why I am not a Calvinist

[Van]

2 Thessalonians 2:13 says individuals are chosen for salvation through faith in the truth. This is just another verse Calvinism must rewrite and restructure so that we are not chosen through faith in the truth.

 

[Reformed1689]

2 Thessalonians 2:13 says individuals are chosen for salvation through faith in the truth. This is just another verse Calvinism must rewrite and restructure so that we are not chosen through faith in the truth.

Here we go again...

 

[Van]

Here we go again...

Twaddle on with denial of the obvious

 

[Reformed1689]

Twaddle on with denial of the obvious

His favorite word because he has no actual arguments or rebuttals to our assertions and reverts to this whenever we poke holes in his theology and logic.

 

[Van]

His favorite word because he has no actual arguments or rebuttals to our assertions and reverts to this whenever we poke holes in his theology and logic.

Yet another off topic against the man post.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

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[37818]

Yes, I did.
I'll list the passage that I believe that you are referring to:

"Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice." ( John 18:37 ).


The way I see this stating, Jesus is telling Pilate that He was sent to bear witness of "the truth"... Himself ( John 5:31, John 8:14 ).
Pilate asks Him in the very next verse, " Pilate saith unto him, What is truth?" ( John 18:38 )
The Lord does not reply, because, to me, He already has said what He wanted to say for the benefit of the reader ( John 20:30-31 ), His sheep, knowing that it would be inspired of the Holy Ghost for John to write down.

I see the Lord speaking, once again, spiritually ( please see John 6:63 ), not carnally...
Not according to the "natural" man's understanding, but according to the "spiritual" man's.
The born-again reader of His spiritual words.

Purposefully not giving Pilate answers that he would understand, is fully within His right to answer or not to answer, as He is God and is beholden to no man's examining of Him... or us even asking, "what doest thou?" ( Romans 9:19-20, Daniel 4:35 ).

In addition, I see the Lord "being evasive" and speaking spiritual things in the parables to others...
Why?
Because they are "without".

" And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all [these] things are done in parables:" ( Mark 4:11 )
To them that are "without" ( outside the body of Christ ), all things are done in parables to conceal the truth from them.

Pontius Pilate was, "without".
Christ then chose to speak to him in this way.
Why?
Again, because it is God's prerogative to hide or reveal Himself to whosoever He wishes ( Matthew 11:27, Luke 10:22 ), to be gracious and merciful to whomsoever He wishes ( Exodus 33:19, Romans 9:14-16 ).


Having established that, I see this:
He is telling Pilate that everyone who is "of God"/ "of the truth" ( "of Christ", of His body ), "hears" His voice...and they do ( John 10:27 ).
That is why I made the connection with John 8:47.

"He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear [them] not, because ye are not of God."


God's blessings to you.

Then I need to ask you this, do you see a person by being on their own open to hear truth as giving God permission?

 

[37818]

God from the beginning...the beginning of what?

Has chosen you to salvation.....who was chosen?

How are those chosen from the beginning? Unqualified, would be any time after eternity. Those being chosen are certainly after the creation of mankind. In time.

 

[37818]

2 Thessalonians 2:13 says individuals are chosen for salvation through faith in the truth. This is just another verse Calvinism must rewrite and restructure so that we are not chosen through faith in the truth.

Not solely. But "in sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: Whereunto (eis) he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ."

 

[Iconoclast]

How are those chosen from the beginning? Unqualified, would be any time after eternity. Those being chosen are certainly after the creation of mankind. In time.

Scripture indicates another time, in fact before creation;
9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

 

[37818]

Scripture indicates another time, in fact before creation;
9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

2 Timothy 1:9; The promise Titus 1:2. And the group election before, Ephesians 1:4, which God foreknew in the sanctification of the Spirit of His elect in time 1 Peter 1:1-2; 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14. Of course God's omniscience in this has no beginning.

 

[Iconoclast]

2 Timothy 1:9; The promise Titus 1:2. And the group election before, Ephesians 1:4, which God foreknew in the sanctification of the Spirit of His elect in time 1 Peter 1:1-2; 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14. Of course God's omniscience in this has no beginning.

Foreknowledge of persons in particular...is different from His overall Omniscience
It is of individuals, not an undefined group.

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

 

[Reformed1689]

Foreknowledge of persons in particular...is different from His overall Omniscience
It is of individuals, not an undefined group.

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Yes, foreknew, not foresaw. Two totally different things. And of course he predestined them BEFORE calling them. It was never a looking down the tunnel, it was always a pre-planned event.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

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