Why Some Saved Believers Will Be Left Behind?

[Hark]

1 Cor 13:9 is speaking of our perfect understanding in heaven.

I agree.

I have already stated I’m willing to be convinced from scripture. You haven’t y]et given any reasonable answer to Matt 24:29+ which clearly states Jesus returns and the elect are gathered after the tribulation.

But not after the great tribulation. Tribulation are the days we are living in now; but that is before the great tribulation when all remaining on the earth will be tempted to take the mark of the beast or not to survive in the NWO & if they do, they are going to the lake of fire.

The passages from John 15 and Luke 12 have nothing to do with the rapture of the saints. They are warnings to those who profess the follow Jesus to let their actions be consistent with their profession of faith.

And are the consequences for not abiding in Him & His words in being ready per John 15:6 & Luke 12:40-49 is being cut off to be with unbelievers when this fire is coming on the earth? Why still call them His servants as they get judged per the measures of stripes per the knowledge they did have for not being ready & less stripes per lack of knowledge for not being ready?

I understand that God disciplines those He loves and leads us to a deeper understanding of His word which strengthens our relationship with Him and other believers.

John 15:1-8 per verse 6 suggests not all saved believers will abide in His words to be pruned to bear more fruit.

I will consider your opinions but understand any “insights” God has given to you doesn’t bind me to anything. Be convinced in your own mind, and I’ll be convinced in mine and I won’t assume God isn’t guiding your understanding because they differ from mine.

peace to you

Do consider that with Jesus since we are to prove all things from everybody by Him since Jesus is our Good Shepherd.

 

[canadyjd]

.... There will be even greater tribulation after the Second Coming.

When Jesus Christ returns (2nd coming) that is the end of this world. The elect are collected. The judgment follows. There is no 3rd coming.

peace to you

 

[Yeshua1]

When Jesus Christ returns (2nd coming) that is the end of this world. The elect are collected. The judgment follows. There is no 3rd coming.

peace to you

Historical premil my view!

 

[canadyjd]

Historical premil my view!

Explain please

peace to you

 

[Yeshua1]

Explain please

peace to you

The Rapture and the second coming are same event, then we head off into the Millinual Kingdom state!

 

[Hark]

When Jesus Christ returns (2nd coming) that is the end of this world. The elect are collected. The judgment follows. There is no 3rd coming.

peace to you

We agree to disagree.

The Redeemer had come first to save us & left to prepare a place for us in our father's House above ( John 14:1-3 ).

The Bridegroom comes to judge His House first to receive the abiding bride to the Marriage Supper in Heaven in fulfilling the promise of John 14:1-3.

The King of kings comes to establish His kingdom on earth to reign for a thousand years when afterwards those that went through the great tribulation are resurrected to serve the King of kings from al over the world in raising up the generations in the millennium reign of Christ on earth.

At the end of that reign when Satan is released from the it to set up the last rebellion, there will be one more harvest of believers that remain loyal to Him that makes up the whole of the Kingdom of God before He gives it up to the Father when death & hades has been put in the lake of fire at the great white throne judgment.

They that be Christ the firstfruits.. then they that be Christ's at His coming after the great tribulation.. and then those that remain loyal to Christ when Satan is defeated for the last time once released from the pit.

Where is that of 3 harvests that makes up the whole of the kingdom of heaven?

Matthew 13;33 Another parable spake he unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.

 

[canadyjd]

We agree to disagree.

The Redeemer had come first to save us & left to prepare a place for us in our father's House above ( John 14:1-3 ).

The Bridegroom comes to judge His House first to receive the abiding bride to the Marriage Supper in Heaven in fulfilling the promise of John 14:1-3.

The King of kings comes to establish His kingdom on earth to reign for a thousand years when afterwards those that went through the great tribulation are resurrected to serve the King of kings from al over the world in raising up the generations in the millennium reign of Christ on earth.

At the end of that reign when Satan is released from the it to set up the last rebellion, there will be one more harvest of believers that remain loyal to Him that makes up the whole of the Kingdom of God before He gives it up to the Father when death & hades has been put in the lake of fire at the great white throne judgment.

They that be Christ the firstfruits.. then they that be Christ's at His coming after the great tribulation.. and then those that remain loyal to Christ when Satan is defeated for the last time once released from the pit.

Where is that of 3 harvests that makes up the whole of the kingdom of heaven?

Matthew 13;33 Another parable spake he unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.

When Jesus refers to “My Father’s house”’ in John 14;3, He is referring to the Temple in Jerusalem, not heaven. The “many rooms”, or dwelling places, refers to small rooms used by priests when they came to Jerusalem to perform priestly duties. When He said “I go...”, He is referring to going to the cross.

By going to the cross, He prepared a “place” for them and all Christians to go directly to God as priests.

John 14:3 has not thing to do with the millennial reign.

Yes, I completely disagree with you. You are taking passages completely out of context, reading into those passages doctrines foreign to the author’s intent and claiming some sort of special guidance from God to support your view.

Yes, I disagree.

peace to you

 

[Hark]

When Jesus refers to “My Father’s house”’ in John 14;3, He is referring to the Temple in Jerusalem, not heaven. The “many rooms”, or dwelling places, refers to small rooms used by priests when they came to Jerusalem to perform priestly duties. When He said “I go...”, He is referring to going to the cross.

By going to the cross, He prepared a “place” for them and all Christians to go directly to God as priests.

John 14:3 has not thing to do with the millennial reign.

Not the millennial reign but the reception of the abiding bride by the Bridegroom for the Marriage Supper in Heaven which is before the great tribulation comes.

John 14:1-26 is about Jesus will leave soon by ascension for when the promise of the permanent indwelling Holy Ghost will come at their salvation for believing in Him. He is leaving to prepare the way for us so that He will receive then & us at the place He is going which is with God the Father in Heaven. Where is Jesus now? In Heaven with the Father. He said He will come again & take us to that place where He is now like a bridegroom in traditional Jewish wedding when after he is married, he goes to prepare the home first before receiving the bride.

Yes, I completely disagree with you. You are taking passages completely out of context, reading into those passages doctrines foreign to the author’s intent and claiming some sort of special guidance from God to support your view.

But you have to prove that I am misapplying His words by informing me what Jesus is really talking about. Not just dismiss it & leave me hanging. I have been applying the references for which you have yet to explain that is not what Jesus meant t& to show me what He did meant.

I tried to share how you applied it wrong in that you have to discern which question Jesus is answering because it did not al happen when the Temple was thrown down in 70 A.D. now did it?

Yes, I disagree.

peace to you

Okay. Since the discussion is one sided now & no longer iron sharpening iron by the grace of God & His help, I leave you to God until you are led otherwise by Him to share some more. Thank you for sharing what you had. I agree to disagree.

 

[canadyjd]

Not the millennial reign but the reception of the abiding bride by the Bridegroom for the Marriage Supper in Heaven which is before the great tribulation comes.

John 14:1-26 is about Jesus will leave soon by ascension for when the promise of the permanent indwelling Holy Ghost will come at their salvation for believing in Him. He is leaving to prepare the way for us so that He will receive then & us at the place He is going which is with God the Father in Heaven. Where is Jesus now? In Heaven with the Father. He said He will come again & take us to that place where He is now like a bridegroom in traditional Jewish wedding when after he is married, he goes to prepare the home first before receiving the bride.



But you have to prove that I am misapplying His words by informing me what Jesus is really talking about. Not just dismiss it & leave me hanging. I have been applying the references for which you have yet to explain that is not what Jesus meant t& to show me what He did meant.

I tried to share how you applied it wrong in that you have to discern which question Jesus is answering because it did not al happen when the Temple was thrown down in 70 A.D. now did it?



Okay. Since the discussion is one sided now & no longer iron sharpening iron by the grace of God & His help, I leave you to God until you are led otherwise by Him to share some more. Thank you for sharing what you had. I agree to disagree.

Agreed. Peace to you

 

[AustinC]

There is no rapture. Believers will meet their King and their King will judge the world with the fire of purification.

 

[tyndale1946]

There is no rapture. Believers will meet their King and their King will judge the world with the fire of purification.

Protestant Purgatory does that give you brethren a hint where it came from?... How long have I been telling you brethren this?... Harpazo... caught up!... Like in resurrection not rapture... Never heard this until I joined the BB... Our Baptist Church never taught it... And I could go on and on and on and on ect, but I'm done!... You brethren say here and play your millennial games and we will wait for you to show up... In a thousand years... Brother Glen

 

[Hark]

There is no rapture. Believers will meet their King and their King will judge the world with the fire of purification.

Seeing how the saints coming out of the great tribulation are resurrected AFTER the defeat of Satan & he is in the it for a thousand years...something is wrong with this view..

Zechariah 14:1-5 has Jesus with His feet touching down on the Mount of Olives with the returning saints ( pre raptured saints ) in battling the armies coming against Jerusalem. So that means the defeat of that armies marching on Jerusalem & the defeat of Satan & him being in that pit BEFORE the resurrection of those saints as described as coming out of the great tribulation... Revelation 20:1-5 does not have those saints meeting the Lord in the air, now does it? 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

 

[Hark]

Protestant Purgatory does that give you brethren a hint where it came from?... How long have I been telling you brethren this?... Harpazo... caught up!... Like in resurrection not rapture... Never heard this until I joined the BB... Our Baptist Church never taught it... And I could go on and on and on and on ect, but I'm done!... You brethren say here and play your millennial games and we will wait for you to show up... In a thousand years... Brother Glen

Let me ask you this; you are in the end of the great tribulation and you see the armies marching against Jerusalem. The Lord appears and defeats the armies & puts Satan in the pit for a thousand years. Now He is on earth per Zechariah 14:1-5 & Revelation 20:1-5 when He resurrects those saints as described as having gone through the great tribulation. He is not meeting those saints resurrected out of the great tribulation in meeting them in the air. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

Again, I point out... you cannot buy or sell to be ensnared by the cares of this life that you would not want to leave per Luke 21:34-36 & Luke 14:15-24 because you can only buy & sell thus have a life by having the mark of the beast which automatically condemns you as going to the lake of fire. That is part of the war waged on the saints in killing them off during the great tribulation. So as oppressive as everything would be during & towards the end of the great tribulation, there can be no snare for the cares of the life during nor end of the great tribulation, now can there be?

The warning of Luke 21:34-36 & Luke 14:15-24 is for the believers now so they are to pray to be ready to go in leaving heir lives & loved ones behind when the Bridegroom comes. That is the cost of discipleship in Luke 14:25-26

I do not see any believer being tempted for the cares of that life during the great tribulation to not want to leave when the Bridegroom comes.

 

[AustinC]

Seeing how the saints coming out of the great tribulation are resurrected AFTER the defeat of Satan & he is in the it for a thousand years...something is wrong with this view..

Zechariah 14:1-5 has Jesus with His feet touching down on the Mount of Olives with the returning saints ( pre raptured saints ) in battling the armies coming against Jerusalem. So that means the defeat of that armies marching on Jerusalem & the defeat of Satan & him being in that pit BEFORE the resurrection of those saints as described as coming out of the great tribulation... Revelation 20:1-5 does not have those saints meeting the Lord in the air, now does it? 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

We are in the tribulation. It will get worse. Jesus will return to redeem His sheep.

 

[Hark]

We are in the tribulation. It will get worse. Jesus will return to redeem His sheep.

Best to prove that by the scripture that there is no appearing of the Bridegroom before He comes literally as the King of kings..

Apply Luke 21:34-36 what is the escape believers are to pray for now?

How can the snares of life tempt believers not to leave for the King's Supper in Heaven at the end of the great tribulation in Luke 14:15-24?

Apply Luke 12:40-49 of what that consequence will be for not being ready. Note how He still calls them His servants for why they are getting stripes per the knowledge they had for not being ready & lesser stripes per the lack of knowledge for not being ready.

Apply what John 15:1-8 of verse 6 in regards to why they are cut off in Luke 12:40-49 for not being ready.

Those cut off are not participating with the O.T. saints at the Marriage Supper table in Heaven in Luke 13:24-30.

Since God is going to judge His House first in 1 Peter 4:17-19, when will that be unless at the rapture event when He will be faithful in keeping the souls of His saints that gets left behind to suffer the fiery calamity on a third of the earth & in going thru the great tribulation.?

Luke 17:26-37 testify to a leaving this word by a wing-like flight as eagles to escape the calamity coming on this world to a reception done in hospitality .. hence the body being the Marriage Supper in Heaven.

These are enough scriptural reference for why I believe the Bridegroom will be judging His House first in leaving those foolish virgins behind in the market place for not being ready at the pre great tribulation rapture event. That is how those saints in the Church at Thyatira who do not repent of their fornication will be cast into the bed of the great tribulation; Revelation 2:18-25

 

[AustinC]

Best to prove that by the scripture that there is no appearing of the Bridegroom before He comes literally as the King of kings..

Apply Luke 21:34-36 what is the escape believers are to pray for now?

How can the snares of life tempt believers not to leave for the King's Supper in Heaven at the end of the great tribulation in Luke 14:15-24?

Apply Luke 12:40-49 of what that consequence will be for not being ready. Note how He still calls them His servants for why they are getting stripes per the knowledge they had for not being ready & lesser stripes per the lack of knowledge for not being ready.

Apply what John 15:1-8 of verse 6 in regards to why they are cut off in Luke 12:40-49 for not being ready.

Those cut off are not participating with the O.T. saints at the Marriage Supper table in Heaven in Luke 13:24-30.

Since God is going to judge His House first in 1 Peter 4:17-19, when will that be unless at the rapture event when He will be faithful in keeping the souls of His saints that gets left behind to suffer the fiery calamity on a third of the earth & in going thru the great tribulation.?

Luke 17:26-37 testify to a leaving this word by a wing-like flight as eagles to escape the calamity coming on this world to a reception done in hospitality .. hence the body being the Marriage Supper in Heaven.

These are enough scriptural reference for why I believe the Bridegroom will be judging His House first in leaving those foolish virgins behind in the market place for not being ready at the pre great tribulation rapture event. That is how those saints in the Church at Thyatira who do not repent of their fornication will be cast into the bed of the great tribulation; Revelation 2:18-25

Read 2 Peter and get back to me.

 

[Hark]

Read 2 Peter and get back to me.

Right. Those not ready when the Bridegroom comes will have swift destruction per that fiery calamity that is coming on the earth as described in 2 Peter 3:1-14 It is in regards to that salvation from what is coming on the earth that Peter is referring to to be ready to inherit the Kingdom of Heaven above in the firstfruits of the resurrection.

God judges His House first per 1 Peter 4:17-19.

Look at what happens when He judges in that day. 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 & why those cast into the bed of the great tribulation are still saved 1 Corinthians 4:15-17 but judged with death for their works; Revelation 2:18-25

 

[AustinC]

Right. Those not ready when the Bridegroom comes will have swift destruction per that fiery calamity that is coming on the earth as described in 2 Peter 3:1-14 It is in regards to that salvation from what is coming on the earth that Peter is referring to to be ready to inherit the Kingdom of Heaven above in the firstfruits of the resurrection.

God judges His House first per 1 Peter 4:17-19.

Look at what happens when He judges in that day. 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 & why those cast into the bed of the great tribulation are still saved 1 Corinthians 4:15-17 but judged with death for their works; Revelation 2:18-25

Good, so no rapture, just tribulation, which the church is already experiencing in many places throughout the world.

 

[Hark]

Good, so no rapture, just tribulation, which the church is already experiencing in many places throughout the world.

That was not what I was agreeing to about there being no rapture. I agree with wat 2 Peter 2 says but not how you are applying it to mean as I pointed out 2 Peter 3:1-14 for why that is about what is coming on the earth; for believers to be ready & endure by His grace & by His help to escape that which is coming on the earth. Luke 21:33-36

I looked up your references. You should click on those blue scriptural references to see where I am coming from for the progress of our discussion so you can apply them right if I am applying them wrong.

 

[AustinC]

That was not what I was agreeing to about there being no rapture. I agree with wat 2 Peter 2 says but not how you are applying it to mean as I pointed out 2 Peter 3:1-14 for why that is about what is coming on the earth; for believers to be ready & endure by His grace & by His help to escape that which is coming on the earth. Luke 21:33-36

I looked up your references. You should click on those blue scriptural references to see where I am coming from for the progress of our discussion so you can apply them right if I am applying them wrong.

You cannot find rapture in the Bible.