Why do people think that Baptists came from AnaBaptists?

[Alan Gross]

Why do ______?

"Baptists".

What "Baptists"?

BINO "Baptists" that adopt the name and precious little or nothing more than the name to go with it that is Biblical, Organizationally, Doctrinally, & Practically?

Or why do "those children of God CALLED-OUT, to ASSEMBLE, and not forsake assembling" ,.... Get It?

The 'get it' is for the Bible definition of The Lord's churches from the time He Founded them, called by many names, with 'Baptist' being significant because of their Authority to Baptise.

".... There are 6,7,8, distinguishing characteristics of The Lord's churches Taught in The Bible."

The definition of 'church' as used in the Bible is where Saved souls should start.

With the proper definition of words, as God Expresses them, doesn't leave room for Satan's false lies about 'churches', beginning with Roman Catholic Civil Union Counterfeit they called "The Church".

That has NOTHING to do with God.

...
That said, lost souls have reason to turn from their sins and toward Jesus.

There is no reason for a lost person to be interested in figuring out The Lord's churches.

Anti- Baptists are concerned, as "Baptists" in name only to oppose "Baptists with The Authority of God to Baptise".

So, when you want a NAME to define the ones who may claim to come from, and/or, have Ana-Baptist Teachings, and wonder why they would think they did, or do: "Ana-Baptists" did not honor pseudo-baptism, alien baptism, mam-made 'baptism of any kind.

They got called' ana' for 're'.

Biblically speaking they Baptised all converts by The Authority of God and those convert HAD NOT BIBLICALLY been 'baptised', SCRIPTURALLY, before.

No matter who TAUGHT they baptised them.
...

Your name, then, is:

Baptists that are "Baptists with The Authority of God to Baptise",

will certainly claim to come from, and/or, claim similar Teachings as Ana-Baptists that were, or are, "Baptists with The Authority of God to Baptise".

 

[Alan Gross]

Regarding a 'candlestick' being to an individual, it would need a verse.

The Shikina Glory as The Presence of God in The Third Person of The Godhead that was Another Comfortor Promised by Jesus, Who Superintends The Lord's churches WOULD BE REMOVED, whether they continued to play church, or not.

1 Samuel 4:21-22 – “Then she named the child Ichabod, saying, “The glory has departed from Israel!” because the ark of God had been captured and because of her father-in-law and her husband. 22 And she said, “The glory has departed from Israel, for the ark of God has been captured.”

 

[Alan Gross]

Baptist History: Baptist History Homepage, A Source for Original Baptist Documents

Anyone claiming the name Baptist may wish to memorize and follow The Lord with regard to His Teachings in The Bible: http://baptisthistoryhomepage.com/hisel.baptist.histry.ntbk.html

To "A Baptist", or even a Forum using that name, "Baptist",

"Baptist History" looks like this:


Index
Chapter 1
Tracing of Baptist History

Chapter 2
Jesus Establishes His Church
Chapter 3
Persecution by The Roman Empire
Nero, 54-68 B.C. 23
Trajan, 98-117 B.C. 25
Septimus Severus 193-211
Decius Trajan, 249-251
Diocletian, 284-316 30
Terrible Days (Many Martyrs' Crowns
Chapter 4
The Montanists 35
Montanists, Origin and Beliefs
Chapter 5
The Novatianists
C. H. Spurgeon 5
Chapter 6
Constantine The Great
Leo I and Boniface III
Flavius Valerius Constantinus, A.D. 306-337
Edict of Milan 6

Chapter 7
The Donatists 71
Quote by J. M. Cramp 72
Identified with Novatians 73 75
Donatist 79
Chapter 8
Paterins, Puritans, Cathari
Paterins, (Patarenes)
Etymology of the Name
Paterines were Baptist
Puritans 86
Cathari
The Cathari were Baptists
Chapter 9
The Paulicians 91
Photius (witness of) 91
Siculus (witness of) 92
Origin, Doctrine, Persecution 93
Paulicians were Baptists 97
Persecuted 98

Con't

 

[Alan Gross]

Chapter 10
Development in the Hierarchy, (Roman Catholic)100
The Sign of the Cross 100
Wax Candles 101
Mother of God 102


Purgatory 103
Origin of Purgatory 104

Chapter 11
Further Development in the Hierarchy,
(Roman Catholic) 106
List of Heresies (45 Listed) 106
Extreme Unction 109
Baptism of Bells 109
Transubstantiation 110
A Roman Miracle? 110
Catholic Church Councils Listed 112
Roman Catholic & Greek Orthodox 114



Chapter 12
Petrobrusians 116
Peter de Bruys 116
Their Doctrine 117
Augustus Neander, (Quoted) 117
Peter de Bruys was a Baptist 118
Information Source 119
Persecution 120



Chapter 13
The Henricians 121
Description of Henry 121
Henry in Mans 122
St. Bernard's Account of Henry's Influence 123
Henry was a Baptist 124
Historians say Henricians were Baptists 126
Persecution 126



Chapter 14
The Arnoldists 128
Orchard's Sketch of Arnold of Brescia 128
Was Arnold a Baptist? 130
Persecuted, Arnold's Martyrdom and Doctrine 131



Chapter 15
The Waldenses 134
Their Name 134


Their Antiquity 134
Historical Testimony 136
Waldenses by Various Names 137
Another Word on their Origin 138
Conclusion 140

Chapter 16
The Waldenses Continued 142
Waldenses Not Protestants 142
Their View on "Antichrist" 143
A Confession of Their Faith, (14 Articles) 144
What the Historians Say 148



Chapter 17
The Waldenses Concluded 150
Milton's Poem 150
Loss of Houses and Goods 151
Everywhere Persecuted 151
Persecuted by the Crusaders 152



Chapter 18
The Albigenses 157
Origin 157
Their Doctrine 157
Their Persecutions 160
A Bright Light in Dark Times 162



Chapter 19
The Ana-Baptists 166
Mosheim's Account 166
Depths of Their Antiquity 168
Ana-Baptist Ancestors 169
Waldenses were Ana-Baptists 170
Ana-Baptist Beliefs 171



Chapter 20
The Bogomils 173
Their Locations 173
Agreed with the Cathari 174


Antiquity of the Bogomils 175
Charges Against Them 176
Quote from J. T. Christian 177
Their Persecution 178

Chapter 21
The Lollards 179
Origin of the Lollards 179
Walter Lollard 180
Spurgeon in Connection with the Lollards 181
Their Doctrines 183
Their Persecutions 184



Chapter 22
The Bohemian & Moravian Brethren 188
Description of the Land 188
The Gospel in Bohemia 188
Peter Waldo 189
Called "Waldensians" 190
John Huss 190
Robert Robinson 192
Two Classes of Brethren 192
Their Persecution 192



Chapter 23
The Picards & Beghards 195
Picards or Pickard 195
Bohemia 196
Maximillian II 196
Doctrine of the Picards 196
The Beghards 198




Chapter 24
Ana-Baptists and the Reformation 201
God's Overruling Providence 202
The Good Doesn't Last 202
Illustrations of Reform Doctrine 203
Ana-Baptist Doctrine, Its Antiquity 204


Church Truth 205
Conclusion 206

Chapter 25
Ana-Baptists and the Reformation Continued 209
Christianity not a Culture 209
Constantine 210
The Reformation Continues 210
Same Problems 210
Religious Force 211
Luther's Choice 212
Church Requirements 212
Salvation by Faith Alone 213
Non-Public Worship 214



Chapter 26
Ana-Baptist and the Reformation Concluded 216
The Peace between Catholics and Reformers 216
The Peace of Augsburg (1555) 216
The Peace of Westphalia (1648) 217
Lutheran Persecution 217
Luther, A Persecutor 218
Death Warrants 219
John Calvin, A Persecutor 220
The Reformers all Alike 221
Conclusion 222



Chapter 27
The Ana-Baptists of Munster 223
W. A. Jarrel, Quote of their Diversity 223
The Munster Disorders 224
Common Sense, (not Ana-Baptist of the Ordinary
Sort) 226
Ana-Baptists Denial 226
Martyr's Testimony, (Condemnation of the Acts
Committed at Munster) 227
Non-Baptist Vindication 228
Conclusion 229


Chapter 28
The Welsh Baptists 231
The Gospel of Wales 231
Concerning Paul 231
Claudia, (Princess of Wales, Convert of Paul?)232
Baptists Alone 233
Were Ancient World Christians Baptist? 235
David Benedict's Quote concerning 236
Conclusion 237
Bibliography 239
Waldensian Confessions of Faith
Confession of 1120 247

 

[Alan Gross]

This link gives a good comparison

The answer is here:

Baptist History Notebook, By Berlin Hisel

 

[timtofly]

Matthew 21:25
"The immersion of John — where did it come from? From Heaven or from a human source?”

This question was never answered.

 

[Alan Gross]

Matthew 21:25
"The immersion of John — where did it come from? From Heaven or from a human source?”

This question was never answered.

Lost people aren't into verifying what they believe to be The Authority of John's Baptism, as a man Sent from God The Father, to Baptiste.

U?

 

[timtofly]

Lost people aren't into verifying what they believe to be The Authority of John's Baptism, as a man Sent from God The Father, to Baptiste.
U?

No one needs to verify baptism as an authority. Nor done in authority. That is the point. The act of Baptism is being obedient, but there is nothing significant nor of authority in the act itself. Baptism can only remove dirt, because it is just washing of water.

John the Baptist had a ministry of repentance and preparation of the coming of Christ. Baptizing in the Jordan seems to be the only thing he was remembered for.

 

[Alan Gross]

No one needs to verify baptism as an authority. Nor done in authority. That is the point. The act of Baptism is being obedient, but there is nothing significant nor of authority in the act itself. Baptism can only remove dirt, because it is just washing of water.

John the Baptist had a ministry of repentance and preparation of the coming of Christ. Baptizing in the Jordan seems to be the only thing he was remembered for.

Yes, the position these Lost religious people took in The Bible, who weren't into verifying what they believe to be The Authority of John's Baptism, as a man Sent from God The Father, to Baptise, is the denial of God The Father, God The Son, & The Holy Spirit who Saved, Sent, Gave, and Superintended The Authority to Baptise, in Matthew 21:25 "The baptism of John, whence was it? from heaven, or of men? And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say unto us, Why did ye not then believe him? "who Saved, Sent, Gave, and Superintended The Authority to Baptise that John possessed then, and that has Followed All of The churches that Jesus Built, since that Time.

Authority in Baptism is the Ultimate Hallmark of All of The Biblically Organized churches that Have Come from The First One Jesus Divinely Founded, Planted, and Promised to Be with until The End of The Age.

In addition to a denial of God The Father, God The Son, & The Holy Spirit who Saved, Sent, Gave, and Superintended The Authority to Baptise that John possessed then, and that has Followed All of The churches that Jesus Built, since that Time, any current denial of The Authority of John's Baptism, as a man Sent from God The Father, to Baptise, is also a pure denial of The Bible, from the one quoted; Matthew 21:25 "The baptism of John, whence was it? from heaven, or of men? And they reasoned with themselves, saying If we shall say, From heaven; he will say unto us, Why did ye not then believe him?"

The Authority of John's Baptism, as a man Sent from God The Father, to Baptise, Matters to God The Father, God The Son, & The Holy Spirit.

The Bible Teaches in many places to Repent and be baptized. That is a Command. That Baptism is not any Baptism. It is The Baptism of John.

Everyone known to have been saved in the New Testament has a record of having been baptized by The Authority of God, in John's Baptism.

Jesus Walked 40 to 60 miles in order to be baptized by John.

In order to fashion false churches having nothing to do with The churches Jesus Built and Promised to Be with through the Indwelling Presence of The Holy Spirit and to forgo and be oblivious to what a church is, or what makes a New Testament church, or most all major Bible Doctrines, people say it doesn't matter.

Jesus Died for His churches, in the Special Spiritual Union Becoming Diety, to Bring Forth BABIES, in The Marriage relationship to Him.

Jesus Loved His church and Gave Himself for her.

With a proper, non-flippant-carnal-denial, and Scriptural understanding of The Bible, Satan's lies of what The Bible about churches will not hold up.

The children He Calls Out to be Scripturally Baptized Honor and Worship God, in and through His Churches.

Unto God be Glory, in the churches.

In Ephesians 1, GOD THE FATHER Placed JESUS CHRIST as The Head of The church:

19 "And what is the exceeding greatness of His power toward us who believe, according to the working of His mighty power,

20 "Which He wrought in Christ, when He raised Him from the dead, and set Him at His own right hand in the heavenly places,

21 "Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age {world}, but also in that which is to come;

22 "And hath put all things under His feet,
and gave Him to be the head over all things to the church,

23 "Which is His body, the fullness of Him that filleth all in all."

In Ephesians 2 God Gives an Architectural Metephor of His Building in which He Dwells, i.e., His assemblies:

19 "Now, therefore, ye are no more strangers and sojourners {foreigners}, but fellow-citizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

20 "And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief corner Stone,

21 "In Whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord;

22 "In Whom ye also are built together for an habitation of God through the Spirit."

In Ephesians 3, God Says that is How and Where He is Worshipped;

20 "Now unto Him Who is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that worketh in us,

21 "Unto Him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen."



Ephesians is about The Lord's churches, that are Scripturally Baptised, Saved Individuals, who Congregate as they are Commanded in The New Testament.


And The Harlot Daughters of The Great Whore DO NOT CARE.

 

[timtofly]

With a proper, non-flippant-carnal-denial, and Scriptural understanding of The Bible, Satan's lies of what The Bible about churches will not hold up.

Except the harlot kept John's Baptism front and center, giving it to infants, keeping the lie that water seals. Only the baptism of the Holy Spirit can do that. And God seals us in the womb at conception. Why do you think the modern versions changed the baptism of the Holy Spirit to immersion?
Explain how sprinkling is immersion? Not to take it lightly, but water baptism is not Holy Spirit water. John the Baptist understood what water immersion was. Philip in the desert with the Ethiopian knew what is was. Jesus did not baptize. He did allow his disciples to, because they all knew what it does. All disciples and apostles knew what it was. Only the Reformation did not know what it was, because they only knew what the church they were trying to reform taught them. Not many today know or accept the truth. Except perhaps the Baptist and those who hold to Baptist doctrine. Even Catholics can accept Baptist doctrine. They may not practice it.

 

[Alan Gross]

Except the harlot kept John's Baptism front and center, giving it to infants, keeping the lie that water seals. Only the baptism of the Holy Spirit can do that. And God seals us in the womb at conception. Why do you think the modern versions changed the baptism of the Holy Spirit to immersion?
Explain how sprinkling is immersion? Not to take it lightly, but water baptism is not Holy Spirit water. John the Baptist understood what water immersion was. Philip in the desert with the Ethiopian knew what is was. Jesus did not baptize. He did allow his disciples to, because they all knew what it does. All disciples and apostles knew what it was. Only the Reformation did not know what it was, because they only knew what the church they were trying to reform taught them. Not many today know or accept the truth. Except perhaps the Baptist and those who hold to Baptist doctrine. Even Catholics can accept Baptist doctrine. They may not practice it.

It is a perfect example of my premise, "With a proper, non-flippant-carnal-denial, and Scriptural understanding of The Bible, Satan's lies of what The Bible about churches will not hold up", for you to state, "baptism of the Holy Spirit".

Perfect.

PERFECT.

Also: "the harlot kept John's Baptism"

Also: "John's Baptism front and center, giving it to infants"

...
This I do not know what it means: "And God seals us in the womb at conception".


...

Now, this seems almost Rock Solid ...
.....except.... when you are saying 'baptism' in this paragraph and saying that they knew "what it was" was___?

What? are you saying the baptism was?

...and what baptism 'does'?

re:

"Why do you think the modern versions changed the baptism of the Holy Spirit to immersion?"

"Explain how sprinkling is immersion?"

"Not to take it lightly, but water baptism is not Holy Spirit water."

"John the Baptist understood what water immersion was."

"Philip in the desert with the Ethiopian knew what is was."

"Jesus did not baptize".

"He did allow his disciples to because they all knew what it does."

"All disciples and apostles knew what it was."

...

Again, your thinking on 'what it was' is___?

"Only the Reformation did not know what it was, because they only knew what the church they were trying to reform taught them."

 

[Alan Gross]

Except the harlot kept John's Baptism front and center, giving it to infants, keeping the lie that water seals. Only the baptism of the Holy Spirit can do that. And God seals us in the womb at conception. Why do you think the modern versions changed the baptism of the Holy Spirit to immersion?
Explain how sprinkling is immersion? Not to take it lightly, but water baptism is not Holy Spirit water. John the Baptist understood what water immersion was. Philip in the desert with the Ethiopian knew what is was. Jesus did not baptize. He did allow his disciples to, because they all knew what it does. All disciples and apostles knew what it was. Only the Reformation did not know what it was, because they only knew what the church they were trying to reform taught them. Not many today know or accept the truth. Except perhaps the Baptist and those who hold to Baptist doctrine. Even Catholics can accept Baptist doctrine. They may not practice it.

(I am going to be Loving this if you have a 'Teachable Spirit", and since you understand that Christianity did not begin in the 16th century, God Has you right in position to LEARN, from an OLD SAGE, hopefully.

If you can be taken from what you are saying to God's Proper Interpretation, you will flip out.

We'll see.

It takes God to Do It.

Ask Him, if you will.

"God, 'I don't know;

what does this guy think he knows...'

MAYBE N O T H I N G,

and tell Him, you just want to know the Truth,
and you and He Can Get it, to WORSHIP HIM.)

 

[timtofly]

Knowing the Truth can only be God’s Will. Satan just wants us to know lies.

 

[Alan Gross]

Knowing the Truth can only be God’s Will. Satan just wants us to know lies.

It is a perfect example of my premise, "With a proper, non-flippant-carnal-denial, and Scriptural understanding of The Bible, Satan's lies of what The Bible about churches will not hold up", for you to state, "baptism of the Holy Spirit".

Not to duke things out about various subjects, but to look for "With a proper, non-flippant-carnal-denial, and Scriptural understanding of The Bible, Satan's lies" don't hold up.

With that, I continue with the notion for you to consider that, "there is no such thing as Holy Spirit Baptism".

If that is true, then there won't be any actual Bible Teaching on it and once the Lord's Message is seen, then the passages and parts of them that appear to some as if they show "Baptism of The Holy Spirit" can be dismissed as Satanically influenced.

If that is not too hard for us, God Can Be Praised by His Revelation of what those passages say.

 

[timtofly]

Only the Holy Spirit can reveal what the Holy Spirit Wills.