Salvation by the work of attaining God’s attention

And you are still avoiding the question

 

I see we have yet another fictional theology thread from Agedman. He claims salvation by grace through our faith is a works based salvation. But scripture is clear, we are saved by grace through faith. Thus our faith in Christ as credited by God provides access to the grace in which we stand. Romans 5:2

No verse says or suggests we are saved by grace, then given faith. That is false theology.

The order of salvation was mentioned. It was implied that the order is not clearly given in scripture.

When did God choose His Redeemer, His Lamb? Before creation or after creation? See 1 Peter 1:20 says Christ was foreknown before creation. Now do you choose a Redeemer without a plan to Redeem? Nope. So before Creation, God had a Redemption plan that included His Redeemer and as a target group, those to be redeemed. So we have the Plan, the Redeemer and then the target group of the Redemption plan, 1, 2 and 3. Ephesians 1:4 supports this view, God chose us corporately (those to be redeemed) when He chose Christ individually to be the Redeemer, thus He chose us in Him.

Paul tells us the Redemption plan included three other features, those redeemed would be holy and blameless before Him, the redeemed would be predestined to adoption (the redemption of our bodies at Christ's second coming - Romans 8:23) and the redeemed are predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, so Christ would be the firstborn of many siblings. (Romans 8:28)/

The above Redemption Plan is presented plainly in scripture, and their should be absolutely no debate.

 

Yet another false charge, another misrepresentation, another dodge. No quote will be forthcoming. I said no one comes to Christ unless drawn (attracted not compelled) by the Father. So why the falsehood?

Folks, pay no attention to this false theology. We are saved by grace through faith. Faith provides our access to the grace in which we stand.; God credits our faith as righteousness to us. No verse says or suggests we are saved then given faith.

Is God "obliged" to keep His promise, "everyone believing into Christ shall not perish but have eternal life. Yes, because God cannot lie, He is faithful, He keeps His promises.

I do say fallen unregenerate "men of flesh" do have the limited spiritual ability to understand and receive the milk of the gospel (1 Corinthians 3:1-3) But unless the gospel is presented, there would be nothing to put faith in. I said our faith is as a filthy rag to God, worthless and without merit.

Again, pay no attention to Agedman, he makes one false claim after another, as demonstrated above.

The order of salvation was mentioned. It was implied that the order is not clearly given in scripture.

When did God choose His Redeemer, His Lamb? Before creation or after creation? See 1 Peter 1:20 says Christ was foreknown before creation. Now do you choose a Redeemer without a plan to Redeem? Nope. So before Creation, God had a Redemption plan that included His Redeemer and as a target group, those to be redeemed. So we have the Plan, the Redeemer and then the target group of the Redemption plan, 1, 2 and 3. Ephesians 1:4 supports this view, God chose us corporately (those to be redeemed) when He chose Christ individually to be the Redeemer, thus He chose us in Him.

Paul tells us the Redemption plan included three other features, those redeemed would be holy and blameless before Him, the redeemed would be predestined to adoption (the redemption of our bodies at Christ's second coming - Romans 8:23) and the redeemed are predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, so Christ would be the firstborn of many siblings. (Romans 8:28)/

The above Redemption Plan is presented plainly in scripture, and their should be absolutely no debate.

 

Thanks Sheepwhisper for agreeing, at least generally with the truth of scripture, we are saved by grace through faith, not saved by grace and given faith.

 

Faith and repentence don't resemble any "work" I've ever seen or heard of, or read of in scripture.

 

So are sit and sleep.

And grace is a gift, not a reward.

 

They are works of God the Holy Spirit wrought in a former sinner's heart. Eph. 2:8-9 reveal that.

 

So? Your point is?

8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.

 

Having been declared righteous, then, by faith, we have peace toward God through our Lord Jesus Christ, Rom 5:1 YLT
much more, then, having been declared righteous now in his blood, we shall be saved through him from the wrath; Rom 5:9 YLT
For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous. Rom 5:19

Relative to being made righteous, does not, in his blood, by faith and the obedience of one, all have to be the same?

Does not, in his blood, mean, obedience of faith?

? Whose blood, whose obedience, whose faith?

Romans 5:2 KJV By whom (Jesus Christ) also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

Eph 2:8 τῇ γὰρ χάριτί ἐστε σεσῳσμένοι διὰ τῆς πίστεως καὶ τοῦτο οὐκ ἐξ ὑμῶνθεοῦ τὸ δῶρον


What does, faith, believing that comes from within our carnal minds have to do with any of the above???????????????

Is not what is written above actually expressed in the following? -

for the soul of the flesh is in the blood; and I have given it to you upon the altar to make atonement for your souls, for it is the blood that maketh atonement for the soul. Lev 17:11 Darby The soul, life of the flesh of Jesus Christ that was in his blood predicated upon, obedience of faith?

 

My point is that works are, indeed, at work in salvation, but not our works, God's. That is the meaning of Ephesians 2:8-9. Grace, faith, and salvation are all the gift of God. Christ's "work" was His payment for sin through His death on the Cross. This gift is given to those who were chosen (predestined) from eternity (Eph. 1:4). This is only possible if sinful man is utterly sinful, i.e. dead in sin (Eph. 2:1). If sinful man retains any disposition towards good, any moral free agency, then he can claim participation in his own salvation (Synergism).