What is the OFFICIAL Sda Views On Gospel And Ellen White?

[bluejx]

And,.... It's actually called a stall mate.

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[bluejx]

No, rather that nothing we can do here while alive will be able to undo what Christ did for us while upon the Cross, nor be able to undo the sealing of the Holy Spirit!

Do you have Scripture for that?

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[BobRyan]

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

Romans 11
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. 22 Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.?

t'

Yeshua1 said: ↑
The if condition in Romans has the assumed meaning of that you will indeed keep on in the faith, as in since saved by faith, you will continue...
Matthew passage has nothing to do with loss of eternal life!

Depends on how much of it you need to ignore to say that "anyway"

you appear to claim to imagine that the forgiveness-revoked saints of Matthew 18 go to hell pay their own full debt of sin - then get eternal life in heaven.... are you Mormon? I thought you were Baptist.

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

No, rather that nothing we can do here while alive will be able to undo what Christ did for us while upon the Cross, nor be able to undo the sealing of the Holy Spirit!

while ignoring this?

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.

 

[BobRyan]

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.

The way you silence a Pharisee is to ask them a question like Jesus did. Pharisees are hung up on the Law. They believe salvation is found in obedience to the Law. .

Did you imagine to yourself that Jesus was a Pharisee just then??

or was that done here -- in your POV?


Romans 11
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. 22 Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

 

[BobRyan]

A prophet OF GOD'S has a 100% "batting average". EGW does NOT have that!

Some wannabee prophets make "general" prophecies, avoiding specifics, but EGW blew it on several apecifics such as the return of Jesus. And her "investigative judgment" thingie is pure hokum.

She simply founded a new cult from the ashes of a failed one, "Millerism".

Story telling and creative writing such as the above ... is not considered a "funny kind of substitute for an actual fact" that some have imagined it to be. Though it is somewhat entertaining .. I suppose.

 

[BobRyan]

Same tired tactic. Cannot answer simple questions. Just say we all have a problem with what Jesus said. How instructive! Why not just admit what you believe? Why hide it? Just say you believe you are saved through law keeping.

Do you ever tire of making stuff up for others to claim they believe?

Try actual scripture -- instead

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

Romans 11
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. 22 Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

 

[bluejx]

Even though her teachings are non biblical?

You really haven't made that case. You believe a certain way but if you care to we can compare it to Scripture to determine who's beliefs hold true. Want to give it a go?

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[Yeshua1]

Do you ever tire of making stuff up for others to claim they believe?

Try actual scripture -- instead

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

Romans 11
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. 22 Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

That passage has NOTHING to do with a saved person losing their eternal Life in Christ!

 

[BobRyan]

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

Romans 11
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. 22 Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

That passage has NOTHING to do with a saved person losing their eternal Life in Christ!

Closing eyes and wishing does not count as an actual Bible text.. you knew that right?

 

[One Baptism]

What do the Sda state the Gospel of Jesus is, as how does a lost sinner get saved, and what is required to stay saved per them?

And what is the official position the teachings of EW hold in the Sda Church?

The Everlasting Gospel is that which is clearly stated in scripture [KJB]. That is the official position:

Romans 10:1 KJB - Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.

Romans 10:2 KJB - For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

Romans 10:3 KJB - For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

Romans 10:4 KJB - For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Romans 10:5 KJB - For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.

Romans 10:6 KJB - But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above

Romans 10:7 KJB - Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)

Romans 10:8 KJB - But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

Romans 10:9 KJB - That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Romans 10:10 KJB - For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Catch that: "unto" - saved by God's freely given grace through "Faith" unto right-doing [obedience in responsive love to God's freely given grace through continually beliving, present active faith which takes hold of God's grace. Thus the living faith [not the dead faith which has no real works, see James 2 KJB] produces obedience, the "good works" in salvation [for Jesus is to save us "from" our sins [Matthew 1:21 KJB], not in them, and that is giving us the victory over every last failure to reach God's perfect standard of Character in His Law, the Ten Commandments in all their depth of Spirit, as He, by His work in us, brings us to complete obedience to His perfect and eternal will [Psalms 40:8 KJB]], all of which comes freely as a gift by God's grace, taken hold of by/through faith, which is also given, provided by through the word of God. It is not enough to say "I believe in Jesus", for without repentant obedience [which comes through the power provided in God's grace, through living faith], such declaration is vanity and hypocrisy].
​

Romans 10:11 KJB - For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

Romans 10:12 KJB - For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

Romans 10:13 KJB - For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Romans 10:14 KJB - How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

Romans 10:15 KJB - And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

Romans 10:16 KJB - But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

Romans 10:17 KJB - So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Romans 10:18 KJB - But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

Romans 10:19 KJB - But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.

Romans 10:20 KJB - But Esaias is very bold, and saith, I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me.

Romans 10:21 KJB - But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people.

Living abiding Faith ["in" and "of" Jesus Christ] is the absolute victory over all sin and transgression.​

Even as it was in Genesis:

Genesis 3:15 KJB - And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Genesis 4:26 KJB - And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the LORD.​

The official position of the teachings of sister White, are again found in scripture [KJB]:

Isaiah 8:20 KJB - To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Matthew 23:34 KJB - Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:

2 Chronicles 20:20 KJB - And they rose early in the morning, and went forth into the wilderness of Tekoa: and as they went forth, Jehoshaphat stood and said, Hear me, O Judah, and ye inhabitants of Jerusalem; Believe in the LORD your God, so shall ye be established; believe his prophets, so shall ye prosper.

We have been given 20/20 spiritual vision in that which is written in the testimonies ...​

 

[Yeshua1]

You really haven't made that case. You believe a certain way but if you care to we can compare it to Scripture to determine who's beliefs hold true. Want to give it a go?

Sent from my 9024W using Tapatalk

Answer me this, if saved by grace alone thru faith alone, why would not keeping the Sabbath give to one the mark of the Beast and damn them, as per EW?

 

[Yeshua1]

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

Romans 11
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. 22 Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.



Closing eyes and wishing does not count as an actual Bible text.. you knew that right?

You do know parables are not to be used as primary way to obtain theological knowledge, correct?
By this logic, the story of the rich man and lazarus was a real historical event, and not a parable as Sda sees it as being!

 

[Yeshua1]

The Everlasting Gospel is that which is clearly stated in scripture [KJB]. That is the official position:

Romans 10:1 KJB - Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.

Romans 10:2 KJB - For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

Romans 10:3 KJB - For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

Romans 10:4 KJB - For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Romans 10:5 KJB - For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.

Romans 10:6 KJB - But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above

Romans 10:7 KJB - Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)

Romans 10:8 KJB - But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

Romans 10:9 KJB - That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Romans 10:10 KJB - For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Catch that: "unto" - saved by God's freely given grace through "Faith" unto right-doing [obedience in responsive love to God's freely given grace through continually beliving, present active faith which takes hold of God's grace. Thus the living faith [not the dead faith which has no real works, see James 2 KJB] produces obedience, the "good works" in salvation [for Jesus is to save us "from" our sins [Matthew 1:21 KJB], not in them, and that is giving us the victory over every last failure to reach God's perfect standard of Character in His Law, the Ten Commandments in all their depth of Spirit, as He, by His work in us, brings us to complete obedience to His perfect and eternal will [Psalms 40:8 KJB]], all of which comes freely as a gift by God's grace, taken hold of by/through faith, which is also given, provided by through the word of God. It is not enough to say "I believe in Jesus", for without repentant obedience [which comes through the power provided in God's grace, through living faith], such declaration is vanity and hypocrisy].
​

Romans 10:11 KJB - For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

Romans 10:12 KJB - For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

Romans 10:13 KJB - For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Romans 10:14 KJB - How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

Romans 10:15 KJB - And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

Romans 10:16 KJB - But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

Romans 10:17 KJB - So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Romans 10:18 KJB - But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

Romans 10:19 KJB - But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.

Romans 10:20 KJB - But Esaias is very bold, and saith, I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me.

Romans 10:21 KJB - But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people.

Living abiding Faith ["in" and "of" Jesus Christ] is the absolute victory over all sin and transgression.​

Even as it was in Genesis:

Genesis 3:15 KJB - And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Genesis 4:26 KJB - And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the LORD.​

The official position of the teachings of sister White, are again found in scripture [KJB]:

Isaiah 8:20 KJB - To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Matthew 23:34 KJB - Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:

2 Chronicles 20:20 KJB - And they rose early in the morning, and went forth into the wilderness of Tekoa: and as they went forth, Jehoshaphat stood and said, Hear me, O Judah, and ye inhabitants of Jerusalem; Believe in the LORD your God, so shall ye be established; believe his prophets, so shall ye prosper.

We have been given 20/20 spiritual vision in that which is written in the testimonies ...​

Do you hold to saved by grace alone, faith alone, or that God saves you from past sins, but that you are on a probationary basis afterwards, as one must keep the Sabbath and EW teachings to keep saved?

 

[BobRyan]

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

Notice that "outside" the parable Jesus said --

35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

What does Jesus mean by "the SAME" given the content of his instruction to that point?

Obviously it is the "SAME" fate was being warned about - as we see in the illustration of it.

You do know parables are not to be used as primary way to obtain theological knowledge, correct?

None of that an "excuse" for ignoring the teaching of Christ in his own "application" of his own parable.

The point remains.

By this logic, the story of the rich man and lazarus was a real historical event, and not a parable as Sda sees it as being!

Wrong again.

The "application" of that Luke 16 parable was as stated by Christ "if they do not listen to Moses and the prophets (i.e. "scripture") neither will they listen though one rises from the dead".

So many Baptists have spent so much time focused on a side-detail and not actually on the "application" that Christ makes of it - that many of them don't even remember the Application Christ had for it.

You cannot fix the one error you made - by pointing out that you also made another error in Luke 16.

the "ignore scripture details that do not please" error that you are making in both cases is not serving you well.

 

[Yeshua1]

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

Notice that "outside" the parable Jesus said --

35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

What does Jesus mean by "the SAME" given the content of his instruction to that point?

Obviously it is the "SAME" fate was being warned about - as we see in the illustration of it.



None of that an "excuse" for ignoring the teaching of Christ in his own "application" of his own parable.

The point remains.



Wrong again.

The "application" of that Luke 16 parable was as stated by Christ "if the do not listen to Moses neither will they listen though one rises from the dead".

So many Baptists have spent so much time focused on a side-detail and not actually on the "application" that Christ makes of it - that many of them don't even remember the Application Christ had for it.

You cannot fix the one error you made - by pointing out that you also made another error in Luke 16.

The same jesus stated clearly that ALL who he saves will be raised up, NONE of them will be lost, so is he now contradicting Himself?

 

[BobRyan]

Answer me this, if saved by grace alone thru faith alone, why would not keeping the Sabbath give to one the mark of the Beast ?

If obedience were spun on its head as you suggest -- then in your world - not taking God's name in vain would give you the mark of the beast... in that sort of 'light-replaces-darkness' model you propose as a test.

 

[Yeshua1]

If obedience were spun on its head as you suggest -- then in your world - not taking God's name in vain would give you the mark of the beast... in that sort of 'light-replaces-darkness' model you propose as a test.

Why do you always avoid a simple yes or no answer?

 

[BobRyan]

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

Notice that "outside" the parable Jesus said --

35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

What does Jesus mean by "the SAME" given the content of his instruction to that point?

Obviously it is the "SAME" fate was being warned about - as we see in the illustration of it.

The same jesus stated clearly that ALL who he saves will be raised up, NONE of them will be lost, so is he now contradicting Himself?

So your solution to Jesus' teaching in Matthew 18 is to 'look at some other topic and hope Matthew 18 goes away"??

Seriously?

 

[Yeshua1]

Matt 18
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

Notice that "outside" the parable Jesus said --

35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

What does Jesus mean by "the SAME" given the content of his instruction to that point?

Obviously it is the "SAME" fate was being warned about - as we see in the illustration of it.





So your solution to Jesus' teaching in Matthew 18 is to 'look at some other topic and hope Matthew 18 goes away"??

Seriously?

Jesus claims that he saves FOREVER all those who come unto Him, true or false?

 

[BobRyan]

I debunked your blatant proposal of error - where you wildly suggest that obedience to God's Word must be the "Mark of the Beast" ... and innexplicably you follow with this..

Why do you always avoid a simple yes or no answer?

You propose logical fallacies then follow with "ignore my logical fallacy and just limit yourself to "yes" or "no" --

As if that sort of "game" works in adult discussion.

You knew that we all can see that .. right?