What is Habitual Sin?

[saturneptune]

Habitual Sin. As Judith points out, the term is not defined in the Bible. But I think it's fairly safe to go with the common meaning of the words; sin which is '...done regularly or repeatedly'. The sins to which we continue to return.

When God accepts a sinner and forgives the sinner's sin, He forgives them all. Never forget, God exists in Eternity and isn't bound by human experience and 'time'. So ALL sins are forgiven - past, present and future. Which is NOT to say that God just mutters "Kids will be kids" and ignore our wrongdoing.

When I was a child, my late, honored Lady Mother would tell me - at times - "I will slap the sass right out of your mouth!" On a few occasions, she demonstrated the ability. (Don't get this wrong, she wasn't brutal, but I confess to not appreciating the function.)

So it is with our lives. God reserves the right to 'chastise' us, as Scripture so quaintly words it. The fact is, God has slapped the sass right out of my mouth on occasion. But always to get my attention so I focus on avoiding those temptations which so easily beset me. So I not resist His work in making me into who and what I should be, in His will. Happily, God has no limits on His love or patience.

I suppose there are few occasions where a believer simply will not get with God's program. I have known one or two people who were believers, but were not in fellowship with God - by their own words; not my judgement. They were fairly quiet and rather sad men. Much like they were sent to their room, due to their rebellious nature. Were they saved? Not my place to judge the matter. Based on what I know of Scripture, an argument could be made either way. But God knows and will ultimately decide. As Sergeant Tyree said, "That ain't my department".


Homosexuality. Contrary to popular belief, homosexuality is NOT a special case sin. It is a sin much like all others; it is the rebellion of the individual against the directions of God. One notes in the passages where homosexuality is mentioned, it is included in a list of other sins, including "... sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, [homosexuals,] thieves, the greedy, drunkards, the verbally abusive, and swindlers..." (This list abstracted from 1 Corinthians 6:9-10).

By the way, the 'verbally abusive' are those who say mean things about others. Gossips. The sin of 'gossiping' is on a level with the sin of 'homosexuality'. Therefore, if 'homosexuals' - based on past or present conduct - cannot be accepted into the Kingdom, then neither can gossips.

Then Paul goes on to say (in the passage above) "Some of you once lived this way" referring to the recipients of the letter of 1 Corinthians. So the fact of past sin does not disqualify anyone from future grace. (For which I am really quite grateful. Just trust me on that.)

Paul then says "...you were washed, ...sanctified, ...justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God."

So the guilt of sin is gone. Temporal consequences remain. Alienation from God remains if we choose to ignore His directions. But if we even slightly attempt to follow God, He starts fixing things.

Good post. IMO, gossip is one of the most destructive sins on the list to a local church for two reasons. One is that we over the years have not seen fit to put it on our man made created pedestal of sins. The second reason is where this is a local gossip (which most all churches have at least one) the issue is never addressed by the local church as some of the other sins on the list are. Not taking up for the other sins, but a gossip can in a matter of minutes destroy a unified, loving spirit in a church, and destroy reputations that men and women spent years building. Even when the story proves to be untrue, the fact that is was brought up will always linger in the mind of folks who heard it.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Habitual Sin ... /// ... starts fixing things.

Archie, start to finish, that was an outstanding post! Thanks for sharing that. :thumbsup:

By the way, Hastings is on the fringes of the Heartland, whereas I actually live in the "heart" of the Heartland! :laugh:

 

[Yeshua1]

Habitual Sin. As Judith points out, the term is not defined in the Bible. But I think it's fairly safe to go with the common meaning of the words; sin which is '...done regularly or repeatedly'. The sins to which we continue to return.

When God accepts a sinner and forgives the sinner's sin, He forgives them all. Never forget, God exists in Eternity and isn't bound by human experience and 'time'. So ALL sins are forgiven - past, present and future. Which is NOT to say that God just mutters "Kids will be kids" and ignore our wrongdoing.

When I was a child, my late, honored Lady Mother would tell me - at times - "I will slap the sass right out of your mouth!" On a few occasions, she demonstrated the ability. (Don't get this wrong, she wasn't brutal, but I confess to not appreciating the function.)

So it is with our lives. God reserves the right to 'chastise' us, as Scripture so quaintly words it. The fact is, God has slapped the sass right out of my mouth on occasion. But always to get my attention so I focus on avoiding those temptations which so easily beset me. So I not resist His work in making me into who and what I should be, in His will. Happily, God has no limits on His love or patience.

I suppose there are few occasions where a believer simply will not get with God's program. I have known one or two people who were believers, but were not in fellowship with God - by their own words; not my judgement. They were fairly quiet and rather sad men. Much like they were sent to their room, due to their rebellious nature. Were they saved? Not my place to judge the matter. Based on what I know of Scripture, an argument could be made either way. But God knows and will ultimately decide. As Sergeant Tyree said, "That ain't my department".


Homosexuality. Contrary to popular belief, homosexuality is NOT a special case sin. It is a sin much like all others; it is the rebellion of the individual against the directions of God. One notes in the passages where homosexuality is mentioned, it is included in a list of other sins, including "... sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, [homosexuals,] thieves, the greedy, drunkards, the verbally abusive, and swindlers..." (This list abstracted from 1 Corinthians 6:9-10).

By the way, the 'verbally abusive' are those who say mean things about others. Gossips. The sin of 'gossiping' is on a level with the sin of 'homosexuality'. Therefore, if 'homosexuals' - based on past or present conduct - cannot be accepted into the Kingdom, then neither can gossips.

Then Paul goes on to say (in the passage above) "Some of you once lived this way" referring to the recipients of the letter of 1 Corinthians. So the fact of past sin does not disqualify anyone from future grace. (For which I am really quite grateful. Just trust me on that.)

Paul then says "...you were washed, ...sanctified, ...justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God."

So the guilt of sin is gone. Temporal consequences remain. Alienation from God remains if we choose to ignore His directions. But if we even slightly attempt to follow God, He starts fixing things.

NOT saying that Homosexual sinful practices are worse than muder/rapr etc, but that those engaging in still doing those acts, even in church among professing saved, seem to want to ahve it viewed as NOT practicing sin, just another acceptable alternate lifestyle!

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

NOT saying that Homosexual sinful practices are worse than muder/rapr etc, but that those engaging in still doing those acts, even in church among professing saved, seem to want to ahve it viewed as NOT practicing sin, just another acceptable alternate lifestyle!

How is that different from the adulterer who hides his/her sin and hopes it doesn't become common knowledge? They are no less in denial of their sin when they pretend not to be in that sin than the gay person is in demanding acceptance of his/her sin. In either case, the sinner doesn't want to acknowledge sin as sin.

 

[Yeshua1]

How is that different from the adulterer who hides his/her sin and hopes it doesn't become common knowledge? They are no less in denial of their sin when they pretend not to be in that sin than the gay person is in demanding acceptance of his/her sin. In either case, the sinner doesn't want to acknowledge sin as sin.

the BIG difference is that the murderers/adulterers do NOT have a lobby with agenda being pushed to make their behaviour acceptable before God, as now "savd and gay!"

And i am referencing those claiming saved by Jesus, NOT sinners still lost claiming to do it!

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

the BIG difference is that the murderers/adulterers do NOT have a lobby with agenda being pushed to make their behaviour acceptable before God, as now "savd and gay!"

In the end, it doesn't matter how many organizations, banners, marches, agendas, etc., the sinners have, it comes down to the individual and his/her God. Therefore my point is, there is no difference. Both are denying their sin, despite the Holy Spirit living within them screaming at them about it.

And i am referencing those claiming saved by Jesus, NOT sinners still lost claiming to do it!

Obviously, so am I.

 

[Yeshua1]

In the end, it doesn't matter how many organizations, banners, marches, agendas, etc., the sinners have, it comes down to the individual and his/her God. Therefore my point is, there is no difference. Both are denying their sin, despite the Holy Spirit living within them screaming at them about it.Obviously, so am I.

So you would agree that no practicing homosexual who has no remorse/desire/conviction to ever stop doing that behaviour shows themselves as not being saved, no matter what their profession is?

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

So you would agree that no practicing homosexual who has no remorse/desire/conviction to ever stop doing that behaviour shows themselves as not being saved, no matter what their profession is?

No I would not. As I've told others on this board, habitual sin is not a sign of a lack of saving faith. It is a stronghold that needs to be pulled down by surrender to the power of the living God. That includes homosexual sin, as I do not believe it is any more heinous than any other sin, in the eyes of God. It is we who make it more than it is. Certainly it is serious, as is adultery, lying, theft, addiction, sexual assault or murder. But nothing makes it "worse" than any other sin, and any Christian is just as capable of committing one of those sins as he/she is of any other.

 

[righteousdude2]

My Point!

Not that I am making an EXCEPTION about homosexuals being worse than other sexual sins! It is a sin, PERIOD! End of discussion!

The only problem is, at the present time, homosexuals are asking for their sin to be accepted and APPROVED by OUR society and government! With that approval and acceptance, and I say this because on several other boards and forums I have heard this from the mouths [minds and hearts too] of gays, that the governments acceptance and approval of gay marriage, and being gay, means Christians must accept them as they are too.

My argument is simply this....just because the government says gays can serve in the military or be married, or have rights to come out and not be held accountable to their society; does not mean that their life style or actions are STILL not a sin in the eye of God, or according to Scripture!

Government or social approval DOES not whitewash this as a sin. It is still a sin, that needs to be confessed and repented from and left behind if in fact they want to have a relationship and stand, side-by-side with us as born-again!

I was guilty of fornication and adultery, for years. I did not ask the government or society to accept my perverted being! I did not seek to make my sin accepted and approved, in order to tell the world and especially the church, that, NOW they can no longer judge me or say that my actions will send me to hell!

I had to be cognizant and receptive of the conviction of the Holy Ghost; to realize I was a sinner; to ask him to forgive me; to come to him as a sinner in need of forgiveness; and leave my old ways and sins behind! I had to leave those perverted life styles behind me, and no longer practice them, or proudly boast that I am a perverted believer, approved by the federal government and accepted by society! And social, lawful acceptance did not EQUAL approval and acceptance by the true church of God. And for sure, it did not mean the church could no longer tell me that I had to own up to my perversions and start a life with God as the head, and leave those sins behind; IF I EXPECTED TO BE BORN-AGAIN AND FOLLOW HIM...

Like the prostitute, Jesus told me to, "Go and sin no more!"

I do not come to you on this board and say, I am a fornicator, adulterer! No, I come to you and say I am a sinner, set free, and washed by the blood of Jesus! I was not proud, and I didn't come out and say accept me, accept my sins!

I was guilty of some heavy physical and emotional sin. I had joined my body and soul to the flesh of a ton of others, and I was not proud of that life! I was wretched, and embarrassed, and definitely NOT proud. At least not proud enough to label myself as a fornicator/adulterer Christian!

No! I am born-again, and my sins are as far from my new life as the East is from the West!

That is the difference! The gays that I come across claim to be gay and born-again! Thus, I am not going to permit the devil to pervert the born-again life and label of follower of Jesus, by debasing the meaning of what it took Jesus to do in order to bring me back to the Father!

I am not out to judge those who have been delivered from the gay life's style. I am only here to make sure that anyone delivered from the sin that held them captive, a slave, knows that they are now free, and no longer a slave to, or under the ownership of the master of the sin that once made them bow to that master.

I am only attempting to make sure that those who once lived in a sin, know that they no longer have to be under that label. They are no longer a bondservant to homosexuality, but rather a bondservant to Jesus, and that is where, if anything, they should be boasting about the cross, not the sinful life they once called their way of life!!! Like Paul so boldly proclaims in Galatians 6:14, "As for me, may I never boast about anything except the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ. Because of that cross, my interest in this world has been crucified, and the world's interest in me has also died" (NLT).

So, it is not that I hold homosexuality in a realm of sin that is any worse than let's say, swearing, drunkenness, or gossiping. It is just that I think the church needs to make sure that born-again believers know that they are no longer the property of homosexuality, fornication, adultery, gossip, anger, cussing, drinking, etc., but rather the PROPERTY of him, who created us, and bought us back from the master of sin, with the precious blood of Jesus, his only son!

Yea! If I am to proclaim a label in this new life.....if I am to boast of anything regarding my salvation.....let it be in the "Cross of Jesus" which delievered me from self destruction and into a new life in the flesh that will result in a new, and everlasting life in the spirit, and in the Kingdom that is to come! :applause::applause::applause:

 

[saturneptune]

Pastor Paul,
This is the way I look at the same sex issue, from relationships to marriage. I too acknowledge that in the eyes of God, sin is sin, so the homosexual stands guilty before the Lord just like the gossip. Here to me is the difference. Before being saved, it was easy to enjoy other sins such as drinking to excess, relationships with women, drugs, excessive spending of money, cheating on exams, etc, the list could go on forever. The one sin that was disgusting to me as a lost person like it is as a child of God, no difference. The way I was wired, I have no desire to wake up to a hairy chest and a pot belly, among other thing that are TMI.

Also, your point is well taken about being proud of the sin. It is one thing to sin and keep it hidden or be ashamed of it. It is quite another to take this particular sin, not only make it normal, but make it the official law of the land and advertise how proud we are of it. It goes beyond sinning. To me, it is like rubbing the Lord's nose in the sin. What other sin is made a spectacle of that way that one is. If I cheat on my wife, I am going to do things to hide the fact like have a secret bank account to pay for the motel rooms. I am not going to lobby Congress to pass a law to approve of my actions, then organize a parade to celebrate it. That could be said of any other sin besides this one.

I realize you are on Pacific time and me on central time, but brother, I am beginning to think you are as big of an insomniac as I am.

 

[righteousdude2]

Amen!!!!

Pastor Paul,
This is the way I look at the same sex issue, from relationships to marriage. I too acknowledge that in the eyes of God, sin is sin, so the homosexual stands guilty before the Lord just like the gossip. Here to me is the difference. Before being saved, it was easy to enjoy other sins such as drinking to excess, relationships with women, drugs, excessive spending of money, cheating on exams, etc, the list could go on forever. The one sin that was disgusting to me as a lost person like it is as a child of God, no difference. The way I was wired, I have no desire to wake up to a hairy chest and a pot belly, among other thing that are TMI.

Also, your point is well taken about being proud of the sin. It is one thing to sin and keep it hidden or be ashamed of it. It is quite another to take this particular sin, not only make it normal, but make it the official law of the land and advertise how proud we are of it. It goes beyond sinning. To me, it is like rubbing the Lord's nose in the sin. What other sin is made a spectacle of that way that one is. If I cheat on my wife, I am going to do things to hide the fact like have a secret bank account to pay for the motel rooms. I am not going to lobby Congress to pass a law to approve of my actions, then organize a parade to celebrate it. That could be said of any other sin besides this one.

I realize you are on Pacific time and me on central time, but brother, I am beginning to think you are as big of an insomniac as I am.

I never get to bed until this time of day! Because of the growing pain I have from neuropathy, I am lucky if I get to sleep by 7 am! My wife and I have traded the normal day of life, for a permanent graveyard shift, so to speak!

We see eye-to-eye on the issue of homosexuality and sin! I loved what you said. It is right on! :thumbs:

 

[Yeshua1]

No I would not. As I've told others on this board, habitual sin is not a sign of a lack of saving faith. It is a stronghold that needs to be pulled down by surrender to the power of the living God. That includes homosexual sin, as I do not believe it is any more heinous than any other sin, in the eyes of God. It is we who make it more than it is. Certainly it is serious, as is adultery, lying, theft, addiction, sexual assault or murder. But nothing makes it "worse" than any other sin, and any Christian is just as capable of committing one of those sins as he/she is of any other.

So you would not agree with the Apostles john and paul that if a sinner has been saved now by grace of god, and has a new nature and the holy spirit within them, they would have new desires and leadings to NOT keep on fdoing those old sinful practices now?

I think that we can still have besitting sins, areas where still very tempted, and can fall if we do not fortify ourselves, but even when/if sin in thoseareas, still have conviction and desire to do tight and confess/repent before God...

I am talking about a gay person, professing salvation now, yet still keeps on doingandpracticing their sexual acts, without any remorse/conviction/repenting, just 'God approves.made me this way" How can that person really have been saved? isn'r that a false confession?

 

[Archie the Preacher]

So you would not agree with the Apostles john and paul that if a sinner has been saved now by grace of god, and has a new nature and the holy spirit within them, they would have new desires and leadings to NOT keep on fdoing those old sinful practices now?

And you seem to think all this happens instantly?

How about this? Tell all the people who talk behind other people's backs that they are NOT showing any regeneration by the Holy Spirit and tell them to get out of your church, because obviously they are not 'really' surrendered to God.

Forget about homosexuals for a week and just concentrate on gossips. Tell me how that works.

 

[Winman]

Habitual sin is when it doesn't bother you anymore.

 

[Archie the Preacher]

Ouch!

Habitual sin is when it doesn't bother you anymore.

Winman, that's a scary thought. And far too close to home.

 

[righteousdude2]

That..............

Habitual sin is when it doesn't bother you anymore.

Was fabulous! :wavey:

 

[Yeshua1]

And you seem to think all this happens instantly?

How about this? Tell all the people who talk behind other people's backs that they are NOT showing any regeneration by the Holy Spirit and tell them to get out of your church, because obviously they are not 'really' surrendered to God.

Forget about homosexuals for a week and just concentrate on gossips. Tell me how that works.

We do tell people that just professing jesus saved you is not valid, unless accomopanied by fruit!

Again, NOT saying no Homosexual can get saved by grace of God, but once saved, do you tell them its OK to still stay in that lifestyle, since God now accepts them 'just as they are?"

Its like what my pastor has said, that the lord saves you just as you are, but not to stay as you are!

 

[Archie the Preacher]

Yeshua -

Its like what my pastor has said, that the lord saves you just as you are, but not to stay as you are!

Okay, I'll go along with that. There is a difference between 'besetting' sin and 'clinging to' sin.

I would also point out that 'fruit of the Spirit' may or may not be obvious to others. Some 'fruits' are blindingly obvious, and some not as clear.

However, I must say I've seen far too many Christians - who I am sure are decent people and have a relationship with Jesus - who seem to notice sins like 'homosexuality' and 'abortion' far more often and far more serious than other sins like backbiting, malice, gluttony (which is far too close to home for me) and silent greed.

For the record, I do recognize you as a Christian brother with no reserves. We may disagree on some issues, but that's because we are faulty creatures. I pray we can disagree with Christian love and the intent to find the full truth.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

I would also point out that 'fruit of the Spirit' may or may not be obvious to others. Some 'fruits' are blindingly obvious, and some not as clear.

The evidences thereof, yes. But Galatians 5:22, 23 speaks of the "fruit" of the Spirit -- singular. That means, I believe, that any evidence of any one aspect of the fruit is evidence of them all, though the progress of sanctification in some may not make all those aspects obvious.

However, I must say I've seen far too many Christians - who I am sure are decent people and have a relationship with Jesus - who seem to notice sins like 'homosexuality' and 'abortion' far more often and far more serious than other sins like backbiting, malice, gluttony (which is far too close to home for me) and silent greed.

Quite right. Often that "noticing" of others' sin is at the expense of overlooking their own.

For the record, I do recognize you as a Christian brother with no reserves. We may disagree on some issues, but that's because we are faulty creatures. I pray we can disagree with Christian love and the intent to find the full truth.

I can second that. And we can all do better in viewing one another as brothers, rather than adversaries. Seems many on this board want to see most as the latter. God bless, Archie. I do enjoy reading your posts. :thumbsup:

 

[Yeshua1]

The evidences thereof, yes. But Galatians 5:22, 23 speaks of the "fruit" of the Spirit -- singular. That means, I believe, that any evidence of any one aspect of the fruit is evidence of them all, though the progress of sanctification in some may not make all those aspects obvious.Quite right. Often that "noticing" of others' sin is at the expense of overlooking their own.I can second that. And we can all do better in viewing one another as brothers, rather than adversaries. Seems many on this board want to see most as the latter. God bless, Archie. I do enjoy reading your posts. :thumbsup:

i see both of you as being my brothers in Christ, its just what to make sure the Church deos not adopt a cultural, not biblcal view, on the issue of homosexuality!