Nolan Stengel
Member
That, and I can think of a couple people that use this as a platform solely to express their hatred towards our president it seems like.
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Why are Baptists so divisive?
- Thread starter RCT
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That, and I can think of a couple people that use this as a platform solely to express their hatred towards our president it seems like.
Also at times have to contend with some holding to false doctrines and theology, such as Roman Catholics, Pentecostals/charismatics, word of faith etc
MY youngest is in Marines, just passed Brown Belt, studying now for black belt, and the ones to watch out for in a fight are the ones that never talk big, as they let their skill speak for them instead
Piper 2
Member
Don't see many of those here.
Piper 2
Member
BAZINGA!!!!!!
How are you to tell who is genuine and who is false…is there a set procedure that can be used?
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We have none in my town…but that’s New Jersey….there are allot of RCC& Jewish synagogues though.they can be nice people but Baptist churches are not their thing.Have you tried the OTHER Baptist Church?
I have yet to find a town with only 1 Baptist Church.
[multiplication through division]
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I am not sure that "knowing" of another's eternal state is our responsibility. This is why church discipline is so vital to the church. We are told that we can know if WE are saved. I think all of 1John would expose many.
1John 5:13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.
I would say that if we suspect that someone is not saved, we should show the love of Christ and lovingly approach them with scripture. Wouldn't we all want that for ourselves?
Tenchi
Member
2 Corinthians 13:5-6 (NASB)
5 Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith; examine yourselves! Or do you not recognize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you—unless indeed you fail the test?
6 But I trust that you will realize that we ourselves do not fail the test.
Paul, it seems, thought it was possible for others to discern that he "passed the test" and was, indeed, a born-again child of God. And so, he urged his readers to realize that he was "in the faith," just as they (hopefully) were, too.
Many Christian today, however, bridle fiercely at the idea that such a thing is possible. I suppose this has to do, at least in part, with the hyper-"tolerant," toxically-affirming and reality-denying "equality" that modern, western societies have taken up. No one must be told they are "less than," or immoral, or worst of all, a sinner. And the Church, powerfully infected by this society-collapsing "compassion," widely forbids the idea that anyone should be told they aren't saved when they've claimed that they are. Consequently, the Church in the West is profoundly corrupted with the "leaven" of false converts, desperately weakened spiritually and utterly unattractive to the lost. If the Church doesn't begin to guard itself carefully against the "leaven that leavens the whole lump" (1 Cor. 5:6; Gal. 5:9) it will eventually cease to be the Church, becoming only a counterfeit of it, "professing to know God but in works denying Him" (Tit. 1:15-16).
In light of the horror of the story Jesus told in Matthew 7:21-23, the real Church, truly born-again people, have powerful incentive to disabuse the lost of the notion that they are saved when they clearly aren't. The Church ought not to be a place where the unrepentant wicked feel at ease, even confirmed in their sin. That in so many churches they are, participating in Sunday morning worship services from lives swollen and sickly with sin, is a sharp indictment of those churches. Ironically, and awfully, such "affirming," "welcoming," all-embracing churches are the least loving (in an agape sense), smoothing the lost person's way to hell and keeping them far from God while encouraging them to think they're held in His arms. Horrible.
Speaking for myself no because at the time before I was regenerated, I never had any interest in salvation and many tried to corral me, cajole me, brow beat me, plead with me, tried to convince me through fear tactics etc….nothing worked. Perhaps I was having too much fun in my old life, or maybe I just thought that those trying to encourage me were just being weird and overtly religious, I never thought I needed them. I’d get my Weslian cousin approaching me with the line, “when you born again cuz” to my brother brow beating me at my home with religious literature, a New Testament and “ just say you believe” and I as an Roman Catholic at the time would get defensive and counter him with “so you don’t think Roman Catholics Believe…I was born believing so get lost” They were all becoming white Christian evangelicals (subsequently radicalized)and subsequently right nuisances…which reminded me of the Jehovah Witnesses that came knocking at my door from time to time. Really, it’s only via a visitation of the Holy Ghost, not any human that I got it, then it all came together. I’d probably be in prison today if not for his intervention and gentle coercion. The funniest part of all this is I’m still a Scoundrel but I won’t harm anybody now, I won’t steal, I don't drink anymore, I’m a faithful husband, a good father & grandfather, I pay my taxes, and I mostly grow my own food and raise dogs & chickens.
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Anyone who is born again could freely tell of their regeneration & conversion process. At that point, they should be welcomed into the church and the church should start to disciple them.
Tenchi
Member
What I look for is the life and work of the Holy Spirit in the one claiming to be born-again. Not the monkey babbling called tongues, not hysterical prostration, not dubious "healings," but what the New Testament describes as the normal experience of the Spirit by those indwelt by him. As Scripture makes very plain, "if any man has not the Spirit of Christ he is none of his." (Ro. 8:9) And so, it's for his "witness" within the truly born-again person (Ro. 8:16) that I look, which is to say his conviction, illumination, strengthening, comfort and transformation of them (Jn. 16:8; Rev. 2-3; Jn. 14:26; 1 Cor. 2:10-16; 2 Cor. 1:3-4; 3:18; Eph. 3:16; Phil. 2:13; Ga. 5:22-23, etc.) Does the person professing to be a child of God "love the brethren" in the self-sacrificial way Christ loves them (1 Jn. 3:14; 4:7-11)? Does the one claiming to be saved have a desire for God's Truth (Jer. 15:16)? Does the one declaring herself to be a member of God's family live in humble, loving, faithful submission to her holy Maker (1 Pe. 5:6; Ja. 4:7; Ro. 12:1; He. 11:6; Ro. 5:5; Matt. 22:36-38)? This is the criteria Scripture supplies to us by which we can see if we are "in the faith" and if others are, too.
"A little leaven leavens the whole lump," Paul wrote (1 Cor. 5:6; Gal. 5:9). Because this is so, the Church can ill afford to welcome into its company the false convert and the compromised believer, both of whom will introduce "leaven" - sin - into the Church.
Sin will still be there none the less…we are not completed till Jesus returns however we now ,through the power of the Holy Ghost, are now cognizant of our proclivities to sin and have been imparted with a conscience to fend off sin. I can’t tell you how many times Ihave told Satan no, I’m not that man anymore, leave my sight , I’m a child of God and I follow the will of the creator. But I’m still apt to think unclean thoughts that can turn into a sinful action without Gods help. The Jews have an interesting take on all this…they mitigate the power of Satan to control us, relegating Satan to a fallen angel status that can be easily ignored, however they elevate humankind to a almost partner stance to the “mensch” level, the walking, talking good guy who is the positive (good guy status) this world agent that elevates humans to a partner level. So if there is enough of those Mensches in the world they can transform this world to an elevated good & peaceful level. I like that perception view of humans charge and responsibility.
Blank
Active Member
For that matter, why is the church as a whole so divided?
Earnestly contending for the faith once delivered is the command. God knew that with 10 people there would be 12 opinions on every decision and doctrine.
In the first decade of the church Paul withstood Peter to the face. Missions? Barnabas, head of the first missionary journey, had such contention that the second missionary journey was fractured before it started. Could give a list of troublemakers dividing churches. 6 of 7 by AD 90 (Rev 2-3) were a MESS.
I asked "AI" to summarize internal divisive issues in first generaton of the Church:
- Disagreements and Conflicts:
- Disagreements over doctrine and practice were common within the early churches.
- For example, there were debates about the necessity of observing Jewish laws for Gentile converts.
- Racial tensions between Jewish and Gentile Christians also emerged.
- Gossip, "my-way-ism," and bitterness were rampant.
- Disagreements over doctrine and practice were common within the early churches.
- False Teachings and Heresies:
- The early church had to contend with various false teachings and heresies, such as Gnosticism.
- These teachings often challenged core Christian beliefs about Jesus and salvation.
- The early church had to contend with various false teachings and heresies, such as Gnosticism.
- Leadership and Authority:
- The early church struggled to establish clear lines of authority and leadership.
- Some leaders faced criticism and challenges to their authority.
- The early church struggled to establish clear lines of authority and leadership.
- Sin and Moral Issues:
- As in any community, the early church faced issues with sin and moral problems.
- Paul addresses issues like sexual immorality and lawsuits between brethren in his letters.
- As in any community, the early church faced issues with sin and moral problems.
- Integrating Diverse Cultures and Traditions:
- The early church faced the challenge of integrating people from diverse religious and cultural backgrounds.
- This led to conflicts and misunderstandings as different groups struggled to find common ground.
- The early church faced the challenge of integrating people from diverse religious and cultural backgrounds.
Blank
Active Member
Most of that list can be found in the first letter to the Corinthians, thus breaking the myth of the dreamer who imagines, “If only today’s Church could be like the NT Church.
Then we have this pronounced…
76K views · 9.6K reactions | Praise GOD when you are persecuted. When you are rejected. When there is no seat for you at a table where you used to find fellowship. Praise God when you are given a cross to bear. Praise God when you may even giv
Praise GOD when you are persecuted. When you are rejected. When there is no seat for you at a table where you used to find fellowship. Praise God when you are given a cross to bear. Praise God...
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Tenchi
Member
You're right: No one arrives at sinless perfection this side of the grave - not in their practical, daily living anyway. But sin ought certainly to become an ever-increasing rarity in the life of a mature believer. The apostle Paul made this point very clearly, as did Peter and John:
Romans 6:1-2
1 What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase?
2 May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?
1 John 3:3-9
3 And everyone who has this hope fixed on Him purifies himself, just as He is pure.
4 Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness.
5 You know that He appeared in order to take away sins; and in Him there is no sin.
6 No one who abides in Him sins; no one who sins has seen Him or knows Him.
7 Little children, make sure no one deceives you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous;
8 the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil.
9 No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1 Peter 1:14-16
14 As obedient children, do not be conformed to the former lusts which were yours in your ignorance,
15 but like the Holy One who called you, be holy yourselves also in all your behavior;
16 because it is written, "YOU SHALL BE HOLY, FOR I AM HOLY."
1 Peter 3:12
12 For the eyes of the Lord are on the righteous, and his ears are open to their prayer. But the face of the Lord is against those who do evil.”
The Holy Spirit doesn't just convict us of our sin but enables us both to desire to do God's will and to actually do it. See Philippians 2:13, and 4:13. See Ephesians 3:16. See 2 Corinthians 3:18. See Galatians 5:22-23. God's righteousness is supernatural and to attain to it at all requires supernatural power which we are given in the Person of the Holy Spirit. Those who live in daily submission to the Spirit find themselves filled with who he is, a "river of living water" (Jn. 7:38-39) who empowers them to live holier and holier lives. The Christian who is perennially mired in sin, then, especially the same sin under which they labored when they were first saved, doesn't understand how to walk with God and knows little of Him, for "without holiness no man shall see God." (He. 12:14b)
Yes, Satan tempts. But a man is also "drawn away of his own lust and enticed" (Ja. 1:14-16). And the World constantly invites the Christian to endless distractions, demonic philosophies, and evil, self-centered values and ethics, too. The person not walking in the Spirit every day has, then, no hope of living in the way God has commanded. Only by the life and work of the Holy Spirit in them can Christians "come out from among them and be separate," not touching the "unclean thing." (2 Cor. 6:17-18)
Interesting. I suppose. But not biblical.
This isn't what God says in His word. The power to change the world in the way God wants is not in any of us. It is only God working through us that produces the spiritually salutary effect He intends us to have in the World.
2 Corinthians 4:6-11
6 For God, who said, “Let light shine out of darkness,” has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.
7 But we have this treasure in jars of clay, to show that the surpassing power belongs to God and not to us.
Philippians 1:6
6 And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.
Ephesians 6:10
10 Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of his might.
1 Thessalonians 5:23-24
23 Now may the God of peace himself sanctify you completely, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
24 He who calls you is faithful; he will surely do it.
And so on.