Jesus was crushed, broken, physically so battered did not eve look human anymore, and that was the will of God and of Him, as thru those sufferings as the sin bearer me and you could be saved!
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- Thread starter steaver
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Jesus suffering at the cross for us does not equate to GOD pouring out his wrath on Jesus.
If you got a bible verse that says God poured out his wrath on Jesus, then post it. If you don't then tell us it is unbiblical.
I wasn't asking you. The words are in the Bible.If you are asking me if I believe in Believers' baptism, indeed I do. Do you?
Mark 16:16. "He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but He that does not believe will be condemned." Baptism is an ordinance of the Lord Jesus, not an optional extra for the believer, although the text does not say that he who is not baptized will be condemned, otherwise the thief on the cross would be lost. What is clear however is that baptism without belief is at best a waste of time, and at worst a tragic misleading of young people who imagine that infant baptism has some saving efficacy.
So Paul and Silas had it wrong, did they? Not at all! The jailor believed, was saved by grace through faith alone, and then obeyed the command of His Lord to be baptized.
Deuteronomy 21:23. 'Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree.' Cursed by whom?
'He Himself bore our sins in His body on the tree.' Christ endured the curse and bore the wrath of God, not against Him, but against sin.
Psalm 7:11. 'God is a just judge.....' I don't suppose we shall disagree about that, unless you think that maybe He really is unjust? '......And God is angry with the wicked every day.' So not only is God angry with the wicked, He is right to be so, because He is a just judge. Isaiah 53:6. 'All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one of us into our own way........' That's you and me, under the righteous anger of God. What can possibly save us? '.......And the LORD has laid on Him the iniquity of us all.' The Lord Jesus Christ willingly (John 10:18) took our sins upon Himself and paid the penalty in full, '....that [God] might be just and the justifier of the one who believes in Jesus' (Romans 3:26).
I would categorize all above mentioned as sacramental.
I don't believe there is a verse in scripture that states that 'the Father poured out His wrath upon Jesus'. “For our sake He made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in Him we might become the righteousness of God” (2 Corinthians 5:21) doesn't mean that the Father destined His Son to pour out His wrath upon' at Calvary but as a 'sin offering'. There is a difference. The Catholic Catechism says the following:
615 "For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by one man’s obedience many will be made righteous."443 By his obedience unto death, Jesus accomplished the substitution of the suffering Servant, who “makes himself an offering for sin”, when “he bore the sin of many”, and who “shall make many to be accounted righteous”, for “he shall bear their iniquities”.444 Jesus atoned for our faults and made satisfaction for our sins to the Father.445
This is the very essence of the Gospel: that Jesus Christ lived a perfect life that we as Christians should live, and died the death that we deserve to die because of our sin. The Apostles’ Creed states that Jesus “descended into hell,” and St. Paul explains the importance of this in Romans 5:17-18:
'For if, because of one man’s trespass, death reigned through one man (Adam), much more will those who receive the abundance of grace and the free gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man Jesus Christ. Therefore, as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all men.'
In other words, Jesus died on the cross and descended to hell until the Resurrection, and that satisfies God’s just demands for our sins (a sin offering). That is exactly why God is “faithful and just” 1 John 1:9 to forgive our sins when we confess: because Christ has already atoned for our sins.
Would you please take a moment to listen to Jimmy Akin's comments on the subject (please go to the 28 minute mark) and let me know what your thoughts are?
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So in your mind we sinners were in control and had the power to wound Christ for our transgression and iniquities. We made Christ our sacrifice. We made Christ step down from heaven. So I guess in your mind Christ was not slain from the foundation of the world, we sinners made Him come down here so we could sacrifice Him for ourselves. No thank you, I will allow God His glory and will not usurp any of His power and authority over Creation.
Acts 5
30“The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom you had put to death by hanging Him on a cross.
We put him to death.
How about you provide scripture for your fake gospel?
Show us this verse we hear all the time "God poured out his wrath on Jesus Christ."
Why did God raise up Jesus? For us to put Him to death?
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