The use of Nekros in Ephesians 2:1

Wow, You just butchered the entire concept of reconciliation and regeneration with the above comment.
Your comment argues that demons are reconciled to God just like humans. Do you really think James was saying that?

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The good news. Who can believe? Can a spiritually dead person believe what is spiritually discerned? No
Everyone who believes is the elect of God whom God chose to reconcile. Only those who are made right in Christ can have faith...i.e. the elect of God.

All people can know God exists via natural revelation. No one is saying they cannot know there is a Creator.

Indeed. God has written it on their hearts that they are sinners. Spiritual discernment is not needed to know evil exists.

Spiritually dead who are not reconciled to God and not found in Christ can never know God as their Savior unless God does the work of bringing life to their dead spirit.




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Willis,

I think you received a good treatment of nekros in the thread on the other board in which this word was discussed. Nekros can mean a corpse, or it mean as/like a corpse. In Ephesians 2:1 Paul is making the point that his audience was once dead [nekros] in their trespasses and sins. He was not saying that they were actually a corpse, but they were like a corpse, spiritually speaking. If they were an actual corpse, then they would be physically dead. Obviously, that was not the case. It is like referring to a condemned prisoner on death row as a "dead man walking". The prisoner is not physically dead, but he is under the sentence of death, and therefore considered as good as dead even though he is alive.

Now, a sinner is, indeed, dead spiritually, so nekros is an appropriate word. Being spiritually dead means that the sinner is unable to make any positive response to God while remaining spiritually dead. In that sense the sinner is very much like a corpse, although he is not physically a corpse.

 

Jon, they have no spiritual life outside of Christ. They are dead. Those whom God has chosen will be made alive when God so chooses. They have been chosen before the foundation of the world, but there will be a time in history when God will give life to their dead spirit by placing them in Christ.
God calls us, who have been made alive to preach the message of reconciliation. This is our task. If we fail in our task, God will use someone else. (Recall when Mordechai tells Esther that if she failed to speak up for the Jews, God would save them by another means.)
We should never be so proudful as to imagine that God cannot save his elect if we fail to obey. God will never fail. We, however, miss out on blessing via obedience.

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You did not observe anyone creating an allegory in Ephesians 2. This is an assertion you have entirely made up out of your imagination.

God saves us when he makes us alive in Christ. It is one.
We will respond to that life giving act in many ways, not the least being a recognition of confessed sin.

 

Jon, you have done a nice job of finally whittling down your point to a spot where we can agree. Previous to this you kept adding material that is not present in the text.
It seems we have found a place of agreement.

 

No, it is talking about one's spirit being dead--separated from God--Unreconciled--in darkness.

 

Condemned.

 

Who, pray tell, is Jesus Talking about who may not have an ear to hear? Is it a particular group of people or are YOU ascribing what He says to everyone? Scriptural Proof of what the GOSPELS speak of will be needed. (Here's a hint, Isaiah speaks of those who "do not have an ear to hear.")

Oh I just couldn't wait...

This is Isaiah's commission by Yahweh to *Israel* (Both a near and far fulfillment)

Isaiah 6
8Then I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, "Whom shall I send, and who will go for Us?" Then I said, "Here am I. Send me!" 9He said,"Go, and tell this people: 'Keep on listening,but do not perceive; Keep on looking, but do not understand.' 10"Render the hearts of this people insensitive, Their ears dull, And their eyes dim, Otherwise they might see with their eyes, Hear with their ears, Understand with their hearts, And return and be healed."

Well, how was this fulfilled in the NT, and what is Willis talking about?

Matthew 13 speaks on this...
In them the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled: 'You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.

well creiky! Who is He talking about??

11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

Who is this "Them"????

We will have to back up and get the context

Oh snap, Matthew Chapter 12 tells us!

38 Then certain of the scribes and of the Pharisees answered, saying, Master, we would see a sign from thee.

Jesus is addressing the religious leaders and says that because of their hardness of heart, He has blinded their eyes.

Wait, is there somewhere else in the NT that speaks on this reality?

Hmmmm...I think Paul did speak on this....

Romans 10 begins to speak on this....

21 But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people.

Romans 11 adds more insight...

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear unto this day.

Whoa!!! Wait a minute...the ones who have "blind eyes" and "Dull hearing" are the ones who are seeking to obtain the righteousness of God by their own works?????

Willis, this sounds different from what you are peddling here.

Surely there is more?

Yes keep reading!

9 And David saith, Let their table be made a snare, and a trap, and a stumblingblock, and a recompence unto them:

10 Let their eyes be darkened, that they may not see, and bow down their back alway.

11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.

Say what!

Because of their unbelief and self righteousness, God has opened up salvation to the Gentiles?

HALELUJAH! Praise God!

So you're saying that through their willful disobedience, God has used it for good? Incredible!

Do you have anything else that backs it up?

Keep reading my friend!

30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:

Wow that is awesome!

Wait, what about that passage about that we are all in unbelief...

Oh you mean the one that is taken out of context all the time...

32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

*Them here is self righteous Israel*

So we see here, Willis, that the passages you quote about not having ears to hear and the such from the Gospels are clearly talking about those OUTSIDE of the remnant of Israel (that will be the first fruits of those who will believe on the Lord Jesus Christ)--The Ones who are hardened are The ones that sought favor with God through their WORKS.

((Do not mistake this breakdown for a breakdown of 1 Corinthians 1-2...start another thread and we can address that ))

 

That's a Seinfeld episode, Jon. A show about nothing.
Nothing you said goes against what SG said. Start whittling.

 

I addressed his "out of context" quotes of not hearing/perceiving

don't be a distraction.

I'll step out on a limb here...

Find a verse where hearing/perceiving is NOT unbelieving/Self righteous Israel

 

Willis, give me a verse about not being able to hear/perceive in the Gospels that's not about unbelieving self righteous Israel.