What Do You Believe about Instrumental Music?

[Scripture More Accurately]

Look at this from Aaron:

Music of the Bible

I believe that the lady in that video (I have not had time to look at the video) wrote a book on the same subject that I would like to go through carefully someday.

 

[Scott Downey]

God gave Jesus the book of Revelation to give it to John to reveal to believers what God wants us to know (Rev. 1:1). Revelation shows that harps are central to the worship of God and Jesus in heaven (Rev. 5:8-14; 14:2-3; 15:2-4) so, yes, Jesus has taught us that God the Father must be worshiped with harp music.

Of course, you have ways of explaining those passages such that they supposedly do not reveal anything about the use of musical instruments in heaven so there really is very little common ground that we are going to have on this and many other issues.

Pipes, so instruments blown through such flutes they would have used. Jesus also mentions pipes.
Tabrets, lyres, viols, pipes, organs. Honestly Israel used many musical instruments in celebrational worship.
Anything that was musical and considered pleasant to hear for the time would have been acceptable in worship and played, and really that means musical instruments that are more recently invented (pianos), orchestral instruments, are also ok to be played by men on this earth in celebratory worship.

What Musical Instruments Were Used in Biblical Times? (whatchristianswanttoknow.com)

Isaiah 30:32 And in every place where the grounded staff shall pass, which the Lord shall lay upon him, it shall be with tabrets and harps: and in battles of shaking will he fight with it.

Job 21:12 They take the timbrel and harp, And rejoice at the sound of the organ.

1 Kings 10:12 And the king made of the almug trees pillars for the house of the LORD, and for the king’s house, harps also and psalteries for singers: there came no such almug trees, nor were seen unto this day.

Isaiah 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, And wine, are in their feasts: But they regard not the work of the LORD, Neither consider the operation of his hands.

Isaiah 30:29 Ye shall have a song, as in the night when a holy solemnity is kept; And gladness of heart, as when one goeth with a pipe To come into the mountain of the LORD, to the mighty One of Israel.

1 Kings 1:38–40 So Zadok the priest, and Nathan the prophet, and Benaiah the son of Jehoiada, and the Cherethites, and the Pelethites, went down, and caused Solomon to ride upon king David’s mule, and brought him to Gihon. And Zadok the priest took an horn of oil out of the tabernacle, and anointed Solomon. And they blew the trumpet; and all the people said, God save king Solomon. And all the people came up after him, and the people piped with pipes, and rejoiced with great joy, so that the earth rent with the sound of them.

Matthew 11:17 And saying, We have piped unto you, and ye have not danced; we have mourned unto you, and ye have not lamented.

God is not interested in musical instruments in worship when the people are false, HE says HE wont hear that.

Amos 5:23 Take thou away from me the noise of thy songs; For I will not hear the melody of thy viols.

 

[Yeshua1]

Any Bible to support what you believe?

Whatever you say or do, do it as unto the Lord Jesus!

 

[AustinC]

What makes you think we don't sing "spiritual" songs? And there is nothing prideful about it. Our basic philosophy on the matter is:

Worship is the entertainment of God.​

All musical forms of worship or only your select forms?

 

[AustinC]

1 Corinthians 15:36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die: 37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain: 38 But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.

Divine revelation teaches that God gives to every seed its own body as it has pleased Him. He has made every seed that we sow in the ground exactly in the way that pleases Him.

Because He has made the bodies of even seeds to be pleasing to Him, we know that those seeds are not "neutral" seeds that neither please Him nor displease Him. He made them with bodies as it pleased Him, and even such things that are not used in worship please God because He made them exactly the way that pleased Him.

The belief that "No instrumental music pleases God. It's all neutral--it neither pleases Him nor displeases Him" is a faulty belief that the NT shows to be false. Any instrumental music that God Himself makes or has made is music that itself--regardless of context, setting, use, etc--pleases Him. It is not neutral in the sense that it neither pleases Him nor displeases Him.

Furthermore, the instrumental music itself that God has made pleases Him because He made it!

By this logic, would you agree that God created Frank Zappa and that Fran Zappa's instrumental song "Apostrophe" pleases God, because God made Frank Zappa and thus ordained the song "Apostrophe" to be created?

 

[AustinC]

By the mood it would produce. It would get the audiences' minds off worship & on secular dancing.

How do you know this?
Played in a church, to the glory of God, why would the worshippers minds automatically be on dancing for themselves, not for God?
It seems to me that you are projecting your judgment onto the song due to a cultural experience you either had or assume happened.
Would you applaud Michael's disapproval of David's dancing when the Ark of the Covenant was brought into Jerusalem to the sounds of music, drums and tambourines?

 

[robycop3]

How do you know this?
Played in a church, to the glory of God, why would the worshippers minds automatically be on dancing for themselves, not for God?
It seems to me that you are projecting your judgment onto the song due to a cultural experience you either had or assume happened.
Would you applaud Michael's disapproval of David's dancing when the Ark of the Covenant was brought into Jerusalem to the sounds of music, drums and tambourines?

I believe you meant "Michel", not "Michael".

Being Saul's daughter, she didn't likely appreciate the ark's importance at that time. But her main gripe was David's dancing so hard that his privates were exposed. (Remember mens' garb in that time/place.) As for MY approval, Dave was expressing his joy that the ark was being returned to Israel.

 

[Hark]

It seems that Christians may have several different beliefs about instrumental music.

Some may believe that all instrumental music pleases God.

Some may believe that no instrumental music pleases God--it is neutral in the sense that it neither pleases Him nor displeases Him.

Some may believe that some instrumental music pleases God and the rest does not please Him.

Some may believe that some instrumental music pleases God, some does not, and the rest neither pleases Him nor displeases Him--it is neutral.

What do you believe about instrumental music?

2 Samuel 6:5 And David and all the house of Israel played before the Lord on all manner of instruments made of fir wood, even on harps, and on psalteries, and on timbrels, and on cornets, and on cymbals. KJV

1 Chronicles 13:8And David and all Israel played before God with all their might, and with singing, and with harps, and with psalteries, and with timbrels, and with cymbals, and with trumpets. KJV

There will be harps in Heaven as I believe these references seem to testify of below.

Revelation 5:8 And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints. KJV

Revelation 14:2And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps: KJV

Revelation 15:2And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God. KJV

It's how you play the instruments because they have to be played as unto the Lord in seeking the glory of the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, in order to honor & glorify God the Father by in Heaven.

John 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: 23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him. KJV

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

All musical forms of worship or only your select forms?

Please expand on your question.

 

[Scripture More Accurately]

By this logic, would you agree that God created Frank Zappa and that Fran Zappa's instrumental song "Apostrophe" pleases God, because God made Frank Zappa and thus ordained the song "Apostrophe" to be created?

The passage that I quoted and explained was about seeds, not humans. Humans are not like seeds because God created humans with free will. Many choose to be evil and do evil, including musicians who produce instrumental music that does not please God.

Ecclesiastes 7:29 Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.

Romans 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, 30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents

 

[Salty]

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This thread will be closed at 1130 pm EST/ 830 pm PST

 

[Scripture More Accurately]

I believe you meant "Michel", not "Michael".

Being Saul's daughter, she didn't likely appreciate the ark's importance at that time. But her main gripe was David's dancing so hard that his privates were exposed. (Remember mens' garb in that time/place.) As for MY approval, Dave was expressing his joy that the ark was being returned to Israel.

I do not believe that his privates were exposed, but after looking at the passages further I can see why some might think that they were.

 

[Scripture More Accurately]

Job 21:12 They take the timbrel and harp, And rejoice at the sound of the organ.

Isaiah 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, And wine, are in their feasts: But they regard not the work of the LORD, Neither consider the operation of his hands.

God is not interested in musical instruments in worship when the people are false, HE says HE wont hear that.

Amos 5:23 Take thou away from me the noise of thy songs; For I will not hear the melody of thy viols.

In context, Job 21:12 is a statement about the musical activities of wicked people:

Job 21:7 Wherefore do the wicked live, become old, yea, are mighty in power? 8 Their seed is established in their sight with them, and their offspring before their eyes. 9 Their houses are safe from fear, neither is the rod of God upon them. 10 Their bull gendereth, and faileth not; their cow calveth, and casteth not her calf. 11 They send forth their little ones like a flock, and their children dance. 12 They take the timbrel and harp, and rejoice at the sound of the organ.

Similarly, Isaiah 5:12 is about what evil people were doing:

Isaiah 5:11 Woe unto them that rise up early in the morning, that they may follow strong drink; that continue until night, till wine inflame them! 12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD, neither consider the operation of his hands.

 

[Scott Downey]

In context, Job 21:12 is a statement about the musical activities of wicked people:

Job 21:7 Wherefore do the wicked live, become old, yea, are mighty in power? 8 Their seed is established in their sight with them, and their offspring before their eyes. 9 Their houses are safe from fear, neither is the rod of God upon them. 10 Their bull gendereth, and faileth not; their cow calveth, and casteth not her calf. 11 They send forth their little ones like a flock, and their children dance. 12 They take the timbrel and harp, and rejoice at the sound of the organ.

Similarly, Isaiah 5:12 is about what evil people were doing:

Isaiah 5:11 Woe unto them that rise up early in the morning, that they may follow strong drink; that continue until night, till wine inflame them! 12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD, neither consider the operation of his hands.

yes, some verses simply show what musical instruments they had. BUT as you can see, it all depends on what the person is doing with the instrument, because a harp, tabret, pipes are also mentioned being used by the wicked and by the righteous.

 

[Scripture More Accurately]

yes, some verses simply show what musical instruments they had. BUT as you can see, it all depends on what the person is doing with the instrument, because a harp, tabret, pipes are also mentioned being used by the wicked and by the righteous.

Yes, I have never asserted that any instruments themselves are ungodly, etc.

 

[AustinC]

Please expand on your question.

How can I expand on all?

 

[Squire Robertsson]

How can I expand on all?

Then I'll expand on what I've read of your comments. From what I've read, you seemto hold that if a congregation is not using CCM it is not singing spiritual music.

 

[AustinC]

Then I'll expand on what I've read of your comments. From what I've read, you seemto hold that if a congregation is not using CCM it is not singing spiritual music.

Not at all. I love many, many hymns. The key, for me, is the teaching in the song. For example, "I Come to the Garden" is a song with almost no teaching and relies entirely upon emotion. I find no need to sing that song. But I will openly joy in "What Ere My God Ordains Is Right" due to its deep teaching of God's grace. I find joy in nearly all musical genres as I listen to God's children give Him glory. I listen to Propaganda's (Christian Hip Hop/Spoken word artist) song GOSPEL and I rejoice in the truth being spoken. Then turn on Handel's Messiah and be lead through the scriptures. They are all great blessings from God and I embrace them all. I also rejoice in how God uses even the unredeemed musical geniuses to reveal creative music that points me toward a God who graciously blesses even those who are damned by unrepentant sin.

Hopefully that answers your question. If you ever want to go listen to a southern gospel quartet, let me know! [emoji56]

 

[Salty]

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