scriptmemory
Member
Walter, You confuse the very obvious meaning of the text, "Be not deceived." 1 Cor. 6:9-11
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What matters is keeping the Commandments of God
- Thread starter BobRyan
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IMO, he's not confused at all. This type of comment is usually reserved for those who have no answer, no defense, nothing of any value to contribute. They have lost the argument, the debate. They have found themselves in a corner with nothing more to say.
Dr. Walter
New Member
He is talking about people who are these things by characterization not by occasional or temporary stumbling. There are no sinless saints. There are lost people who profess to be saved but who have not been changed in character and time reveals their character.
Tell me, what does the law require to "DO" the works of the law? How does the scriptures define "DO" the works of the Law? Do them occasionally? Do them characteristically? Do them perfectly?
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scriptmemory
Member
In Hebrews 10 we are told:
A Christian does not do the works of the flesh:
Hard to miss.
scriptmemory
Member
If in ignorance we accuse someone falsely or some other sin where find ourselves doing something wrong before we realized it was wrong, I agree. However, I hesitate to take the "You shall not surely die." line too seriously for known sin.
The wages of a single sin for Adam and Eve was death (Rom. 6:23). I wouldn't count on any difference for me if I were a reader here. All known sin should be confessed and forsaken if we will be forgiven and counted righteous.
Dr. Walter
New Member
Your dodging the question. I did not ask what was sin. I did not ask if the works of the flesh are sin. I asked what does the Law of God demand as the definition of "doing" the works of the Law to be? Doing them occassionaly? Doing them characteristically? Doing them without violation of any law at any time?
scriptmemory
Member
Walter wrote:
Walter, perhaps you posted without reading this one. Read my distinction between known and unknown sin. Just imagine if a man promised his wife to be "characteristically faithful" but just be unfaithful occasionally and you'll start to understand my position against sinning against God. Sin is sin and while God in mercy covers us when we unknowingly transgress, all known sin must be confessed and repented of by the grace of God in order to be cleansed. 1 John 1:9 God is faithful who will not suffer us to be tempted above that which we are able...1 Cor. 3:13...Blessed is the man that ENDURETH temptation, for WHEN HE IS TRIED he shall receive the crown of life which the Lord hath promised for them that LOVE HIM. James 1:12
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by BobRyan
BobRyan said In Rom 2:7 the word is "Perseverance" - your argument is with the text.
7 to those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life;
Your argument is with the text of Rom 2:7 not with the text of Gal 3:10.
You try to shoehorn the context of the lost into Rom 2:7 when clearly those saints who were living by faith (Rom 1:17) are the saints of Rom 2:7 that "persevere in doing good" just as we see in the case of the "perseverance of the saints" in Rev 14:12.
Paul speaks to the issue of continually circling back to the case of the lost in Heb 6:1-2 whenever topics on perseverance of the saints come up in scripture.
So while Paul does agree with us on the case of the lost seeking Justification - by grace through faith and thus becoming born-again - saints. He differs with your efforts to continually dodge the Bible texts on perseverance of the saints.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan said In Rom 2:7 the word is "Perseverance" - your argument is with the text.
7 to those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life;
Your argument is with the text of Rom 2:7 not with the text of Gal 3:10.
You try to shoehorn the context of the lost into Rom 2:7 when clearly those saints who were living by faith (Rom 1:17) are the saints of Rom 2:7 that "persevere in doing good" just as we see in the case of the "perseverance of the saints" in Rev 14:12.
Paul speaks to the issue of continually circling back to the case of the lost in Heb 6:1-2 whenever topics on perseverance of the saints come up in scripture.
So while Paul does agree with us on the case of the lost seeking Justification - by grace through faith and thus becoming born-again - saints. He differs with your efforts to continually dodge the Bible texts on perseverance of the saints.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Amen!
Walter - the ad hominem in your post is not nearly has difficult for the reader to detect as you appear to imagine and it adds nothing to your argument when it is not detracting from it.
Try scripture.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
That is easy
1Cor 7:19 "But what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God"
We find this also in 1John 2 where those who do not KEEP His commandments are said to be deceivers if they also claim to know Christ.
Interesting how Christ makes a similar case in John 14:15 and in James 2 we are told that the saints are judged by the Ten Commandment law of Liberty.
in 1Cor 6 "be not deceived" is followed by a list of law breaking examples.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Your efforts to delete the Bible doctrine on perseverance of the saints - noted.
But in trying that trick on Romans 2 you have undone your own argument exposing its flaw for the objective unbiased reader to see.
In Romans 2 we have two classes. The saints and the lost sinners. you presume to assign the saints to a "fictional group that does not exist" leaving you with only "Jews who cause the name of God to be blasphemed" -- which then must include Paul himself since he is a Jew and since you refuse to admit to the successful cases in Romans 2 that are being contrasted to the failing cases in Romans 2.
Your argument fails just then because it is very obvious that the saints of Romans 2 and of Romans 1 "do exist" and are not merely "fiction" and in both chapters they are contrasted to the lost.
in Christ,
Bob
Dr. Walter
New Member
There are no "saints" in Romans 2.
In Romans 2:7 there are the unindentified "them" who receive honor, immortality eternal life IF they fit the qualification "by patient continuance in well doing.
In Romans 2:8-9 there are the unindentified "them" who receive " indignation and wrath,Tribulation and anguish, IF they fit the qualification "do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness....upon every soul of man that doeth evil,"
Both "them" are unspecified and it is clearly demonstrated they are unspecified by the GENERIC remark - "of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
In both cases the emphasis is upon "DO" and their "works" and Romans 2:13 clearly demonstrates this is in regard to JUSTIFICATION BY THE WORKS OF THE LAW not to grace or justification by faith.
You cannot find a single solitary specific salvation nominative term in this chapter such as "justified by faith," "saved", "grace", "saints", "child of God", "brethren", "beloved", "born again", "elect" etc.
Paul is simply setting forth the criteria and consequences for "upon every soul of man" (v. 9) and "every man" (v. 10) starting with the Jew first, and also of the Gentiles" who choose to come before God on the basis of the law in order to be justified by DOING the works of the Law.
If you cannot see this you are blind. Find the word "saints" in this text! Find the words "justified by faith" in this text. Find the word "believer" in this text. Find the word "saved" in this text. Find the word "grace" in this text. Find the word "believed" in this text. YOU CANNOT because your interpretation is FLAWED!
You can find the term "gospel" but only used for JUDGEMENT as the righteousness of God is REVEALED in the gospel (Rom. 1:17).
There is no doctrine of perseverance of the "saints" in this text. There is simply the criteria for justification by works under the Law that demands "patient continuance in well doing" exactly as found in Galatians 3:10
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God,
And that is exactly what Paul is saying in Romans 2:12-13
12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
Notice in verse 12 all you have to do is to have "sinned without the law" and the consequence is PERISHING. Are you SINLESS Bob???? That is what THE LAW requires to be justified by works.
Verse 12-13 refer to justiifcation by the works of the Law and only one conclusion - perishing, judgement if a person has "sinned". Justification by the Law only if they have not "sinned." Bob are you sinless? That is the requirement of God's law in order to be justified by the works of the law - sinlessness - by patient continuance in well doing - continuance in all things written in the book of the law to do them.
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Dr. Walter
New Member
Readers,
The apex of disagreement between the SDA representatives on this forum and myself concerning Romans 2 has to do with the following phrases:
1. "by patient continuance in well doing" - v. 6
2. "But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good" - v. 10
3. "(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified." - v. 13
4. "In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel." - v. 16
5. "But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit," - v. 29
A. The Two Contrasting Interpretations:
1. Bob - this is the final judgement where Christians stand before God to be justified by their works, meaning, demonstrated as approved by their works.
2. Dr. Walter - Paul is simply setting forth the criteria and consequences for "ANY MAN" on judgement day who comes to God on the basis of his works in order to be justified UNDER LAW rather than by faith in Christ.
B. Both of us Agree that Romans 3:24-5:2 is talking about the justification by grace through faith without works.
MY ARGUMENTS:
1. In Romans 3:24-5:2 we find repeatedly the saved identified as those who "are "justified by grace" and those who "beleive" and "justified by faith" and "without works" those who are "imputed righteousness without works." However, none of the nominative terms found in Romans 3:24-5:2 that descibe God's people are found in Romans 2 - none!
2. What we do find repeatedly in Romans 2 is justification UNDER or BY THE LAW through DOING the works of the law or "according to...works" (v. 6, 7-10, 12-13; 17-25).
3. What we do find in Romans 2 is the same requirements set forth to be justified by the works of the law (""according to his works....by patient continuing in well doing...doers of the law shall be justified") that are also stated in Galatians 3:10; James 2:10 proving Romans 2 is talking about justification UNDER THE LAW by "DOING" the works of the law.
4. What we do find is the mention of the gospel for the purpose of JUDGEMENT not salvation - v. 16
5. What we do find is the denial that circumcision is sufficient to justify the Jew (v 25) UNLESS he keeps all the rest of the law that is previously delineated in verses 17-24. However, the Jew is charged with violating all that is listed in verses 17-24. Verses 26-29 simply spell out what is necessary for circumcision to be of profit - obedience to all the law by the whole man. However, circumcision is completely rendered worthless by Paul in verses 28-29 IF an UNCIRCUMCISED Gentile could keep ALL THE REST OF THE LAW then his UNCIRCUMCISION would be counted as circumcision thus making the Law's command for OUTWARD CIRCUMCISION worthless as a basis to be justified UNDER LAW.
6. Bob's position is based upon the same basic argument used by the Judizers in regard to circumcision that Paul repudiates in Galatians 3:1-5. They believed one begins the Christian life by justification by faith but one continues the Christian life by justification by works. This is why bob is forcing Romans 2 to fit his JUSTIFICATION UNDER THE WORKS OF THE LAW interpretation.
The apex of disagreement between the SDA representatives on this forum and myself concerning Romans 2 has to do with the following phrases:
1. "by patient continuance in well doing" - v. 6
2. "But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good" - v. 10
3. "(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified." - v. 13
4. "In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel." - v. 16
5. "But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit," - v. 29
A. The Two Contrasting Interpretations:
1. Bob - this is the final judgement where Christians stand before God to be justified by their works, meaning, demonstrated as approved by their works.
2. Dr. Walter - Paul is simply setting forth the criteria and consequences for "ANY MAN" on judgement day who comes to God on the basis of his works in order to be justified UNDER LAW rather than by faith in Christ.
B. Both of us Agree that Romans 3:24-5:2 is talking about the justification by grace through faith without works.
MY ARGUMENTS:
1. In Romans 3:24-5:2 we find repeatedly the saved identified as those who "are "justified by grace" and those who "beleive" and "justified by faith" and "without works" those who are "imputed righteousness without works." However, none of the nominative terms found in Romans 3:24-5:2 that descibe God's people are found in Romans 2 - none!
2. What we do find repeatedly in Romans 2 is justification UNDER or BY THE LAW through DOING the works of the law or "according to...works" (v. 6, 7-10, 12-13; 17-25).
3. What we do find in Romans 2 is the same requirements set forth to be justified by the works of the law (""according to his works....by patient continuing in well doing...doers of the law shall be justified") that are also stated in Galatians 3:10; James 2:10 proving Romans 2 is talking about justification UNDER THE LAW by "DOING" the works of the law.
4. What we do find is the mention of the gospel for the purpose of JUDGEMENT not salvation - v. 16
5. What we do find is the denial that circumcision is sufficient to justify the Jew (v 25) UNLESS he keeps all the rest of the law that is previously delineated in verses 17-24. However, the Jew is charged with violating all that is listed in verses 17-24. Verses 26-29 simply spell out what is necessary for circumcision to be of profit - obedience to all the law by the whole man. However, circumcision is completely rendered worthless by Paul in verses 28-29 IF an UNCIRCUMCISED Gentile could keep ALL THE REST OF THE LAW then his UNCIRCUMCISION would be counted as circumcision thus making the Law's command for OUTWARD CIRCUMCISION worthless as a basis to be justified UNDER LAW.
6. Bob's position is based upon the same basic argument used by the Judizers in regard to circumcision that Paul repudiates in Galatians 3:1-5. They believed one begins the Christian life by justification by faith but one continues the Christian life by justification by works. This is why bob is forcing Romans 2 to fit his JUSTIFICATION UNDER THE WORKS OF THE LAW interpretation.
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BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Paul points to a future judgment - so we all agree future to his day and yet he still points to the reality of successes in that future judgment.
Rom 2
7 to those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life;
8 but to those who are selfishly ambitious and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, wrath and indignation.
9 There will be tribulation and distress for every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek,
10 but glory and honor and peace to everyone who does good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.
11 For there is no partiality with God.
12 For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law;
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified.
14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves,
15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them,
16 on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.
Daniel also points to success cass in Dan 7:22 "judgment passed in favor of the saints".
The logic that says that they cannot know that success cases will be the result if judgment is future - does not fit the text of scripture.
Paul sets the context for the "Gospel judgment" of Rom 2:16 saying in Rom 1:17 "the just shall live by faith" and in Rom 2:4 Paul speaks of the context of the goodness of God calling all mankind to repentance.
Those who reject that Gospel call - are the wicked of Rom 2 and those who accept it are the saints - who in Vs 6 are seen to persevere.
Now see there we have a clear point of difference in your choice to dismiss the texts quoted above that are contrary of your assumptions.
That is true. Just as we see the real wicked of Rom 1:18-32 and the real saints of Romans 1:17 so in Romans 2 we have the real wicked and the real saints.
In Matt 7 Jesus said "by their fruits you shall know them" speaking of good trees with good fruit vs bad trees with bad fruit.
In 1John 2 the Apostle warns that those who claim to know Christ and yet do NOT "keep His commandments" are being deceptive.
This is impossible for the objective unbiased readers to miss.
in Christ,
Bob
Rom 2
7 to those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life;
8 but to those who are selfishly ambitious and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, wrath and indignation.
9 There will be tribulation and distress for every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek,
10 but glory and honor and peace to everyone who does good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.
11 For there is no partiality with God.
12 For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law;
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified.
14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves,
15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them,
16 on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.
Daniel also points to success cass in Dan 7:22 "judgment passed in favor of the saints".
The logic that says that they cannot know that success cases will be the result if judgment is future - does not fit the text of scripture.
Paul sets the context for the "Gospel judgment" of Rom 2:16 saying in Rom 1:17 "the just shall live by faith" and in Rom 2:4 Paul speaks of the context of the goodness of God calling all mankind to repentance.
Those who reject that Gospel call - are the wicked of Rom 2 and those who accept it are the saints - who in Vs 6 are seen to persevere.
Now see there we have a clear point of difference in your choice to dismiss the texts quoted above that are contrary of your assumptions.
That is true. Just as we see the real wicked of Rom 1:18-32 and the real saints of Romans 1:17 so in Romans 2 we have the real wicked and the real saints.
In Matt 7 Jesus said "by their fruits you shall know them" speaking of good trees with good fruit vs bad trees with bad fruit.
In 1John 2 the Apostle warns that those who claim to know Christ and yet do NOT "keep His commandments" are being deceptive.
This is impossible for the objective unbiased readers to miss.
in Christ,
Bob
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BobRyan
Well-Known Member
The objective unbiased reader instantly notices that you cannot find a single solitary "justification by the works of the law" statement in all of Romans 2.
Another easy test case for our discussion.
I appreciate your simplifying the points in that manner.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Justification in Romans 2 is the context of the Gospel call to repentance in vs 4 and the Gospel judgment of Vs 13-16 future to Paul's day "For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified... on the day when according to my gospel God WILL judge".
Therefore the "Justification" mentioned in Rom 2:13 is Gospel Justification.
Hint - a sinless being - an unfallen angel for example does not need or benefit from Gospel justification. They have no need to be justified at any level or in any context.
By contrast in Dan 7:10 and 7:22 we see that in the future judgment "The judgment is passed in favor of the saints" thus even the saints are in need of that kind of future legal justification and Dan 7:22 shows that they get it.
The point remains.
in Christ,
Bob
Dr. Walter
New Member
There has never been a dispute about the future judgement. But I will dispute that the judgement of the righteous is the judgement of the wicked or that the resurrection of the wicked is the resurrection of the righteous.
Look at how he twists the scripture. Romans 2:16 introduces the gospel for the purpose of "JUDGEMENT" not salvation and the appropriate text is Romans 1:17 but not "the just shall live by faith" but rather "herein is the righteousness of God revealed." It is the righteousness revealed in the gospel - the righteousness of God - the righteousness manifest in the law of God - the righteousness manifest in the Person and life of Christ that is the basis to judge all works by men. However, Bob quotes the salvation aspect of Rom. 1:17 when Paul has in view that aspect used for JUDGEMENT not salvation.
Another twist! This text is ripped out of its context because in it context it leaves no question as to who Paul is applying this text to and what will be their responses:
And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
This is applied to the self-righteous hypocrit that despises and rejects the "goodness of God." The antecedant for the pronoun "thee" is the wicked man. I DARE ANYONE TO FIND ANYONE BUT A WICKED MAN IN THIS GRAMMATIAL AND CONTEXTUAL STATEMENT!
Bob makes this PRESUMPTION on the basis of the former crystal clear eisgetical perverted interpretations that precede and are the logical basis for this statement. But does the text say they "accept" the gospel? No! Does the text say they are "saints"? No! The context identifes "them" as those who believe they can "escape the judgement of God" (v. 3) by their own works through justification by the Law of God (v. 13) and "EVERY SOUL" and "ANY MAN" who seeks that route must meet the criteria to obtain that consequence. Paul provides the same criteria in Galatians 3:10 and James says the same thing in James 2:10 and Jesus tells the rich young ruler the same thing.
Bob believes that his "works" can be justified by the criteria the Scriptures demand to be JUSTIFIED BY THE LAW as that is what is being considered in here and Romans 2:13 spells it out. Paul is not even considering the criteria to be JUSTIFIED BY FAITH and faith and law cannot be mixed in justification or so says paul in Galatians 3:12 - "and the law is not of faith." Bob is trying to make them the same.
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The saints in Romans 1:17 are found in a context dealing solely with saints (Rom. 1:1-17). The wicked are found in a context dealing solely with the wicked (Rom. 1:18-3:20) and Paul says so in Romans 3:9. Romans 3:9 says that he has been proving that Gentiles and Jews are all under sin BUT evidence that Gentiles are under sin does not begin until Romans 1:18. THERE IS NO EVIDENCE FURNISHED PRIOR TO ROMANS 1:18 THAT GENTILES ARE UDNER SIN. Hence, Romans 3:9 begins with Romans 1:18 and ends with Romans 3:8.
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Jesus is dealing only with the judgement of the wicked in Matthew 7:15-23 and the wicked are those who claim Jesus Christ as "Lord, Lord" but attempt to add "in thy name have we not done many wonderful works" - this is the "sand" foundation that will not stand in the day of Judgement. This is the foundation Bob is defending.
No one is arguing that obedience to God is evidence of justification and John is giving evidences how his readers can "know" they are the children of God not how they became the children of God. Here Bob is really revealing his true position whether he admits to it or not. His position teaches that one must keep the law in order to be JUSTIFIED BY WORKS UNDER THE LAW whereas the Bible teaches that we are not JUSTIFIED BY OUR WORKS UNDER THE LAW to obtain eternal life but we are JUSTIFIED BY FAITH UNDER GRACE. Therefore keeping the commandments of God by children of God is not for JUSTIFICATION BY LAW. Romans 2:13 is talking about being JUSTIFIED BY WORKS UNDER THE LAW.
in Christ,
Dr. Walter
New Member
Absolute lie! Romans 2:13 expressly demands justification under law by what a man does - and "according to his works" begins this subject (v. 6).
(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
"to every man according to his deeds: 7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing...."
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Agreed. I claim that this chapter deals with both failing and succeeding cases just as does Romans 1 and Romans 3 and it contrasts those who fail to those who succeed just as Christ does in Matt 7 with good trees and bad trees.
Agreed. Your view imagines that in Romans 2 Paul only admits to mankind failing -- as if everyone goes to hell in Romans 2, no matter the succeeding cases of Romans 2 to the contrary.
But I maintain the Paul is arguing the same Matt 7 example of Good trees contrasted to bad trees based on fruit.
Paul is dealing with perseverance of the saints in vs 7 just as John does in Rev 14:12.
Paul argues for future judgment in vs 13-16 just as he does in 2Cor 5:10 "we must all stand before the judgment seat of Christ".
Paul does not say that all will fail in 2Cor 5:10 and he does not say that all will fail in Rom 2:13-16.
Impossible to miss.
In James 2 we are told "you see than that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone" - speaking to the future justification context of Romans 2:13-16 "doers of the Law will be justified...on that day when according to my Gospel God WILL judge" or as Christ said "by their fruits you shall know them" - Matt 7.
The Gospel "good news" about judgement is seen in Dan 7:22 when in that future time "judgment is passed in favor of the saints" on the "by their fruits you shall know them" basis.
A question of "perseverance of the saints" not a case of "The lost becoming saved by persevering in being lost".
What we do find in Romans 2 is that outward circumcision "alone" is sufficient to justify the Jew (v 25) rather the inward circumsion with the Law of God written on the heart under the New Covenant - indicates the saved state -- Jew or Gentile.
If every time one is confronted with the Bible doctrine on perseverance of the saints - they choose of their own free will to "circle back" to the case of the lost supposing that perseverance of the lost in doing some good deed is the topic -- then the result will be as follows -
Thus the problem in the "circle back" model that tries to avoid the "perseverance of the saints" Rev 14:12, Rom 2:7 doctrine of scripture and flees from the Bible teaching that the saints are "by the Spirit puting to death the deeds of the flesh" for it is also by the Spirit that they are born again and under the New Covenant have circumcised hearts with the "law written on the heart" Heb 8.
There is no "continues the Christian life by justification by works" in anything I have posted.
in Christ,
Bob
This phrase that I have seen you resort to many times indicates to me that you don't understand context, ignore context deliberately, and deliberately and conscientiously pull Scripture out of context thereby twisting the true meaning.
You have done thins in Romans 2, James 2, Romans 11, Rev.14, 1Cor.7, and other passages. Context is ignored.
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