Why does God Allow Christians to Suffer

[Charles Perkins]

The problem that I have witnessed is that some churches are built on the assumption that lack of suffering is the reward of obeying the church. If the suffering person has been taught wrong, and then asks for clarification about these church beliefs during the suffering process, and is then told that their suffering is a result of their sin and maybe they were never saved at all, and maybe not even eligible to be saved, it is hard to keep faith. And yes I have seen this done, blatantly and subtly, in multiple churches.

One of the primary symptoms of PTSD is lack of faith. I think modern medicine has this a bit backwards. I think that when a person is able to keep their faith, they are far more resilient to PTSD. I think when the person's previous training did not correctly prepare them for suffering, they are more vulnerable.

Statistically, Christians are as likely to lose their faith during PTSD as any other religion. Researchers are not seeing anything different about American Christians, in faith loss, or immunity to PTSD. Caregivers will expect Christians to falter in exactly the same way as people of other or no faith. I believe this to be an indication of a widespread problem within the American church.

I've seen some of this as well. It is a shame that it is this way and worse it is a millstone that makes it more challenging to some that do come to God especially those new to the faith. We are all human, but as Christians one hopes that we are drawing closer to God and listening to the Holy Spirit.

 

[Charles Perkins]

God has this to say about suffering as well.

1 Peter 4:12-3 God tells us not to think it strange concerning the fiery trial which will try us as though a strange thing befell us, rather to rejoice that we may be a partaker in Christ's suffering.

Proverbs 17:3 Like silver and gold God tries the hearts of his children.

Though God allows suffering we also should remember Psalms 140:12-3 The Lord is with those that are afflicted he maintains there cause, he holds them up. God maintains the right of the poor.

Also

Isaiah 49:13-7

Revelation 3:19 God chastens the ones he loves

 

[kathleenmariekg]

Reading through the prophets with McGee's Thru the Bible radio program has been life changing. If I had had access to this material when I was losing my faith, my life would have taken a very different path.

I need to let that go, and understand that if God had wanted me to follow that path, he would have made it happen. I guess he wanted me to take this long side-trip and return as a prodigal, with a heart for the prodigals that I never would have had otherwise.

 

[Charles Perkins]

Reading through the prophets with McGee's Thru the Bible radio program has been life changing. If I had had access to this material when I was losing my faith, my life would have taken a very different path.

I need to let that go, and understand that if God had wanted me to follow that path, he would have made it happen. I guess he wanted me to take this long side-trip and return as a prodigal, with a heart for the prodigals that I never would have had otherwise.

I think side trips as you describe are far more common than we might believe. I know I lost heart in God as well for a number of years. For me it was a serious trial that brought me back to God. My life had fell apart nearly completely. There was nearly nothing I could do on my own to change my circumstances. At the time I went to God in prayer I asked him to let me die. God had other plans though which took four and a half years to come to fruition.

 

[kathleenmariekg]

I think side trips as you describe are far more common than we might believe. I know I lost heart in God as well for a number of years. For me it was a serious trial that brought me back to God. My life had fell apart nearly completely. There was nearly nothing I could do on my own to change my circumstances. At the time I went to God in prayer I asked him to let me die. God had other plans though which took four and a half years to come to fruition.

There is so much going on that is bigger than human understanding and we try to wrestle what we see into something something simpler and more modern and more human-centric than things are.

 

[Van]

I think the OP actually answered the question. Why is there so much hardship in our world? First our harsh environment facilitates the lost seeking God as a refuge. Second, another cause of suffering is the evil people do. And we have our autonomous ability to choose to go with God, or our own way, and so God's plan of redemption, choosing those who love God, requires allowing limited choice. And finally, what about the suffering of those who have been born anew? Like Job, their response provides witness for being "all in" for God.

My Great Grandmother was a Christian lady, who had prayed for her grandchildren every day. Yet, she had cancer and was wasting away almost alone, in her bed in a small Colorado town. She prayed to God that she had suffered enough and for God to take her. Yet she continued to suffer. And she continued to pray....

Now she is in a place where there are no more tears... Praise God

 

[AustinC]

The great thing is that God never abandons his children. Though we walk away and squander our inheritance on ourselves, yet God waits, and even goes to get his lost sheep, because he has promised "never will I leave you nor will I forsake you."

God may ordain suffering for a season according to his perfect plan. We will be required to carry the cross when we follow our King. We will be hated by those who hate our King. Yet, God has promised us the crown of life.

We are strengthened, not by our experience, but by our faith, which is made strong by our theology (knowledge of God). When we know what God reveals regarding his character and trust this truth, we are strengthened in the fight.

God is good all the time and all the time God is good.

 

[Charles Perkins]

There is so much going on that is bigger than human understanding and we try to wrestle what we see into something something simpler and more modern and more human-centric than things are.

For me I was like a seed found in the rocks at first. Later God in his mercy allowed a crow to come by and carry my withering remains to good soil. God as the master gardener in his mercy then watered me with his living waters and fed me. My recovery was slow. I'm grateful that God is so patient and longsuffering after all he could have let me die for some reason all his own he did not. Instead he patiently instructed me and helped me to see that I lacked understanding even in the principles of his truth.

I can't tell you how many miracles God performed on the way, they were many. I doubt that most would believe me if I told them what God did. In the beginning I thought I knew what faith was, but come to realize that I had no idea. Several times I was disappointed, and the were heart wrenching disappointments. Yet God used them to show me that faith was much more than what I thought it to be. God can do the impossible if you let him. I was a withered plant, I had let strength especially at that time, yet God provided for what I lacked.

Suffering is never easy, but can have great rewards if you let God help you through the ordeal.

 

[Charles Perkins]

We are told that Christ learned obedience by the things which he suffered in the flesh Hebrews 5:7-8. If Christ learned obedience in this way we as Christ followers must consider this in our trials. God wants us to grow in faith and love. Suffering also reminds us how frail and weak we are on our own, how much we need God in all that we do.

 

[Sai]

We are told that Christ learned obedience by the things which he suffered in the flesh Hebrews 5:7-8. If Christ learned obedience in this way we as Christ followers must consider this in our trials. God wants us to grow in faith and love. Suffering also reminds us how frail and weak we are on our own, how much we need God in all that we do.

Jesus is God Charles.

The very definition of forgiveness is one word. Suffering.

When a sin is committed axiomatically a debt is created. That debt will ultimately always be paid. Either the offender pays for it or the offended party pays for the debt because the debt remains.

When a person pays for the wrong committed against them by someone else what they are doing or saying is “you are no longer liable for damaging me” and “I am going to replace what was taken from me by paying for it myself.” That is the epitome of suffering.

When David cut the robe of Saul David continued to suffer by Saul’s previous actions and his future ones. But David took no pleasure upon hearing of the death of Saul, David chose to endure the emotional spiritual and psychological damage Saul had inflicted upon him and he endured that pain silently and willingly.

In this example if David were to have celebrated the death of Saul then David would not truly have forgiven him because in that intellectual disloyalty and in that moment David would not have owned all of the things that Saul had done to David and had taken from David. Thus in order to forgive anything suffering is required and experienced.


Joy unspeakable full of glory

 

[Charles Perkins]

Jesus is God Charles.

The very definition of forgiveness is one word. Suffering.

Can you give me a source for this. I didn't find any Hebrew and Greek words for forgiveness with a nuance of suffering. Is their a dictionary that defines it in this way or some other reference that leads you to that conclusion.

Jesus is God Charles

Yes he is, Christ though was flesh and blood for a short time. We know that Christ didn't sin yet he did suffer. Not all suffering is a result of sin.

When a sin is committed axiomatically a debt is created. That debt will ultimately always be paid. Either the offender pays for it or the offended party pays for the debt because the debt remains.

When a person pays for the wrong committed against them by someone else what they are doing or saying is “you are no longer liable for damaging me” and “I am going to replace what was taken from me by paying for it myself.” That is the epitome of suffering.

When David cut the robe of Saul David continued to suffer by Saul’s previous actions and his future ones. But David took no pleasure upon hearing of the death of Saul, David chose to endure the emotional spiritual and psychological damage Saul had inflicted upon him and he endured that pain silently and willingly.

In this example if David were to have celebrated the death of Saul then David would not truly have forgiven him because in that intellectual disloyalty and in that moment David would not have owned all of the things that Saul had done to David and had taken from David. Thus in order to forgive anything suffering is required and experienced.


Joy unspeakable full of glory

Sin most certainly leads to suffering and ultimately to death. Are you saying that all suffering is the result of sin and requires forgiveness?

 

[evenifigoalone]

There was a time in my life when I was suicidal and just in a very very dark place. I feel like God allowed me to go through that so that I could help others and understand what others may go through better.

 

[Charles Perkins]

There was a time in my life when I was suicidal and just in a very very dark place. I feel like God allowed me to go through that so that I could help others and understand what others may go through better.

It is much easier to bring comfort and understanding to others when you have been there yourself. Empathy is hard won, but I imagine that you have been quite a blessing to others that were suffering these kinds of thoughts and tendencies. Suicide seems to be on the rise and perhaps God has prepared you to help combat this.

 

[Charles Perkins]

Suffering is not pleasant by any means while we go through it, yet the Bible tells us it works good. But I know there are times one might feel like someone else's tool that is well used and abused.



Thankfully God works good, if we let him. We are told that we learn patience in suffering. Patience is a great quality that we need in dealing with others. With patience we can help others far less fortunate than us.

 

[Sai]

Yes he is, Christ though was flesh and blood for a short time. We know that Christ didn't sin yet he did suffer. Not all suffering is a result of sin.

Who paid the debt created by sin? Then Christ suffered not for his own sin but for the sin of the world. Therefore he suffered because forgiveness requires it.


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[Charles Perkins]

Who paid the debt created by sin? Then Christ suffered not for his own sin but for the sin of the world. Therefore he suffered because forgiveness requires it.


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Are you asking for other examples? None is without sin except Christ. Is it one's own sin that leads a father to abuse his wife or children? One can say that sin is the root cause of all suffering, but that doesn't explain why God allows suffering to begin with.

Can we say that we know with all certainty that it was sin that lead to an illness? What about a baby born addicted to heroin or crack? Sure we can say it was the sin of the mother or perhaps others, but these are not direct causes.

In any case this not explain why God allows suffering.

 

[Sai]

Are you asking for other examples? None is without sin except Christ. Is it one's own sin that leads a father to abuse his wife or children? One can say that sin is the root cause of all suffering, but that doesn't explain why God allows suffering to begin with.

Can we say that we know with all certainty that it was sin that lead to an illness? What about a baby born addicted to heroin or crack? Sure we can say it was the sin of the mother or perhaps others, but these are not direct causes.

In any case this not explain why God allows suffering.

If the epitome of forgiving is defined as suffering perhaps that’s the reason so men can learn pain suffering and forgiveness


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[Charles Perkins]

Galatians 6:1-10
Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another’s burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. For if anyone thinks he is something, when he is nothing, he deceives himself. But let each one test his own work, and then his reason to boast will be in himself alone and not in his neighbor. For each will have to bear his own load. Let the one who is taught the word share all good things with the one who teaches. Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap. For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption, but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life. And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up. So then, as we have opportunity, let us do good to everyone, and especially to those who are of the household of faith.

It is the sin that we are rebuking and looking to restore the individual in the spirit of gentleness. I believe that you understand this, but I just wanted to clarify it in case it is misunderstood. God is our judge and even he is waiting for that judgment. God allows trials and difficulties so that we can overcome.

Sometimes as Christians we may be weak in a matter. Another brother or sister out of love and humility should help such an individual to see their weakness. In love we are not condemning the individual, but rather seeking out of love and humility with a spirit of gentleness to aid the individual to repent, change and overcome.

 

[AustinC]

It is the sin that we are rebuking and looking to restore the individual in the spirit of gentleness. I believe that you understand this, but I just wanted to clarify it in case it is misunderstood. God is our judge and even he is waiting for that judgment. God allows trials and difficulties so that we can overcome.

Sometimes as Christians we may be weak in a matter. Another brother or sister out of love and humility should help such an individual to see their weakness. In love we are not condemning the individual, but rather seeking out of love and humility with a spirit of gentleness to aid the individual to repent, change and overcome.

2 Samuel 12:13
David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die.

"Adonai has put away your sin; you shall not die."
What a powerful statement of God's grace toward David. God allows (ordains) all the events with Bathsheba and Uriah to take place. God, right after the verse I shared, tells David that his son, from Bathsheba, would die, yet God chooses to "put away David's sin." There are many parallels to our own lives as God ordains events to happen in our lives. Yet, because God has adopted us, God also chooses to put away our sin.

Romans 8:25-39
But if we hope for what we do not see, we wait for it with patience. Likewise the Spirit helps us in our weakness. For we do not know what to pray for as we ought, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words. And he who searches hearts knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose. For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified. What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things? Who shall bring any charge against God’s elect? It is God who justifies. Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died—more than that, who was raised—who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword? As it is written, “For your sake we are being killed all the day long; we are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered.” No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

 

[Charles Perkins]

Who paid the debt created by sin? Then Christ suffered not for his own sin but for the sin of the world.


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Christ paid the debt for sin and it was necessary that Christ die for our sins. It was an act of love and forgiveness. Many suffer for sins of their own and not of their own. Sin is not always the direct cause of suffering though. God gives reasons for why he allows suffering. I quoted one which referred to Christ, and because we are followers of Christ it applies to us. We learn obedience through suffering.

1 John 3:23 This is the commandment to believe on the name of Christ and love one another. It is good to read the entire context of 1 John 3 to get the full picture.

This obedience is to act in faith and love.

Therefore he suffered because forgiveness requires it .

A baby suffers when it's mother uses drugs and alcohol your conclusion leads one to believe that this baby's suffering was because forgives requires it which doesn't make sense. This is why I asked for clarity earlier. I'm trying to understand your assertion.

Sin is the root cause of all suffering whether our own or another's, but this doesn't really explain why God allows suffering. A cause is not really a reason.