Why did God Arrange the Fall?

[Van]

Numerous threads have been posted which as far as I know never offer a solid answer from scripture.

Did God desire to send the fallen to Hades and Gehenna? Nope,

Eze 18:32
“For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone who dies,” declares the Lord GOD. “Therefore, repent and live!”

Psalms 5:4
For You are not a God who takes pleasure in wickedness;
No evil can dwell with You.
​

So why did God arrange the fall?

First we must ask why did God choose to create humanity in the first place.

The answer is that He takes pleasure in His people. Those He chooses as His own possession. Psalms 149 teaches God takes pleasure in "His people" those that He has glorified with salvation. Thus God's purpose and plan was to choose for Himself a people needing salvation. And this glorification would including giving mercy to them. Thus the fall, made humanity in need of salvation, and in need of mercy. See 1 Peter 2:9-10

Does the indicated timing for His choice of the individuals to be His people come before creation or after the Fall, after they needed mercy?

 

[KenH]

So why did God arrange the fall?

 

[37818]

So why did God arrange the fall?

A loaded question.
Arrange meaning what? God as the Creator is to be the cause of sin?

 

[KenH]

God as the Creator is to be the cause of sin?

Everything that has and will ever take place is decreed/ordained by God for His glory. Not a single atom in the universe moves except as God has purposed for His glory.

 

[kyredneck]

8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, was this grace given, to preach unto the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;
9 and to make all men see what is the dispensation of the mystery which for ages hath been hid in God who created all things;
10 to the intent that now unto the principalities and the powers in the heavenly places might be made known through the church the manifold wisdom of God,
11 according to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord: Eph 3

 

[37818]

Everything that has and will ever take place is decreed/ordained by God for His glory. Not a single atom in the universe moves except as God has purposed for His glory.

The true God is sinless and not responsible for the sin of of others.
James 1:13, . . . Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: . . .

 

[kyredneck]

God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man

Right, He plays Satan and the demons like a banjo string to do it....

 

[KenH]

James 1:13, . . . Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: . . .

1 Samuel 16:14 But the Spirit of the LORD departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from the LORD troubled him.

Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

 

[percho]

And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. Gen 1:2

When the above was the condition of the earth; Where was the great dragon, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan?

Where was Satan? What was God going to do about Satan?

Was man and death required for God's plan for Satan?

Rom 5:12 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested [like Adam], that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Heb 2:6,14 But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man, that thou visitest him?
Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through [the] death he might destroy him that had the power of [the] death, that is, the devil;

Did the devil have any works prior to Genesis 1:2?
Why was darkness in the face of the deep? Was the face of the deep also the face of the waters? What is all the waters on earth spoken of in the following V 6 Gen 1 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.?

Were the heavens of old and the earth standing out of the water and in the water relative to verse 2 of Genesis 1, as stated in 2 Peter 3:5?

If the answer is yes and in IMHO I believe it is, what world of 2 Peter 3:6, world = system of order, configuration as Westcott and Hort translates kosmos, being overflowed with water, perished? Had the devil, Satan been busy before Genesis 1:2?

What is the day of the Lord relative to the above? Has it taken place? Are we in it now? Is it still future?


Before the foundation of the world how was God going to destroy the devil and his works? When was the foundation of the world, not the earth, the world, laid? Is it implied by the Holy Spirit that the world of 2 Peter 3:6 is different than the present world?

 

[Van]

View attachment 9788

This is nonsense, the Fall arranged by God resulted in humanity needing mercy. That mercy came with a high price, the precious blood of Jesus.

The OP explains all this!

 

[Van]

A loaded question.
Arrange meaning what? God as the Creator is to be the cause of sin?

So you thing God as Creator is the author of sin? If not, why insinuate a false doctrine?

 

[Van]

Everything that has and will ever take place is decreed/ordained by God for His glory. Not a single atom in the universe moves except as God has purposed for His glory.

Yet another bit of nonsense, having nothing to do with the topic.

But this much we agree on, when we repent from our fallen state, we bring glory to God.

 

[Van]

SNIP

Filling the page with non-germane scripture adds nothing to a discussion.

The mystery of Christ is not the topic. An explanation from scripture for the purpose of the Fall is the topic. See the OP

 

[Van]

The true God is sinless and not responsible for the sin of of others.
James 1:13, . . . Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: . . .

The God of the Bible is as described in scripture, and not as recreated by the speculation of people.

And your citation of James 1:13 has nothing to do with your claims. The fact God cannot be tempted with evil, does not demonstrate he did not create our harsh environment which does evil in the minds of those whose lives are taken or harmed by natural phenomena.

 

[KenH]

having nothing to do with the topic.

Sure it does. God ordained the fall of Adam for His glory. The cross was not an afterthought or a reaction by God - it was ordained by God from before the world began.

 

[Van]

Sure it does. God ordained the fall of Adam for His glory. The cross was not an afterthought or a reaction by God - it was ordained by God from before the world began.

God did not predestine the Fall, because that would make God the author of sin.

 

[KenH]

God did not predestine the Fall

God did ordain the fall of man, or else He would not have purposed, before the world began, for Christ to die for the sins of those He chose to save from their sins.

 

[Van]

God did ordain the fall of man, or else He would not have purposed, before the world began, for Christ to die for the sins of those He chose to save from their sins.

Fine, even most Calvinist believe God did not predestine Adam's sin.

 

[percho]

What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him? For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels,


Why? This was done pre, "fall," correct? Why was Adam made a little lower than the angels? Adam the figure of him to come, why?

 

[37818]

So you thin[k]
God as Creator is the author of sin?

Not in any way.

If not, why insinuate a false doctrine?

I did no such thing.