Can I vent?

[Shortandy]

These are the same people that teach if you don't wear a coat and tie on Sunday you are disrespecting God and they are the relatives of those that think clapping your hands or raising your hands is wrong. And all of it comes from the same place my friend....arrogance.

We are foolish enough at moments to assume that we have it all figured out and if people are not just like us then something is wrong with them.

It has always been this way and it always will until Christ returns. These people breed and are in every church.

So hang in there.

 

[Steven2006]

These are the same people that teach if you don't wear a coat and tie on Sunday you are disrespecting God and they are the relatives of those that think clapping your hands or raising your hands is wrong. And all of it comes from the same place my friend....arrogance.

We are foolish enough at moments to assume that we have it all figured out and if people are not just like us then something is wrong with them.

It has always been this way and it always will until Christ returns. These people breed and are in every church.

So hang in there.

I think that is a little too harsh and with to broad a brush. I have know many wonderful Christian brothers and sisters that have held to the view of men wearing their hair short. And in my last post I posted a verse that at least support why some feel this way.

It really comes down to a heart thing. I have absolutely no problem with someone who believes he should keep his hair short and feels like he should dress nicely out of respect for God. It is only when people start lauding it over others or look down on others for not doing the same does it become a problem. We have to be careful not to do just that to them as well.

 

[Gina B]

It has always been this way and it always will until Christ returns. These people breed and are in every church.

So hang in there.

It's hard NOT to be arrogant when we see ignorance on display like that, but I guess it's just as ignorant if we mock people instead of trying to teach them.

I'm just as guilty as the next person. I don't like to admit how much stuff I'm ignorant of, but I like to take pride in thinking I know a lot more in some areas than others.

So I guess we all breed and pass on our faults and often even our ignorance.

I wonder how much less of this would be going around if we all just focused on teaching the basic story of Christ. Of all the things we talk about in our spare time, is the one and only reason for our existence a main topic?

 

[DHK]

These are the same people that teach if you don't wear a coat and tie on Sunday you are disrespecting God and they are the relatives of those that think clapping your hands or raising your hands is wrong. And all of it comes from the same place my friend....arrogance.

We are foolish enough at moments to assume that we have it all figured out and if people are not just like us then something is wrong with them.

It has always been this way and it always will until Christ returns. These people breed and are in every church.

So hang in there.

Arrogance?? Why be so quick to judge? You assume you know the hearts of individuals or churches that have set for themselves standards of different sorts.

Is that any different than the corporate world? Do most corporate businessmen have a standard of dress that they adhere to? Does the sales person that comes to your door representing his company dress in a t-shirt and jeans. I haven't noticed that. The world knows better. The world knows how to gain the respect of other people in the way that they dress, and yet the Christian doesn't care when it comes to respect for God. Pitiful isn't it?!

Perhaps it is a matter of holiness. By holiness I mean one strives to be as close to God as possible and as far away from the world as possible. By "world" is meant a love of worldly ways, things, leisure, etc. Things that take the place of God. Thus the warning of Paul:

"Be not conformed to this world, but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind..."
Elsewhere he says that:
we are to "be conformed to the image of Christ."
They are polar opposites.

The accusation of arrogance is all together wrong. You cannot judge the heart of individuals you do not know.

 

[Steven2006]

I am posting this once agin because I feel it just go lost in my last post,



"Does not even nature itself teach you that if a man has long hair, it is a dishonor to him,
but if a woman has long hair, it is a glory to her? For her hair is given to her for a covering. " -1Cr 11:14-15

While I personally don't care much either way about a persons hair length. There are verses to support those that feel strongly about it. Let us not act as if they have pulled this idea out of thin air.

 

[Gina B]

I am posting this once agin because I feel it just go lost in my last post,



"Does not even nature itself teach you that if a man has long hair, it is a dishonor to him,
but if a woman has long hair, it is a glory to her? For her hair is given to her for a covering. " -1Cr 11:14-15

While I personally don't care much either way about a persons hair length. There are verses to support those that feel strongly about it. Let us not act as if they have pulled this idea out of thin air.

That's a good one, although it leads me to wonder about the sin nature of water buffaloes!

 

[DHK]

I am posting this once agin because I feel it just go lost in my last post,



"Does not even nature itself teach you that if a man has long hair, it is a dishonor to him,
but if a woman has long hair, it is a glory to her? For her hair is given to her for a covering. " -1Cr 11:14-15

While I personally don't care much either way about a persons hair length. There are verses to support those that feel strongly about it. Let us not act as if they have pulled this idea out of thin air.

Yes, good Scriptural evidence for the position taken.

 

[Steven2006]

That's a good one, although it leads me to wonder about the sin nature of water buffaloes!

Everyone knows buffaloes don't spend enough time in the word :laugh:

 

[DHK]

That's a good one, although it leads me to wonder about the sin nature of water buffaloes!

That is the nature of soul liberty. You have the perfect right to wonder about anything you want, even red herrings.

 

[thegospelgeek]

Just to clarify, the topic was not started out of some sense of arrogance. If that were the case I would leave rather quickly. These are loving people who have been taught something and are slow to change. I would rather they be like that than change with every doctrine that blows.

I just get frustrated from time to time with things that are said without scriptural support. I have no problems with a personal conviction about hair, clothing, or such. I just don't think we should preach those convictions without support from scripture.

Has anyone gone through this as an Assistant? The Pastor has taught me much about what it takes to Pastor a Church, but how much can one disagree with the teachings and remain in harmony?

 

[Steven2006]

As far as dress. I don't know of any churches that require the men wear jacket and ties, only those that require the staff to do so. I also know of many places of employment that require their staff to adhere to certain dress codes.

 

[annsni]

Yeah, but some kids aren't very bright and you HAVE to get really specific. Like "No, we do NOT crawl into oven! STOP THAT!" (I thought the Hebrew blood she got from me should have made that a no-brainer but she tried it anyhow)

I know what ya mean...but unfortunately a lot of those little things do have to be taught. Of course, we need to make sure they're REAL things, not stuff that we're teaching because for some reason it gives us a complex if we can't tell a male from a female from a long distance or because we really really don't like hip-hop music. And trust me, if I could take hip-hop and wipe it clean off the face of planet earth and have a scriptural basis, I'd do it in a heartbeat!

But think about it...we've got people claiming to be Christians and they're running around doing THE stupidest stuff. Maybe if the expectation started out smaller, the bigger stuff would be easier to handle?

I dunno. Something's going wrong somewhere...Christians can't look or act right. Shoot, half of them are standing around scratching their heads and wondering why it isn't Christian to be homosexual. Is it any wonder we have to teach people the little stuff too?

See, if you're teaching the right things, you won't need to get to the nitty gritty. Additionally, if you're taught to read the Scriptures instead of letting someone tell you everything that's in there, and you have the Spirit in you, you will follow what the Scriptures say or atleast begin to dig and find out more.

 

[DHK]

As far as dress. I don't know of any churches that require the men wear jacket and ties, only those that require the staff to do so. I also know of many places of employment that require their staff to adhere to certain dress codes.

I think that would be a normal standard in many of the churches I have gone to. I don't know of any church that would require all their members to wear a tie. You sure wouldn't get many visitors that way. But the staff are required to hold to a higher standard, as official representatives of the church.

 

[Steven2006]

Exactly!



I had to add this to make it long enough to submit :laugh:

 

[John Toppass]

Because Jesus didn't have long hair. Contemporary music has a jungle beat. If the KJV was good enough for Peter, Paul, and Jesus it should be good enough for us.

Something tells me that neither Peter,Paul or Jesus read from the KJV. especially since it would have been one of those new, wierd versions that came 1500 years later.

 

[DHK]

Something tells me that neither Peter,Paul or Jesus read from the KJV. especially since it would have been one of those new, wierd versions that came 1500 years later.

Their version was three letters short of an mv it was the MT.
In Hebrew, much more accurate.

 

[Gina B]

That is the nature of soul liberty. You have the perfect right to wonder about anything you want, even red herrings.

But I wasn't wondering about fish!

I meant the comment as a joke...I don't know the interpretation of that verse and whether it means nature as in animals or nature as in what comes natural to humans, so I was trying to think of animals that had lots of hair and I thought of lions and buffalos, then I thought of Veggie Tales singing "Everybody wants a water buffalo" and so I thought of those because they're really hairy, and that made me think about the possibility of animals sinning, and...well, now you have me thinking about whether a buffalo would eat a red herring if it was really really hungry, and if the buffalo's would have survived their near-extinction if man had taught a buffalo to fish...SEE? I can barely help myself!

 

[Gina B]

See, if you're teaching the right things, you won't need to get to the nitty gritty. Additionally, if you're taught to read the Scriptures instead of letting someone tell you everything that's in there, and you have the Spirit in you, you will follow what the Scriptures say or atleast begin to dig and find out more.

Yep. I do understand. We've just been agreeing so much lately that I had to mix it up a bit and see how it would go. :thumbs:

I noticed that when I went from one of those types that try to teach and pound into you every tiny part of your life, focusing on what you should wear, look like, and all that and joined one that just taught, I quit stagnating and grew. Church meetings were no longer an obligation, but something I looked forward to intensely. I feel like I'm drowning if I'm away from a church teaching church. I never felt that way in the ones that went nuts trying to get us all to come in looking and acting like drones.

 

[Aaron]

I don't know if this is the place, but if I hear one more comment from the pupit about long hair, contemporary music, KJV, or the like I'm gonna go nuts.

Subject hair:

Can anyone explain to me why so many think long hair is a sin for men?

Why? Do you want long hair?

 

[saturneptune]

Why? Do you want long hair?

I would be happy with any hair.