Why Should I Feel Threatened by Gay Marriage?

TisHerself · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by Plain Old Bill:
It has always been hate the sin and love the sinners.You cannot condone sinful behavior.You especially cannot give sinful behavior a liscense which is what "a gay marriage " would be. Is anyone here proposing that pastors perform these ceremonies?
Have our more liberal minded brothers and sisters done much study about what the Bible has to say about homosexual behavior?If you have that should be enough to settle in your mind that there is no such thing as a God sanctioned homosexual marriage.

No one here has said anything about a God sanctioned marriage between homosexuals! Exactly the opposite! There is no such thing as a God sanctioned homosexual marriage and you know it!! What is the harm in letting them have a civil marriage? Who does that harm exactly? We don't condone it and never will, so what's the problem? If they want to be homosexuals, there is nothing we can do about it. We cannot stop sin! All we can do is show love through our actions, period.

And furthermore, I greatly resent all the calling of people 'liberals'!!! It falls like poison... as if it were a sin! God gave me the right to decide for myself as he gave all people. We cannot take that right away from anyone and we are foolish to think we can! Isn't it much better to present ourselves and Christianity as a loving people who are there to care for all, sinner and saint alike? Didn't Christ stop people from stoning the woman at the well? Come on! This is not a new concept! Don't you think God loves homosexuals?

Hardsheller · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Hardsheller:
TisHerself,

It is a big jump from saying that Homosexuality is a Sin or that any Action is a Sin to actually being ProActive in the Church by Celebrating that sin or condoning it.

I personally have had homosexuals who were members of my church. We did not treat them differently from other members.

No person who is living openly in sin is qualified to be a church leader, be it alcoholism, wife abuse, or thievery. All should be held accountable for the Church and called to task for their sins.

Who said anything about celebrating sin??? That is rediculous! I've never said any such thing!

What I want to celebrate is a human life. A child of God. Now, I don't know if that lifestyle is a chosen path or not, I don't think so. Who would want that kind of persecution?? But I'll never, ever say I am better than a homosexual either. We all sin and fall short of the glory of God. If you break one commandment, you may as well have broken them all. We all need the compassion of our brothers and sisters! It's not fair to pick and choose. [/QUOTE]I'm certainly not saying that I'm better than homosexuals. We are all sinners.

What I am saying is that I do not in any shape, fashoin or form, condone Homosexual Marriage, Homosexual activity, or the Homosexual lifestyle.

I am opposed to it, Period.
I believe it is Sin, Period.
I believe it is unnatural behavior, period.
I will vote against Homosexual Marriage anytime it's on the ballot.

That is my belief about the matter as a Christian and that is my right under the Constitution of the United States.

carpro · Jul 6, 2005

Just a thought...

If a homosexual repents of their sins and accepts Christ as their savior, but has no intention of ceasing homosexual acts...are they really saved?

TisHerself · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by Hardsheller:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Hardsheller:
TisHerself,

It is a big jump from saying that Homosexuality is a Sin or that any Action is a Sin to actually being ProActive in the Church by Celebrating that sin or condoning it.

I personally have had homosexuals who were members of my church. We did not treat them differently from other members.

No person who is living openly in sin is qualified to be a church leader, be it alcoholism, wife abuse, or thievery. All should be held accountable for the Church and called to task for their sins.

Who said anything about celebrating sin??? That is rediculous! I've never said any such thing!

What I want to celebrate is a human life. A child of God. Now, I don't know if that lifestyle is a chosen path or not, I don't think so. Who would want that kind of persecution?? But I'll never, ever say I am better than a homosexual either. We all sin and fall short of the glory of God. If you break one commandment, you may as well have broken them all. We all need the compassion of our brothers and sisters! It's not fair to pick and choose. [/QUOTE]I'm certainly not saying that I'm better than homosexuals. We are all sinners.

What I am saying is that I do not in any shape, fashoin or form, condone Homosexual Marriage, Homosexual activity, or the Homosexual lifestyle.

I am opposed to it, Period.
I believe it is Sin, Period.
I believe it is unnatural behavior, period.
I will vote against Homosexual Marriage anytime it's on the ballot.

That is my belief about the matter as a Christian and that is my right under the Constitution of the United States. [/QUOTE]That is certainly your perogative. I choose not to vote at all in such matters. It is none of my concern. I am not a homosexual and I believe as you do that it is sin, but they have every right to a civil union if that is what they want. They have the right to sin, as do all sinners. God gave that right to them and none of us can take that away... that is what we are here for. If God had wanted to impose his laws on everyone, he would have. And we would all be in heaven instead of here on Earth.

Those people are still going to live together as spouses, regardless. Live with it.

TisHerself · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by carpro:
Just a thought...

If a homosexual repents of their sins and accepts Christ as their savior, but has no intention of ceasing homosexual acts...are they really saved?

That is none of our concern. That is between the individual and God. Our only concern is behaving in a loving and kind way towards that person. Clearly that person has the desire and the need for salvation. Constantly telling that person they are sinning would only make matters worse. Say it once, certainly. But let it be known that this is a matter between oneself and God. It's no one else's business!

Plain Old Bill · Jul 6, 2005

Well TisHerself,
I think I have read most of your 81 posts across the board. I think I understand something about you based on those entries. So let's just cut to the chase. First you did'nt read the part about hate the sin and love the sinner. You just jumped on your little agenda wagon and attacked like I've seen you do across the board. therefore why don't you just tell us what to think and we'll just do as you say and think as you tell us.

TisHerself · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by Plain Old Bill:
Well TisHerself,
I think I have read most of your 81 posts across the board. I think I understand something about you based on those entries. So let's just cut to the chase. First you did'nt read the part about hate the sin and love the sinner. You just jumped on your little agenda wagon and attacked like I've seen you do across the board. therefore why don't you just tell us what to think and we'll just do as you say and think as you tell us.

Yes, PlainOldBill, you gave lip-service to love the sinner hate the sin, but the rest of what you say is in no way loving. Why would anyone want to be a Christian when all they see from us is no compassion and only hate? They don't understand the love the sinner hate the sin deal. It is our job to show them by our actions. Lip-service is enough to be spit from God's mouth because we are lukewarm.

carpro · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by carpro:
Just a thought...

If a homosexual repents of their sins and accepts Christ as their savior, but has no intention of ceasing homosexual acts...are they really saved?

That is none of our concern. That is between the individual and God. Our only concern is behaving in a loving and kind way towards that person. Clearly that person has the desire and the need for salvation. Constantly telling that person they are sinning would only make matters worse. Say it once, certainly. But let it be known that this is a matter between oneself and God. It's no one else's business! [/QUOTE]Is that a yes or a no?

Plain Old Bill · Jul 6, 2005

Nor is it hateful, it is nuetral.I work with some homosexuals, none of them would tell you I treat them poorly, nor do I ignore them.
I merely asked a question. I have come to use the term left because left is seldom right(correct).My beliefs are based on the Bible which I think is a reasonable thing for a christian to do.
But now with your great wisdom and assistance I not only know what to do and think, I also know how to feel about myself, for that I am grateful.

Bro. James Reed · Jul 6, 2005

TH, If someone is going to be a Christian, it is because God will reveal the truth to them. It isn't because the rest of us said or did anything. You give us way too much power.

Also, we can love people without coddling them and treating them as if their behavior is okay.

When I would disobey my parents as a child, they would scold me, tell me I did wrong, and in many cases, spank me, but I know now that it was done in a loving manner.

A child who doesn't know right from wrong has to be taught from those who do. The same goes for someone living in the world. How can we expect them to know that their behavior is wrong if we refuse to tell them, and instead give them extra rights to make sure they are comfortable in our society?

They have the exact same rights as all of the rest of us. They do have the right to get married, just like the rest of us. They don't have a right to marry the same sex, just like the rest of us do not have that right. They are being denied nothing that the rest of us have. We are all equal before the law, and that is what civil rights are.

TisHerself · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by carpro:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by carpro:
Just a thought...

If a homosexual repents of their sins and accepts Christ as their savior, but has no intention of ceasing homosexual acts...are they really saved?

That is none of our concern. That is between the individual and God. Our only concern is behaving in a loving and kind way towards that person. Clearly that person has the desire and the need for salvation. Constantly telling that person they are sinning would only make matters worse. Say it once, certainly. But let it be known that this is a matter between oneself and God. It's no one else's business! [/QUOTE]Is that a yes or a no? [/QUOTE]I'm saying, it is not our business to say yes or no to that question! That is between God and the individual, period! I don't know how more precise I can be. Only God knows the whole story here.

We are all still sinners, regardless of our salvation!

TisHerself · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by Plain Old Bill:
Nor is it hateful, it is nuetral.I work with some homosexuals, none of them would tell you I treat them poorly, nor do I ignore them.
I merely asked a question. I have come to use the term left because left is seldom right(correct).My beliefs are based on the Bible which I think is a reasonable thing for a christian to do.
But now with your great wisdom and assistance I not only know what to do and think, I also know how to feel about myself, for that I am grateful.

And you don't see yourself as self-righteous?

My beliefs are based on the Bible too. But I guess it is like being witness to a crime. Six people can see the crime and there will be six different stories.

I'm saying it is unkind to prevent homosexuals from having a legal civil union if that is what they want. It does not condone their actions, it only says we are God's people and we know our place. Our place is NOT to force people to NOT sin. That is their choice. God gave them that choice.

carpro · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by carpro:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by carpro:
Just a thought...

If a homosexual repents of their sins and accepts Christ as their savior, but has no intention of ceasing homosexual acts...are they really saved?

That is none of our concern. That is between the individual and God. Our only concern is behaving in a loving and kind way towards that person. Clearly that person has the desire and the need for salvation. Constantly telling that person they are sinning would only make matters worse. Say it once, certainly. But let it be known that this is a matter between oneself and God. It's no one else's business! [/QUOTE]Is that a yes or a no? [/QUOTE]I'm saying, it is not our business to say yes or no to that question! That is between God and the individual, period! I don't know how more precise I can be. Only God knows the whole story here.

We are all still sinners, regardless of our salvation! [/QUOTE]Yes, but I assume all of us here know what is required to achieve salvation.

Based on that knowledge, has that person truly repented of their sins if they don't recognize homosexual acts as sinful in the first place regardless of what the Bible says, and second they fully intend to continue homosexual behavior?

Are they truly saved if they didn't truly repent?

We're not talking about any one individual, this is hypothetical but...

Based on the teachings of God's Word, will they be saved or not?

LadyEagle · Jul 6, 2005

Not based on Romans Chapter One.

Hardsheller · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Hardsheller:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Hardsheller:
TisHerself,

It is a big jump from saying that Homosexuality is a Sin or that any Action is a Sin to actually being ProActive in the Church by Celebrating that sin or condoning it.

I personally have had homosexuals who were members of my church. We did not treat them differently from other members.

No person who is living openly in sin is qualified to be a church leader, be it alcoholism, wife abuse, or thievery. All should be held accountable for the Church and called to task for their sins.

Who said anything about celebrating sin??? That is rediculous! I've never said any such thing!

What I want to celebrate is a human life. A child of God. Now, I don't know if that lifestyle is a chosen path or not, I don't think so. Who would want that kind of persecution?? But I'll never, ever say I am better than a homosexual either. We all sin and fall short of the glory of God. If you break one commandment, you may as well have broken them all. We all need the compassion of our brothers and sisters! It's not fair to pick and choose. [/QUOTE]I'm certainly not saying that I'm better than homosexuals. We are all sinners.

What I am saying is that I do not in any shape, fashoin or form, condone Homosexual Marriage, Homosexual activity, or the Homosexual lifestyle.

I am opposed to it, Period.
I believe it is Sin, Period.
I believe it is unnatural behavior, period.
I will vote against Homosexual Marriage anytime it's on the ballot.

That is my belief about the matter as a Christian and that is my right under the Constitution of the United States. [/QUOTE]That is certainly your perogative. I choose not to vote at all in such matters. It is none of my concern. I am not a homosexual and I believe as you do that it is sin, but they have every right to a civil union if that is what they want. They have the right to sin, as do all sinners. God gave that right to them and none of us can take that away... that is what we are here for. If God had wanted to impose his laws on everyone, he would have. And we would all be in heaven instead of here on Earth.

Those people are still going to live together as spouses, regardless. Live with it. [/QUOTE]Fine, but I don't have to like it, approve it or vote for it.

BTW, they can have everything they want through the legal system we already have. A Power of attorney, A Will, Joint Property Ownership. All they need is an attorney, not some license or certificate from the state.

Enoch · Jul 6, 2005

The question is "How does God feel about homosexuality"?

I agree with God.

Plain Old Bill · Jul 6, 2005

I will agree with you when a doctor delivers a baby and says to the mother,"Mrs. SoandSo you are the proud mother of a homosexual".
Now what I do is talk to them about whatever the subject at hand is. I share my potluck food with them.I encourage them when they are doing thier jobs well.I don't beat them up or call them names.I don't ostracise them or belittle them. I don't publically shame them. When those who I know want to talk about God and the Bible, I talk with them and answer thier questions. I do not beat them over the head with my Bible.I do not tell them what I think about thier behavior unless they ask me, and then I am not mean spirited or cruel about it.When I am asked about civil unions or gay marriage issues, I explain my point of view and my reasons in a sane,rational,and biblical way.I do not stone them or give them over to the devil as it is my hope that one day they will repent and be saved.It is not good to condone or accept sinful behavior as normal, it is not.Some people may not know they are doing wrong unless they are corrected and it would be a sin to leave them in ignorance.
To me for a Christian to condone a civil union or gay marriage would be a sin.Gold's Word does not accept it or condone it in any way.

TisHerself · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by carpro:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by carpro:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by carpro:
Just a thought...

If a homosexual repents of their sins and accepts Christ as their savior, but has no intention of ceasing homosexual acts...are they really saved?

That is none of our concern. That is between the individual and God. Our only concern is behaving in a loving and kind way towards that person. Clearly that person has the desire and the need for salvation. Constantly telling that person they are sinning would only make matters worse. Say it once, certainly. But let it be known that this is a matter between oneself and God. It's no one else's business! [/QUOTE]Is that a yes or a no? [/QUOTE]I'm saying, it is not our business to say yes or no to that question! That is between God and the individual, period! I don't know how more precise I can be. Only God knows the whole story here.

We are all still sinners, regardless of our salvation! [/QUOTE]Yes, but I assume all of us here know what is required to achieve salvation.

Based on that knowledge, has that person truly repented of their sins if they don't recognize homosexual acts as sinful in the first place regardless of what the Bible says, and second they fully intend to continue homosexual behavior?

Are they truly saved if they didn't truly repent?

We're not talking about any one individual, this is hypothetical but...

Based on the teachings of God's Word, will they be saved or not? [/QUOTE]No, they won't. I'm just saying you shouldn't give up on them. Even an alcoholic will continue to drink after realizing it is wrong. Does that make them evil? I think not. A person can be truly repentent and still not be able to resist sin.

TisHerself · Jul 6, 2005

Originally posted by Hardsheller:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Hardsheller:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by TisHerself:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Hardsheller:
TisHerself,

It is a big jump from saying that Homosexuality is a Sin or that any Action is a Sin to actually being ProActive in the Church by Celebrating that sin or condoning it.

I personally have had homosexuals who were members of my church. We did not treat them differently from other members.

No person who is living openly in sin is qualified to be a church leader, be it alcoholism, wife abuse, or thievery. All should be held accountable for the Church and called to task for their sins.

Who said anything about celebrating sin??? That is rediculous! I've never said any such thing!

What I want to celebrate is a human life. A child of God. Now, I don't know if that lifestyle is a chosen path or not, I don't think so. Who would want that kind of persecution?? But I'll never, ever say I am better than a homosexual either. We all sin and fall short of the glory of God. If you break one commandment, you may as well have broken them all. We all need the compassion of our brothers and sisters! It's not fair to pick and choose. [/QUOTE]I'm certainly not saying that I'm better than homosexuals. We are all sinners.

What I am saying is that I do not in any shape, fashoin or form, condone Homosexual Marriage, Homosexual activity, or the Homosexual lifestyle.

I am opposed to it, Period.
I believe it is Sin, Period.
I believe it is unnatural behavior, period.
I will vote against Homosexual Marriage anytime it's on the ballot.

That is my belief about the matter as a Christian and that is my right under the Constitution of the United States. [/QUOTE]That is certainly your perogative. I choose not to vote at all in such matters. It is none of my concern. I am not a homosexual and I believe as you do that it is sin, but they have every right to a civil union if that is what they want. They have the right to sin, as do all sinners. God gave that right to them and none of us can take that away... that is what we are here for. If God had wanted to impose his laws on everyone, he would have. And we would all be in heaven instead of here on Earth.

Those people are still going to live together as spouses, regardless. Live with it. [/QUOTE]Fine, but I don't have to like it, approve it or vote for it.

BTW, they can have everything they want through the legal system we already have. A Power of attorney, A Will, Joint Property Ownership. All they need is an attorney, not some license or certificate from the state. [/QUOTE]They don't get the same tax deals, do they? They cannot file taxes jointly, nor can they get on on another's health insurance (in most states).

carpro · Jul 6, 2005

TisHerself wrote:
No, they won't. I'm just saying you shouldn't give up on them. Even an alcoholic will continue to drink after realizing it is wrong. Does that make them evil? I think not. A person can be truly repentent and still not be able to resist sin.

Is now the time for me to say I wouldn't know? It's none of my business. That's between them and God.

Why Should I Feel Threatened by Gay Marriage?

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