Do We All have the same Kind Of Free Will as adam Had From God?

That might work if it was not for 1 Cor 10:13. That one verse stomps on a who lot of people's theology. Adam feely chose and we freely choose. No one is ever forced to sin.

 

whatever it may be, it's going to be a lenghty response. He's been typing for a while. I figure he'll quote the likes of Piper, MacArthur, Pink, Luther, Augustus, et al and tell us what they believe(d)......

 

Those pet sins that we let hang around and excuse them.

 

so we let them hang around because we choose to let them hang around?

 

of course! Which I said, I can't argue against sin being a choice.

 

kewl beans.....

 

So if you agree that we sin willfully then how is it you claim we do not have free will? Adam had free will and we have free will. Or am I misunderstanding you?

 

probably the latter, Brother. :laugh:

 

My question, why do we choose to sin? I hear so many people claim we can stop sinning and yet we don't stop. If it's a choice to sin then is not our choice influenced by our sin nature, and how are we free from the bondage of sin if we keep sinning?

 

We willfully sin because that is our nature.

 

No it is not because of any sin nature! There is pleasure in sin for a season. Sin can be pleasurable. It does not take a sin nature to sin. That is part of the false teaching going on today. We are beings that have been created with the ability to enjoy things and freely choose good or evil. The problem is how or when we enjoy it.
We are allowed to have sex but not outside of marriage. In the garden man was allowed to eat but not from a certain tree. Eve saw the tree was good to eat and pleasant to the eyes and she did eat. She had no sin nature to help her sin. It was a free will choice just like it is for us all.

And when the woman saw that the tree [was] good for food, and that it [was] pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make [one] wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. Our sins are just as sinful as was theirs.

I fear you are looking for a way to not take full accountability for your sin by claiming a sin nature. God's word teaches all sin is a willful choice and no one has to sin.

There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God [is] faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear [it].

That passage alone puts all the blame on us just like all the blame was on the first couple.

 

My friend. We will agree to disagree. I know what you are getting at, but the day I see people stop sinning altogether is the day I will believe your interpretation. I just don't see how one can truly have free will without God intervening.....until then God Bless.

p.s. I never said, Adam nor Eve had a sin nature before the fall.

 

But that is not what your moniker means.

Your first translation requires an adjective (neither "christ" nor "slave" are adjectives) which leads to your second which requires a genitive Xristou.

 

Well I see no virtue in agreeing that we disagree so I never do that. We simply disagree with no virtue as two cannot walk together unless they be in agreement.
The problem is with rejecting what is written you stand alone not in agreement.
There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God [is] faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear [it].

That means it is a freewill choice to sin and even if we had a sin nature, but we don't, God is overriding it to make way, but we are freely rejecting the way out He has provided and He is still willing to forgive. His grace is more then anyone can fully understand or appreciate.

 

My friend. I never said what it meant but what I meant.

doulos toh christos

 

If you didn't believe in your own philosophy would you be here trying to convince men of it?
The Bible and it's doctrines is what we discuss here. You're claiming men lost there ability when Adam fell. If that is true then you should have no problem proving it to be true with scripture. What I posted to you was not an accusation but a denial of what you claim is true.
MB

 

My friend. I am not here to convince anyone but to discuss. This is my way of learning, even in my disagreements

 

I will pray about this and allow the Holy Spirit to lead me to the truth.

No! I take full accountability for my sins even though I believe I have a sin nature. My nature does not excuse me

 

Fall into sin = I get angry and say something really mean and hurtful without actually thinking about it first. (following the sin nature/flesh)

Willingly dive = I know something is wrong but I plot and plan to do it anyway. (premeditation)


If we have the "ability" to stop sinning, why on earth don't we???? I hate sin. I hate grieving God because of it. Yet I still do it. Who will save me from this body of death? (I think I've heard that somewhere before.)

Sin will never depart from us until we shed our corruptible flesh.

 

Amy I mean you no disrespect but I don't believe what you are saying about the “falling into sin”. Since I have been a Christian in every single case even dealing with anger the Spirit is dealing with me to not respond in the manner I am about to prior to the sin. I have never done any sin since I was saved that there was not first some clear temptation and instant dealing of the spirit before I sinned. I simply choose to ignore the warning and sin. It has nothing to do with a nature, but a personal choice and proof that my love for the Lord is not all it should be. What you are describing is sin being the master.


All sin is a choice and as long as we hold that sin rules over us (“never depart from us” as you put it) we will never get the victory over sin as the Lord desires us to have. Worst then that it is impossible to take full responsibility for our sin as long as we believe that we cannot stop sinning. Until we admit that our sins are totally a willful choice on our part all we are doing is excusing ourselves at least in part as to why we sin.

We simply do not have some nature that is overriding what we can do.
There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God [is] faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear [it].

I assure you Amy if you say something out of anger that is hurtful you thought about it first and the truth is most likely you had been thinking about it for some time and just waiting for the opportuinty to say it.. The same with every person. No believer every sins without first thinking about it.
But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.