sins of many … at Calvary. That necessarily, and textually, leaves only one more coming. What happened at AD70 was either all-encompassing or irrelevant, eschatologically speaking.
...or "For yet a very little while and shall not tarry" is irrelevant, along with a myriad of other explicit time statements.
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