Silverhair
Well-Known Member
No one was saved before the foundation of the world that is just your hyper cal miss reading of scripture.
No one was saved at the cross again just your miss reading of scripture.
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When are names written in the Lamb's book of Life?
- Thread starter Van
- Start date
No one was saved before the foundation of the world that is just your hyper cal miss reading of scripture.
No one was saved at the cross again just your miss reading of scripture.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
You continue to say you believe the bible but your theology proves otherwise.
KenH
Well-Known Member
I am quite aware that you don't believe Christ when He said, "It is finished." You think that you have to add to what Christ did, that you have to "finish the job" that He started. There is no salvation in your false gospel.
KenH
Well-Known Member
My theology is based on the Bible, and I proclaim the gospel of Christ as presented in the Bible.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
God is sovereign. The question is why do you hyper cal want to keep forcing Him to conform to your views.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
When Christ said "It is finished." He had paid for all the sin of mankind. He had provided the means of salvation for those that would believe in God.
You have a strange understanding of scripture.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
On your miss reading of scripture.
KenH
Well-Known Member
Ephesians 1:3-14 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: according as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, to the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence; having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: that in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: in whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: that we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.
(emphasis mine)
KenH
Well-Known Member
You write that, yet you don't believe that God can save anyone unless that person "lets" God do so. Therefore, according to your false gospel, man is sovereign, or at least more sovereign than God: you elevate the creature over the Creator.
LOL, I see SIX nonsense posts, all saying "taint so" and offering nothing.
Did anyone say salvation was not 100% of our sovereign God? Nope. So deflection on display
Is the claim salvation is 100% of our sovereign God "man-centered." Nope So more deflection on display
What did Christ mean when He said "It is finished?" That His mission of providing the means of salvation for all Humanity was finished. You bet!
Every saved individual once had not received mercy, therefore they were not chosen before their creation, because then they would have always received mercy from conception.
When God chooses an individual to be "His people" they become part of His people, and therefore to be "not a people" requires that sometime during their lifetime, they had not been individually chosen.
Thus 1 Peter 2:9-10 absolutely precludes anyone being chosen individually before creation. It is a lock no matter how much non-germane verbiage is posted.
When are our names written in the Lamb's book of life? When God chooses to credit our faith as righteousness and transfer us spiritually into Christ's spiritual body.
Is Salvation "conditioned" on the person's performance such that salvation is in part earned, merited, deserved, etc? Nope, so yet another deflection on display. Salvation depends on God alone. How many times must I say this in order for the taint so crowd to stop with their false charges? Seven times, or Seven times Seven?
Did anyone say salvation was not 100% of our sovereign God? Nope. So deflection on display
Is the claim salvation is 100% of our sovereign God "man-centered." Nope So more deflection on display
What did Christ mean when He said "It is finished?" That His mission of providing the means of salvation for all Humanity was finished. You bet!
Every saved individual once had not received mercy, therefore they were not chosen before their creation, because then they would have always received mercy from conception.
When God chooses an individual to be "His people" they become part of His people, and therefore to be "not a people" requires that sometime during their lifetime, they had not been individually chosen.
Thus 1 Peter 2:9-10 absolutely precludes anyone being chosen individually before creation. It is a lock no matter how much non-germane verbiage is posted.
When are our names written in the Lamb's book of life? When God chooses to credit our faith as righteousness and transfer us spiritually into Christ's spiritual body.
Is Salvation "conditioned" on the person's performance such that salvation is in part earned, merited, deserved, etc? Nope, so yet another deflection on display. Salvation depends on God alone. How many times must I say this in order for the taint so crowd to stop with their false charges? Seven times, or Seven times Seven?
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
God being omniscient knows all those that will freely trust in Him.
But even when you quote verses you still ignore the truth
In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.
KenH
Well-Known Member
Christ died for His sheep.
John 10:15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.
Christ actually saved His people, He did not merely make it possible if they complete what He began.
Matthew 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
Notice that the Scripture says, "He shall save His people", not "shall make it possible for his people to be saved if they complete what He began".
KenH
Well-Known Member
Christ meant that He had finished ALL of the work necessary to save the particular people, God's elect, who had been given to Him by God the Father before the foundation of the world to be their Surety and bring them into His presence.
"He said, it is finished; that is, the whole will of God; as that he should be incarnate, be exposed to shame and reproach, and suffer much, and die; the whole work his Father gave him to do, which was to preach the Gospel, work miracles, and obtain eternal salvation for his people, all which were now done, or as good as done; the whole righteousness of the law was fulfilled, an holy nature assumed, perfect obedience yielded to it, and the penalty of death endured; hence a perfect righteousness was finished agreeably to the law, which was magnified and made honourable by it, and redemption from its curse and condemnation secured; sin was made an end of, full atonement and satisfaction for it were given; complete pardon procured, peace made, and redemption from all iniquity obtained; all enemies were conquered; all types, promises, and prophecies were fulfilled, and his own course of life ended: the reason of his saying so was, because all this was near being done, just upon finishing, and was as good as done; and was sure and certain, and so complete, that nothing need, or could be added to it; and it was done entirely without the help of man, and cannot be undone; all which since has more clearly appeared by Christ's resurrection from the dead, his entrance into heaven, his session at God's right hand, the declaration of the Gospel, and the application of salvation to particular persons."
- excerpt from John Gill's Bible commentary on John 19:30
KenH
Well-Known Member
Revelation 17:8 Whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world.
Since some names were not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world, that means that some names were written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world.
The some that were written in the Book of Life are those whom God the Father gave to God the Son to be their Surety, to work out a perfect righteousness during His time on earth, which is imputed to His sheep, who were chosen before the foundation of the world( Ephesians 1:4), and He paid the total sin debt of His sheep (John 10:15), a sin debt imputed to Christ and Christ's perfect righteousness imputed to them (2 Corinthians 5:21), and these sheep are regenerated by the Holy Spirit during their time on earth and granted the gift of faith in Christ and His finished work on their behalf, and the gift of repentance from dead works, and God preserves them until their life on earth is finished (Jude 1:24).
It is a lock. Why? Because God has said so in His Word, and God cannot fail to accomplish His purposes, and once a person's total sin debt is paid, God cannot demand payment for it again.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
God being sovereign can save anyone He chooses, but He has said that He chooses to save those that believe in Him. You know " by grace you have been saved through faith" "For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him."
The condition that God has set is there in clear text. Hear the gospel, believe the message, God saves us.
You would do well to actually trust what the bible says.
KenH
Well-Known Member
I believe the Bible. You teach a false gospel in which there is no salvation.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
You can deny scripture all you want but it does not alter the reality that God's condition is FAITH in Him and this prior to salvation.
It really is sad to see someone struggle so hard to deny God's word. I do pray that God will remove the scales from your eyes.
KenH
Well-Known Member
You write that, yet you believe that God cannot save anyone He chooses, as you falsely believe that, as the saying goes, "God did His part, now you have to do your part", in order to be regenerated.
Man has no part in his regeneration, the new birth, anymore than he had a part in his physical birth. Man does nothing to bring about his physical birth, and man does nothing to bring about his new birth. And without the new birth, no one can have faith in Christ and His finished work, nor repent of dead works.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
How can you say you believe the bible and then deny clear scripture?
You are believing what some man has told you about the bible.
KenH
Well-Known Member
I deny none of the Holy Scriptures.
ALL of the conditions for the salvation of God's elect were fulfilled by Christ.
Faith in Christ and His finished work and repentance of dead works are fruits resulting from, not before, regeneration by the Holy Spirit.