What is Sin?

[steaver]

...then using the etymology of the phrase, we must also be in Christ through no cause of our own as well. If we need nothing to be in Adam, we need nothing to be in Christ. I think we both agree that faith is necessary, so your conclusion cannot be the case.

We had no choice to be in Adam, just as you had no choice to be born. We are given a choice to be in Christ.

You start with a false presuppostion...that if I take Scripture at face value, I am placing God in a "box of reasonings".

That isn't a false presupposition, that is a fact. Your premise is that God has given us absolutely everything there is to know in His written word, do you have scripture to back this up?

Scripture states emphatically spiritually dead people NEED faith in Christ to be justified. That is immutable truth...a fact.

Amen! And even the faith you have has been given you by the grace of God. You simply said "yes, I will have you as my Lord".

I do believe it is impossible for God to speak to a baby in the womb for the simple notion we know how we receive information from Scripture...faith comes by hearing (understanding) and that through the Word of God. Hearing / understanding require the ability and mental capacity to do so. It is spiritual science fiction to claim a fetus can exhibit faith without a fully developed mind needed to understand something.

So it is impossible because God has said that He uses humans to preach His word? So when God says it is appointed once for man to die, then all must die at least once? Thus it is impossible for any men not to die once?


:jesus:

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Steaver: We are given a choice to be in Christ.

HP: Explain to us again your position on election and then preach to us once more on the ‘choice' you say we make.

 

[steaver]

It is spiritual science fiction to claim a fetus can exhibit faith without a fully developed mind needed to understand something.

How do you think we will speak with Jesus shortly after death without our minds and mouths and ears?

:jesus:

 

[JSM17]

Sin is depected for us in scripture as an action of choice. Its lusting and desiring something that God has deemed contrary to His good purpose and will.

It would seem that everything that man does will fall short of the perfection of God. God obviously knew that this would be a case of impossiblities on man's part, that is to live up to His perfection.

James declares for us that sin is something concieved in the mind and works its way to an action, which leads to sin.

James 1:13Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone.

14But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust.

15Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.

It is temptation played out in our lives when we submit to its lusts.
carried away and enticed to lust giving birth to sin.

This scripture declares for us that sin can also be defined as something that we do when we are carried away and enticed springing forth lust, which when continued gives BIRTH to sin.

Sin began with Adam in a human aspect and continues today when we allow lust to fester into sin by making the choice to do so.

Of course this is merely one scripture among many that define sin for us.

 

[webdog]

Sin is depected for us in scripture as an action of choice. Its lusting and desiring something that God has deemed contrary to His good purpose and will.

It would seem that everything that man does will fall short of the perfection of God. God obviously knew that this would be a case of impossiblities on man's part, that is to live up to His perfection.

James declares for us that sin is something concieved in the mind and works its way to an action, which leads to sin.

James 1:13Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone.

14But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust.

15Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.

It is temptation played out in our lives when we submit to its lusts.
carried away and enticed to lust giving birth to sin.

This scripture declares for us that sin can also be defined as something that we do when we are carried away and enticed springing forth lust, which when continued gives BIRTH to sin.

Sin began with Adam in a human aspect and continues today when we allow lust to fester into sin by making the choice to do so.

Of course this is merely one scripture among many that define sin for us.

Well said :thumbs:

 

[David Michael Harris]

You say God can bestow grace on who He wants to...can He bestow salvation on those apart from faith?

I can see how the yes answer can cause problems here. But because God is Sovereign, I say yes. I need to study the work of Christ more. Are you saying that something is impossible for ( positive ) God? Is God's arm short? I may not understand fully God's power in Christ. God's grace is His grace.

 

[David Michael Harris]

Yes, I know it is impossible for God to sin.

 

[webdog]

We had no choice to be in Adam, just as you had no choice to be born. We are given a choice to be in Christ.

The wording of the Scripture in question does not allow for that interpretation. "...so as..." connects the two where the action must be the same.

That isn't a false presupposition, that is a fact. Your premise is that God has given us absolutely everything there is to know in His written word, do you have scripture to back this up?

Many...God's creation (Romans 1), the desire to live forever (Ecc. 3:11) and our conscience which is God's law written on our hearts. Acts 17:26-27 plainly states each one of us has been put into the perfect location and place in time to seek Him and PERHAPS reach out for Him and find Him though He is not far from EACH ONE of us.

Amen! And even the faith you have has been given you by the grace of God. You simply said "yes, I will have you as my Lord".

...in the reformed model faith is a gift, but that is yet another presupposition not supported by Scripture.

So it is impossible because God has said that He uses humans to preach His word? So when God says it is appointed once for man to die, then all must die at least once? Thus it is impossible for any men not to die once?

JSM17 explained it quite well why it is impossible.

 

[webdog]

I can see how the yes answer can cause problems here. But because God is Sovereign, I say yes. I need to study the work of Christ more. Are you saying that something is impossible for ( positive ) God? Is God's arm short? I may not understand fully God's power in Christ. God's grace is His grace.

God has decreed that faith is required...yet you state He can save someone apart from faith. Can God go against Himself?

 

[David Michael Harris]

God has decreed that faith is required...yet you state He can save someone apart from faith. Can God go against Himself?

No comment. At this time.

If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask God, who gives generously to all without reproach, and it will be given him.
Letter of James 1:5 ESV

 

[webdog]

No comment. At this time.

If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask God, who gives generously to all without reproach, and it will be given him.
Letter of James 1:5 ESV

:laugh: That was great...I think that is the first time someone on the BB has pleaded the 5th

 

[David Michael Harris]

:laugh: That was great...I think that is the first time someone on the BB has pleaded the 5th

But it is were I am at on the discussion.

God bless.

David

 

[Johnv]

I was out of town for the weekend, and was surprised when I got back to this thread. How did we go from "What is Sin" to "Do fetuses excercise faith". I've seen some amusing tangents before, but that one takes the cake...

 

[David Michael Harris]

I was out of town for the weekend, and was surprised when I got back to this thread. How did we go from "What is Sin" to "Do fetuses excercise faith". I've seen some amusing tangents before, but that one takes the cake...

It's the beauty of internet forums. I think they are great. The knack is to endeavour to always be gracious on them.

 

[Johnv]

Yep, gotta love it! Well, at least we can all enjoy some cake in the mean time :wavey:

 

[steaver]

The wording of the Scripture in question does not allow for that interpretation. "...so as..." connects the two where the action must be the same.
.

It most certainly does. You must read the full context of the passage and then take it all in.

Beginning with verse 12 the word of God lays out the facts that it is because of Adam's one original sin that ALL mankind is condemned with the curse of sin.

Here is the verse that "forces" the interpretation given in scripture that I must agree with since it is scripture. Remember, scripture interprets scripture.

Verse 17 clarifies for us who it is that Christ has made alive...

"For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ".

Many...God's creation (Romans 1), the desire to live forever (Ecc. 3:11) and our conscience which is God's law written on our hearts. Acts 17:26-27 plainly states each one of us has been put into the perfect location and place in time to seek Him and PERHAPS reach out for Him and find Him though He is not far from EACH ONE of us.

Sorry, these scriptures do not prove God has shared with us all of His ways. In fact, although God has shared many things with us and everything we need to live for Him, scripture tells us His ways are much higher than our ways and one cannot find them all out.

Romans 11:33
O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

And you forgot to answer a question;

How does one communicate with Jesus in heaven after they die and leave their body, brain, ears and mouth behind?

:jesus:

 

[webdog]

How does one communicate with Jesus in heaven after they die and leave their body, brain, ears and mouth behind?

You start with a false presupposition we will not have those in Heaven. I believe we will have some sort of intermediate body in Heaven until the resurrection. How were those in John's vision in Revelation able to ask questions, receive answers and know what was happening here without those? John made no mention of disembodied spirits in Revelation, and did not mention anything out of the ordinary when describing them.

 

[steaver]

You start with a false presupposition we will not have those in Heaven. I believe we will have some sort of intermediate body in Heaven until the resurrection. How were those in John's vision in Revelation able to ask questions, receive answers and know what was happening here without those? John made no mention of disembodied spirits in Revelation, and did not mention anything out of the ordinary when describing them.

Brother, can you explain this verse;

Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:



Can a deaf mute experience Romans 8:16?

:jesus:

 

[steaver]

Bump

:jesus:

 

[webdog]

Brother, can you explain this verse;

Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:



Can a deaf mute experience Romans 8:16?

:jesus:

If a deaf mute has accepted Christ (since that is the context of the passage), yes.