Why Are You Catholic?

Meercat,

You said, ' . . . I'd like to shake you up a little and let you know that in spite of the Catholic Church's "Judases, a.k.a. bad priests, bad lay-persons, religious, etc . . . '

Probably, 99% of these 'bad priest' depended on their infant baptism or receiving the wafer to save their never dying soul. When you do not have Christ within, by receiving Him personally, [John 1:12] through repentance and faith in Jesus, in the words of the Bible, ' . . . according to the true proverb, the dog is returned to his own vomit again, and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.' Hey, and these words came from your first pope in II Peter 2:2l-22.

Maybe these diocese can borrow some money for their legal work from the Vatican or Pastor Benny Hinn.

 

Feel free to address any specific point on Purgatory that you do not think that highly-published pro-catholic scholars and authorities promote?

So are you sayhing you refused to listen to the magesterium of your non-RC church? Why refuse your church magesterium? I thought you were inclined to accept the teaching of the magesterium! What gives? your story does is not holding up.

Would you have been "more inclined" if you thought your "Baptist magesterium" was ALSO responsible for millions of deaths of Christians? Of the inquisition? Would that have helped you "restore faith in your baptist magesterium" or failing to find that among the baptists - you decided to look for that kind of history among the RCC's history?

AS a Baptist you were told that God DID leave an authorotative teaching - it is the Word of God - the Bible. Surely you did not think that the Bible "Was not good enough" did you?

So how did you decide that the Bible AND your Baptist Magisterium was "not good enough"?

This can really be instructive.

I agree 100% with finding out "exactly why" a Baptist might choose non-Christian fellowships as you say you did - and also might choose RC fellowships. Better to get the facts on the table in a forum like this and deal with them head on rather than have more people slip out the back door.

In this case - I think that the more light you shine on the issue - the better off everyone will be.

In Christ,

Bob

 

If I were Roman Catholic and believed in purgatory and one of my family members died, I too, would be first to call my pastor for 'a Mass Card.' These are special prayers for the family member who has passed on, with a check written out, in many cases, to the priest. The check even if it were a large amount of money is incidental. But to think that a priest's prayers have any impact with the Lord of Divine justice after death, is completely off the scope of Biblical and Christian thinking. Does not Romans 8:33 say, 'It is God Who justifies' the sinner, once for all. [vs.30 & I Corinthians 15:3 & I John 2:2 & Hebrews 10:10] 'Who shall lay anything to the charge of God's elect.' [Romans 8:33a] The Lord justifies souls, not the prayers of any human, though a godly person.

Knowing the suffering of those who allegedly go to Purgatory for 'a buff up job' in order to come up to a perfection worthy of Heaven, it would make me wonder how many prayers have to be offered and how many checks written until I would be assured that my loved one finally made the grade. I do not know of any spiritual potentate on earth who can guarantee that enough prayers have been offered to Christ.

 

In the RCC you are not considered to be a good family member if you do not try to earn a Plenary indulgece for their loved one - rather than leaven them where the RCC has put them after death.

In Christ,

Bob

 

nealforChrist,

I don't think we are bashing people but a system of theology. If we are wrong in our explanation, please correct us. But remember we only entertain things that are backed up with Scripture. We will, however, listen to your traditions and myths if your church has any to offer up for our consideration.

 

Hi all,

This is Canon V of the Justification segment of the Council of Trent:

CANON V.-If any one saith, that, since Adam's sin, the free will of man is lost and extinguished; or, that it is a thing with only a name, yea a name without a reality, a figment, in fine, introduced into the Church by Satan; let him be anathema.
http://www.cfpeople.org/Apologetics/page51a038.html

The RCC apparently framed this particular condemnation for Luther, Calvin, and the Protestants. Is this still the official stance of the RCC reguarding Reformed folks like me?

 

Several Roman Catholics have given witness on this board that there is such a truth as justification before God. Even Carson Weber from Steubinville, Ohio confirmed this. They believe when a man is justified before God, it only takes one mortal sin to destroy this relationship with the Lord God. So speaking from reality it is possible for a Catholic to commit---say from 1-100 mortal sins over a long life-span. My question is does your bishop then believe that God ministers justification 100 times in the life of just one person? If you Catholic laity believe this-you should see the 'red flag' that most other Christians see.

Christians who are orthodox in Christian theology know that a sinner can only be justified one time in a whole life time. [Romans 5:1 & Romans 8:29-30]

Any other ritual is merely trying to work your way to Heaven.



Dr. Berrian

 

Neal - you are in the perfect position to defend your catholic faith expertly - since while you are a Baptist still - you presumably have some "Value left" for "sola scriptura" and for "valid exegesis".

This means that the RCC values YOU find to hold up to the Word of God - will be best related by you to other non-RC (such as Ray and myself).

If you had sunk all the way into the dark ages of the RCC - you would doubtless abandon exegetical approaches to the word of God and we would have lost that valuable common ground of "sola scriptura" and "sound exegesis" by which you could reach us.

But as it is - you claim to still be Baptist. So I say you are in the ideal position to proclaim Cataholicism "sola scriptura" and with "sound exegesis" so that the catholic views of scripture are presented in their best Baptist-like form.

Don't complain about that bridge - rather give your views in terms of "sola scriptura" give them with "sound compelling exegetical attention to the text".

The floor is yours.

In Christ,

Bob

 

You need a new hobby other than ignoring the point and bashing any post unfavorable at all to the RCC.

Why not try the approach of "quoting something" that I said that you believe I do NOT have an RC source PROMOTING? You "Claim" that such is the case in your post - now "show it" pick something.

Simply accusing "is the easy part" - show something.

In Christ,

Bob

 

nealforChrist,

On page four of this topic in my first post, I said if I had misrepresented the Catholic view, to please set Bob and I straight. If Catholics do not have the vitality or understanding to explain the details of Purgatory to us then they need to speak with their bishop.

Those who kneelforChrist will expel this concept as not of God. At death Christians go immediately into the Presence of the Lord, [Philippians 1:23 & II Cor. 5:8 because Christ died for all of our sins and not just past sins. [I Corinthians 15:3]

And if you as a Baptist get 'ticked off' that is a condition in your soul, not mine. To me a true Baptist would not find any problem with what I have just said about Heaven being our home when we leave this life.

If someone is Catholic and is troubled it may be because the Holy Spirit is at work in their hearts, because some men's ideas do go against the Divine words coming from Jesus. No one can argue against Scripture, if they are wise.

 

Neal - is your question on Purgatory? Are you comfortable claiming that the RC scholars do not describe it as a place of torment, suffering, payment for sin?

What do you doubt as coming from the RCC itself?

In Christ,

Bob

 

It is not a place of torment, but of waiting(in a sense). While you may have a problem with the last sentence of thssi in particular, is there not consequences for sin, even that may have continued longer had we not died?

What happens if you have lived your whole life for the glory of God, but an indiscretion, say lying about something at work, takes place and you die 5 seconds later? Lying is a sin and all sin taints the soul. If a tainted soul cannot enter heaven then what happens if not Purgatory?
I am truly asking for Christian response, not being called a heretic or a waste of time, etc.

 

Peace of Christ.

My IFB sister believes in the concept of purgatory, yet she was not aware that her concept is what the Catholic Church means by purgatory. She believes that when a Christian dies they have to go through final purification because "nothing unclean can enter Heaven." I told her that this was purgatory. She was under the wrong assumption that Catholics taught purgatory is a place where everyone who dies goes and from there it is determined who goes to Heavven or Hell.

 

NealforChrist,

You said, 'And DR., why not take up SDA bashing?'

Take another look at the TOPIC. "Why Are You Catholic?" According to this Roman Catholicism is under the microscope for a closer look. We make knowledgeable declarations on what we know to be the truth. If it is wrong, then Catholics should be on this like 'flies in route to scales on a fish cleaning board.' On other topics I have heard that Catholics believe that this Purgatory will not be 'a cake walk' but they will undergo punishment for their misbehavior.

Philippians 1:21,23 & II Corinthians 5:8 shouts in the ears of all Christians that Purgatory is a doctrine taught by the Cardinals to the gullible, simple and uneducated people of the Dark Ages. We are living in a resplendent day of enlightenment even in the matter of spiritual exegesis in our desire to grow in the faith.

When trusting our souls to either St. Augustine or Jesus we non-Catholics generally would much rather stand next to our Lord's testimony that is directly from the Godhead and His holy apostles.

As to Seventh Day Adventism, at least for me, in talking with another knowledgeable Adventist years ago, I found that we had so much in common. I have no problem if these good people worship on the Sabbath. In fact, in the coming Kingdom Age on earth, Jesus our Messiah/Savior will mandate worship on the sabbath as recorded at least four times in Ezekiel chapter forty-six. The vision of the Temple is seen by Ezekiel in chapter forty and speaks of 'the inner court, the inner Temple [41:15], the House, my sanctuary', in every chapter from 40-48.

If you want to place Adventist's under a spotlight feel free to do so; not that I have any official authority in this matter at all.

 

I hope it is not too late to share my experience as to why I am Catholic. Simply put, I wanted to "build my house on the Rock" and not on sand. Someone on this thread made a legitimate comment that to some extent, our decisions are based on "private judgement". I agree. However, I do not extend my private judgment to Scripture entirely. There must have been a Church who knew and were given the understanding of Sacred Scripture by the Holy Spirit and who did "not lean on their own understanding" in order to obey the will of God and not that of man." I sincerily hope that no Baptist on this forum thinks I am accusing him or her of doing any of the above. I believe all of you are sincere in your faith and I admire you because of the strenghth of your convictions and even rejoice in the issues in which we have in common. I joined this forum to be part of a group of people who are on fire for the love of God and Truth and even though we see the Truth differently, the love of God that we both have in common can certainly rub off on each other! Make no mistake, I am not here to deceive anyone OR try and convert anyone to the Catholic Faith, but only to educate and explain any misunderstandings as pertains to the Catholic Church that many non-Catholics have even to this day.
But, why AM I Catholic? - I got sick of all the differing interpretations of how to live out the Bible by the differing opinions of what Scripture means by so many pastors however well-meaning. I'll be glad to explain more if any one is really curious.

However, I wish to make it known that I respect all those who differ from my "opinions" and thoughts anyway. - With the love of Christ, - Meercat

ps. Neal- I appreciate your genuine openness to understand things that you have more than likely taught to oppose.

To BobRyan and RayBerrian-

Relax, no one is here to "strong-arm" you, we wish to only explain where we come from and not put either of you or like-minded people down so please be a little more kind. It makes communicating among ourselves much easier and God Bless!!!