Featured Slowly moving my wife towards Reformed Theology from IFB theology

Im sorry, but this a completely ignorant statement. To gain a good education of ANY view one needs to thoroughly study the opposing viewpoints. Half the problem on this board is this kind of thinking...I'll only surround myself with those I agree with and castigate the opposition as 'anti-biblical', 'candy based sermons', etc. I'm not a big MacArthur fan, but you know what? I own his study Bible. I listen to his sermons. I read his articles. As with anyone, I spit out the pit and eat the cherry. You (and many here) display spiritual immaturity by the above kind of post.

 

:thumbsup:

Unfortunately, it's rampant around here.

 

I know YOU are, but what am I?:tongue3:

 

Hey Salty,

maybe you could show where a Nt church even has an altar...to do an unscriptural altar call with.....

Our Altar is the priestly work of Christ...in heaven..

10 We have an altar, whereof they have no right to eat which serve the tabernacle.

11 For the bodies of those beasts, whose blood is brought into the sanctuary by the high priest for sin, are burned without the camp.

12 Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate.

13 Let us go forth therefore unto him without the camp, bearing his reproach.

14 For here have we no continuing city, but we seek one to come.

15 By him therefore let us offer the sacrifice of praise to God continually, that is, the fruit of our lips giving thanks to his name.


walking to front of a building or the side of it does nothing.Jesus is in heaven now....the sinner can go direct to Him in prayer to find mercy...

proper confession of faith is believers baptism....

Finney thought by getting a person to move from one place or to another he was "moving" his will......

jn says;
13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.


There is no mystical power in the so called"altar call"

no more than this....

sinner if you want to be saved tonight,,,walk to the fellowship hall and eat some broccoli florets...it is an act of your will showing you want to saved..there is something about eating broccoli florets that shows you are sincere.

 

Salty, here the deal. These folks think they have it all wrapped up in a neat tight little theological box. They arrogantly condemn anything or anybody who doesn't see it their way and they love to twist the scriptures. Best not to cast your pearls.......

 

OK, I'll play too.

Show us where musical instruments are used in the NT church...to do unscriptural songs with...

 

It is truly unfortunate that the "altar call" replaced the inquiry rooms.

The original intent has long ago been misplaced.

Should a church hold an "altar call?"

I don't see it as "condemned" in Scriptures - the absence does not make it sinful.

Can the "altar call" be a tool?

I don't see why not. Are not the pulpit, the lights, the baptismal pool ... all tools?

How the "altar" is used, be it to lay the ordinances upon, or a term referring to one going into the inquiry room, or just making it to the prayer bench or steps to the pulpit, is not significant in itself. It is God's work - even believers are mere tools to His service.

Have "altar calls" been abused. Certainly.

Just as every other item - including the singing, preaching, clothing, media presentations, sound systems, instruments, carpet color, grand cathedrals, and massive assembly halls which exalt human engineering and contrive to distract from truth.

There is not a single item that has not been taken to sinful extreme and excess - not just the "altar call."

The "altar call" can be an effective tool.

 

Evan, just a few weeks ago in another thread, you said this:

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=90524&page=9

If you say that you believe God is sovereign, and you believe he is in control, rest in that fact and learn what God wants you to learn at this time where you are. Maybe he is trying to show you something about yourself. Submit to God having you in this situation. In my opinion, your saying "I believe this, this, this..." but your being just as manipulative and taking it on yourself as much as those you condemn.

 

I have been a convert for 40 years, and have found that Baptists being as diverse as they are, there are IFB pastors who are antipathetic to other soteriologies because of (1) personal reasons, and (2) because they were grinded out of Calvinist-hating seminaries and did not take the time to investigate with an open mind and any investigation they made were to find fault, not truth.
On the other hand there are IFB pastors who take the view that Reformed theology are peopled with God's own, just like they are, and therefore they are a little kinder to the Reformed view, if not more open.
It is therefore not right to make a sweeping statement such as the one bolded.
Maybe most IFB pulpits you and your wife sat under were hostile, but certainly not all IFB pulpits will be, that is, if IFB's hold to the Autonomy of Local Churches.

you could almost be describing some Primitive Baptist churches I've gone to, you know.....you could preach about the Duck Dynasty and they won't know the difference. But they love the Lord, and they love each other, and those are the two MAIN divisions of the Law that the Lord Jesus taught.

Brother, forget about Mac and the Pipe and the Washer and too much Comfort.
Faith cometh by "hearing" is what Paul said, and the guy was a scholar in his own right.
Reading has its place, though.
But all in due time.

We need not reject something written and label it 'unbiblical' because its author belongs to this or that soteriological camp. Sometimes there are gems of scriptural wisdom or principles that can be found in the writings of those whom we might reject outright because of their soteriology, but that is, in my mind, wrong.
I've quoted illustrations from such diverse people as Swindoll, Jeremiah, Begg, Ravi Z, MacA.

Personally I wouldn't call it "unbiblical".
Tithing is biblical, it is in the Bible. Old Testament. Not for the New Testament, though, where we are to give "according as God has prospered us".

When you go into debate with somebody whose thesis is that Jesus is a man, and say he is wrong, you're already done for, because the Bible says Jesus is a man.
You simply need to show why He is NOT JUST ANOTHER MAN.

 

A "graven" mistake? Hopefully it was not an indelible one. ;-)

He made some improvements in the second edition in 2008. He got some needed input from Michael Horton and others since the orginal edition.

You need to put away your mystical tendencies.

 

Boy! You are a significant person. If you had simply stayed there would not have been a split.

Fascinating. I think Mr. Spock was misunderstood. He actually had a heart beneath his half-Vulcan exterior.

 

You are clueless at best.....Unbiblical at your worst.You make drive by statements like this,when someone answers you you run and hide rather than offer anything biblically. If you feel you have a biblical point than offer one.
The "theological box" that you disparage is what you lack for the most part.
You feel you have better theology offer it...I have not seen any "pearls" from any of your posts that i can recall.

 

Inspector Javert

Here is a person studying themself into the doctrines of grace...still learning as he goes and he is asking for advise on how to guide his household to be on the same page theologically.... and you offer this-

The poster did not use this language...he in fact asked;
Quote:
Originally Posted by evangelist6589 View Post
Fellow Reformed do you have any other ideas and or recommendations to offer that would help my wife? What moved me from the IFB ways was the teachings of Reformed that helped me see the light. However I was OPEN to suggestion and that made the difference.

While the poster is learning these truths himself he has not experienced watching God bringing many others to truth yet.Perhaps you have not seen this also or you would not twist or seek to put words in his mouth that suggest such an ungodly thought.

While someone is learning why would you not expect some inconsistency?
That you suggest he is looking for "subtle tactics" rather than some ideas from older believers suggests you are offering a less than noble help in your desire to highlight what might be inconsistent.

So your suggestion is that a believer should not ask help from other believers....interesting... At least he did not read any Molinist ideas to confuse the issue.

Ah yes... we can feel your concern.

Oh...so the noble inspector will defend Charles Finney now, by attempting to trash a young man learning as he goes.This despite the fact that later on in life Finney himself said that the supposed converts of his new measures were a disgrace and if he could do it all over again he would have never done it...and you like SAG38...know better than us mean cals..yes I see.:thumbs:

This by itself might have been more on target if you suggested he wait upon the Lord after asking for advise.

Determinism is fatalism and not Calvinism. To say this is ignorant.

You like others here refuse to understand that God works through means.I believe you know better but to admit the same is to show you hold error.
Asking others is an accepted means.

he is working through many issues ...yes....why so harsh?
B.T.W:

Again he is young and learning.If there is an element of truth here he needs others to help him along that line...not bludgeon him like a baby seal:thumbsup:

because she memorized the shorter catechism by age ten does not in and of itself show any work of the Spirit in regeneration.

you use determinist again showing defective thoughts on your part.If she was a padeo in truth she might not have married you with your credo view.

tactic.....yet you lambast him for the same?

Not knowing these people personally We cannot make that judgement, however if this is the case....this needs to be prayerfully worked out, discussed , and approached biblically.I believe this to be a problem in many churches and families...the wife being the weaker vessel.

determinism is Islam.

.

No real cal goes back....nope...not in reality.

Legalistic fundys want only what they want...not the full revelation of God.

This could be a bit of reaping what he sowed earlier on in His christian life.He is seeking to correct what he now see's as error without harming his wife or the other professed christians in that "church' Even if their theology is weak and pathetic...they are mostly still sheep so he needs to be careful not to harm them.He is not in an ideal situation.That is why he is asking all these questions in the first place:wavey:

Then again if he is on the correct path he will overtake you who would rather explore fringe theology and mis-use you gifts.

That is most likely the case. Frankly if he as head of His household just opens up the passages as they discuss life together she will by God's grace see it for herself.

 

Have I advocated such a thing?

What is your view of the regulative principle ITL?

 

No you did not say that....but you twice asked him this-

that is why I asked you where does a baptist church have an ....ALTAR..at all?

and what do you believe about the regulative principle?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulative_principle_of_worship