Thank you for you explanation, now I know what Chrismation means.
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When Did YOU Receive the Holy Spirit?
- Thread starter Yeshua1
- Start date
God is spirit, isn't the Lord Jesus Christ being the Lord God Almighty?
Yes, Jesus is the only way to God, I know and truly believe Him He is the only way to God.
I hope you really know the things of God.
But at what point in our life Jesus gives us salvation?
TrevorL
Member
Greetings Yeshua1 and annsni,
I believe that salvation is by faith and this faith leads or motivates the believer to water baptism. I have not received the Holy Spirit, or been baptised in or by the Holy Spirit. I do not have an extra voice in my mind that directs me. My mind and heart hear and digest the word of God and this is the transforming power in my life.
John 17:17-19 (KJV): 17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. 18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world. 19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.
Romans 12:1-2 (KJV): 1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. 2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Kind regards
Trevor
I definitely believe in the Holy Spirit, but it is that portion of the spirit and power of God that He uses for special purposes. For example the Holy Spirit came upon the Apostles at Pentecost and enabled them to speak in other tongues.
I believe that salvation is by faith and this faith leads or motivates the believer to water baptism. I have not received the Holy Spirit, or been baptised in or by the Holy Spirit. I do not have an extra voice in my mind that directs me. My mind and heart hear and digest the word of God and this is the transforming power in my life.
John 17:17-19 (KJV): 17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. 18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world. 19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.
Romans 12:1-2 (KJV): 1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. 2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Kind regards
Trevor
convicted1
Guest
When did I receive the Holy Spirit?
When God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit came into my lefe May 24, 2007, at approx 01:30 am in the lab @ Paul B. Hall Regional Medical Center, in Paintsville, Ky. I haven't been the same since. Praise His high and holy name!!!
just want to make sure that you really understand the process bywhich the Lord transforms us into christians...
TrevorL
Member
Greetings again Yeshua1,
Romans 10:17 (KJV): So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Acts 8:5,12 (KJV): 5 Then Philip went down to the city of Samaria, and preached Christ unto them.
12 But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
On the other hand, judging by your opening post, then I am not saved because I have not received the Holy Spirit. I suspect by your comments that I do not agree with your assessment of the process by which the Lord transforms us into Christians. But I am ready to stand before Christ’s judgement seat, which I believe will occur at his return from heaven, and that soon Acts 3:19-21.
Kind regards
Trevor
I appreciate your response, but simply stated one initially becomes a Christian when he affectionately believes the gospel. Salvation is by faith of the gospel.
Romans 10:17 (KJV): So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Acts 8:5,12 (KJV): 5 Then Philip went down to the city of Samaria, and preached Christ unto them.
12 But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
On the other hand, judging by your opening post, then I am not saved because I have not received the Holy Spirit. I suspect by your comments that I do not agree with your assessment of the process by which the Lord transforms us into Christians. But I am ready to stand before Christ’s judgement seat, which I believe will occur at his return from heaven, and that soon Acts 3:19-21.
Kind regards
Trevor
1 Jn. 4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.
Rom. 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
TrevorL
Member
Greetings The Biblicist and Yeshua1,
Kind regards
Trevor
I agree with the above quotations, but possibly not in the way you interpret them. When we receive the preaching of the gospel, then this induces a mode of thinking within us, which is the Spirit of Christ. This new mode of thinking is contrary to the thinking of the flesh. I could list many quotations, but I will allow you to consider this.
I am content not to have received the Holy Spirit in the way that you seem to be expounding. I believe it is the word of the truth of the gospel that is the transforming power in my life and in the life of the faithful.Yeshua1 said:
Kind regards
Trevor
Trevor, look at he context of each of these verses. The preaching of the gospel is not in view. Furthermore, the change of mode of thinking is the consequence not the cause of indwelling of the Spirit.
These scriptures do not say:
1 Jn. 4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God's mode of thinking dwelleth in him, and his mode of thinking dwelleth in God.
Carry it through and you come to the rediculous conclusion that your mode of thinking "dwelleth in God."!!!! He is talking about SPIRITUAL UNION not mode of thinking.
Rom. 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit's mode of thinking, if so be that the Spirit of God's mode of thinking dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ's mode of thinking, he is none of his thinking.
Again, the mindset is the consequence of the condition "in the flesh" or "in the Spirit" not the cause of that condition.
Of course I have dealt with you and some others on this forum that it really does not matter what kind of evidence is presented - "A man convinced agaist his will is of the same opinion still."
But saying that the Holy Spirit is a "power of God" means that He is not a person. He is not God but a force of God. But then a "power" of God cannot speak (Acts 13:2), be grieved (Ephesians 4:30), work giving gifts (1 Corinthians 12:11), intercede for us (Romans 8:26), move (Genesis 1:2), create man (Job 33:4) or teach (John 14:26).
If you have not received the Holy Spirit, you are not saved.
Romans 8:9-14 states:
However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him. If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you. So then, brethren, we are under obligation, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh - for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live. For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.
and Galatians 4:6 shows us that if we are sons, we have the Spirit in us
Because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, “Abba! Father!”
You say that your heart and mind digest the Word of God and that is the power in your life. Are you saying that your heart and mind is the power in your life? Then you need to be saved and receive the Spirit of God.
Do you have the Holy Spirit, Third person of the Trinity dwelling/residing within you than?
TrevorL
Member
Greetings again Yeshua1, annsni and The Biblicist,
I need to consider more carefully your responses over the next few days, but I hope you will not completely write me off when I answer the following:
Kind regards
Trevor
I need to consider more carefully your responses over the next few days, but I hope you will not completely write me off when I answer the following:
No. I believe that there is One God, the Father and that Jesus is The Son of God, and The Holy Spirit is God's power which the Father uses for special purposes.
Kind regards
Trevor
Are you a jehovah Witness, as they hold to same theology!
TrevorL
Member
Greetings again The Biblicist,
I appreciate your response. I would like to briefly respond to your last comment:
The above reminds me of our discussion in the thread “The Promises to Abraham – The Promise of the Land”. Starting about Post #32, you insisted that heaven going is taught by stating that Abraham must now be living, based upon Jesus’ quotation of the declaration by God at the bush that He is the God of Abraham. Also you suggested Paul’s partial siding with the Pharisees regarding the resurrection proved that man has an immortal soul. For my part I stated my belief that Abraham is waiting for the resurrection of the dead. I still believe that Abraham is amongst those that sleep in the dust of the earth. He will be raised at the return of Jesus from heaven, when he comes to establish his kingdom on earth, to give Abraham the inheritance of the land that God promised Abraham and his seed in Genesis 13:14-15, Galatians 3:16,26-29.
In the last few days we have laid my mother in law to rest at the age of 100. She shared the same belief, and we claim on her behalf that God is her God, and that she will be resurrected, together with her husband who died 38 years ago. They were baptised upon their belief of the gospel 79 years ago.
If this is an example of how you convince people, then I ask do you believe that you came to above conclusions because the indwelling Spirit inspired you?
Psalm 1:1-2 (KJV): 1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful. 2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
In OT times did a believer have to have the Holy Spirit in the form of a separate indwelling of the Spirit in order to meditate on the law or the teaching of the LORD?
John 6:63 (KJV): It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
You seem to suggest that the Spirit within us is separate from the Word of God within us. I believe they are one and the same. Therefore your supposed addition of “mode of thinking” on my behalf in 1 John 4:15, Romans 8:8-9 is wrong. I am very content with the word “spirit” or “Spirit”.
One of my favourite verses, pivotal to the context of both Romans 7 and 8 is:
Romans 8:2 (KJV): For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Kind regards
Trevor
I appreciate your response. I would like to briefly respond to your last comment:
I agree with the saying in general, but you are claiming that I do not heed or respond to a well-reasoned and true exposition. Yes, I am slow and stubborn to accept a change in perspective. Yes you have discussed various subjects with me, and yes I did not accept some of the things that you suggested.
The above reminds me of our discussion in the thread “The Promises to Abraham – The Promise of the Land”. Starting about Post #32, you insisted that heaven going is taught by stating that Abraham must now be living, based upon Jesus’ quotation of the declaration by God at the bush that He is the God of Abraham. Also you suggested Paul’s partial siding with the Pharisees regarding the resurrection proved that man has an immortal soul. For my part I stated my belief that Abraham is waiting for the resurrection of the dead. I still believe that Abraham is amongst those that sleep in the dust of the earth. He will be raised at the return of Jesus from heaven, when he comes to establish his kingdom on earth, to give Abraham the inheritance of the land that God promised Abraham and his seed in Genesis 13:14-15, Galatians 3:16,26-29.
In the last few days we have laid my mother in law to rest at the age of 100. She shared the same belief, and we claim on her behalf that God is her God, and that she will be resurrected, together with her husband who died 38 years ago. They were baptised upon their belief of the gospel 79 years ago.
If this is an example of how you convince people, then I ask do you believe that you came to above conclusions because the indwelling Spirit inspired you?
Before looking at the verses you quoted, could I ask if you could also respond to the following:
Psalm 1:1-2 (KJV): 1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful. 2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
In OT times did a believer have to have the Holy Spirit in the form of a separate indwelling of the Spirit in order to meditate on the law or the teaching of the LORD?
Could I simply summarise the difference by saying that I believe that we have the Spirit of Christ when we absorb the words of Christ.
John 6:63 (KJV): It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
You seem to suggest that the Spirit within us is separate from the Word of God within us. I believe they are one and the same. Therefore your supposed addition of “mode of thinking” on my behalf in 1 John 4:15, Romans 8:8-9 is wrong. I am very content with the word “spirit” or “Spirit”.
One of my favourite verses, pivotal to the context of both Romans 7 and 8 is:
Romans 8:2 (KJV): For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Kind regards
Trevor
TrevorL
Member
Greetings again annsni,
Romans 1:16-17 (KJV): 16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
Ephesians 5:26 (KJV): That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
Hebrews 10:22 (KJV): Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
Kind regards
Trevor
I hope my answer to The Biblicist may answer some of your concerns. The Holy Spirit is more than mere force or power. The Holy Spirit can raise the dead. It can restore a withered hand. It can multiply loaves and fishes. It can inspire the prophets. The Spirit through the Word of God transforms my heart and mind to become more like the heart and mind of Christ.
Romans 1:16-17 (KJV): 16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
Ephesians 5:26 (KJV): That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
Hebrews 10:22 (KJV): Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
Kind regards
Trevor
TrevorL
Member
Greetings again Yeshua1,
Kind regards
Trevor
No. Some of the terms may appear similar, but in nearly every area of teaching we differ. For example we believe in the bodily resurrection of Jesus, the literal return of Jesus to the earth, the return of the Jews to the land of Israel and their conversion at Christ's coming, the nations also will be subjected to Christ at that time Isaiah 2:1-5, Micah 4:1-8, Zechariah 14. And many other teachings. We also believe in justification by faith and that Jesus died as our representative, not substitute.
Kind regards
Trevor
The Spirit is not an "it" - but instead God. In the Scriptures, He is not referred to as an "it" ever, but instead is spoken of as He.
Romans 8:11 ""But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who indwells you."
John 14:26 "These things I have spoken to you, while abiding with you. "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.
Romans 8:16 "The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,"
Romans 10:26 "And in the same way the Spirit also helps our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we should, but the Spirit Himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words"
Do you hold to the doctrines of God being a truine being? father/Son/Holy Spirit, all 3 beings God, yet aso distinct from each other?
Do you hold that jesus was/is God in himan flesh?
Do you hold the Holy Spirit is Fully God, and is a person?
Do you hold that Jesus death on the Cross was atonement for ALL our sins, and its faith alone in Him, grace alone from God that saves us?