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Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by thatbrian, Dec 5, 2017.

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  1. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    I don't disagree about what you said, it's what wasn't said that I would like know about. In your opinion how does free will play into your soteriological view?

    Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
     
    #41 Reformed, Dec 7, 2017
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  2. SheepWhisperer

    SheepWhisperer Active Member

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    There were two thieves on the cross, hanging on either side of God Himself. They both heard his gracious words and observed how he reacted to everything that was happening. But one believed while the other rejected....in the presence of God Himself. I don't have an answer as to why some believe and others don't. And this is what this whole debate boils down to really. Why do some choose and others not?

    We all have faith in that we have the capacity to believe in something. God Himself gave us that capacity as human beings.
    God wants people to love Him of their own free will "because he first loved us" the Bible says.. He gives total freedom to choose life or death, the narrow way or the broad way, Jesus or self. God himself gives the invitation to believe and He's basically saying "I hold the keys of death and Hell: choose Jesus and receive Life or you will go to Hell when you die"
     
    #42 SheepWhisperer, Dec 7, 2017
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  3. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Synergism is a fallacy. Since when is reaching out and receiving a gift also considered part of the giving of the gift?
     
    #43 Revmitchell, Dec 7, 2017
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  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Problem is that there are NO example sin the bible that shows to us one God determined to save resisted Him saving them!
     
    #44 Yeshua1, Dec 7, 2017
  5. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Sinners cannot choose to do other than what their sin natures compel them to do....
     
    #45 Yeshua1, Dec 7, 2017
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  6. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    I think that it would be impossible for sinners to accept Jesus as their Lord apart from the Holy Spirit giving them saving faith and enabling them to respond, as sin natures prefer to stay in the dark
     
    #46 Yeshua1, Dec 7, 2017
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  7. SovereignGrace

    SovereignGrace Well-Known Member
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    1) No
    2) No
     
    #47 SovereignGrace, Dec 7, 2017
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  8. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
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    Of course, it would be. Sinners hate God, they hide from Him, and they fear their judgment, so they would never come to Him, as John 6 explains a few times.

    I thank God that He "violated my free will", grabbed me by the scruff of the neck, and saved me!
     
    #48 thatbrian, Dec 7, 2017
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  9. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    I always wondered how those holding to being able to resist saving Grace handle Paul, as he seemed to have the Lord changed his mind!
     
    #49 Yeshua1, Dec 7, 2017
  10. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
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    It's by default. They don't think it through. They understand these things they way they do all of life. They are gods.
     
    #50 thatbrian, Dec 7, 2017
  11. JohnDeereFan

    JohnDeereFan Well-Known Member
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    Must have hit a nerve with that one.
     
    #51 JohnDeereFan, Dec 7, 2017
  12. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    I guess it is the right season for chestnuts.
    Here are a few more:
    1) Does God choose individuals for salvation through faith in the truth?
    2) Does anyone not chosen get saved?
    3) Does anyone chosen for salvation not become saved forever?
    4) Does anyone get transferred into Christ who was not drawn by the Father?
    5) Does everyone drawn by the Father get transferred into Christ?

    Answers
    1) Yes
    2) No
    3) No
    4) No
    5) No
     
    #52 Van, Dec 7, 2017
  13. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
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    Q: Is Van on my ignore list?

    A: YES!
     
    #53 thatbrian, Dec 7, 2017
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  14. Sapper Woody

    Sapper Woody Well-Known Member

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    On some forums, this is known as an "ignore snipe". Where you are shooting at him, but he can't shoot back.

    I prefer to call it what it is: a cowardly taunt. You are hiding behind your ignore function so you can't hear his replies, while talking to him, and even taunting him with the fact that he can't reply back to you.

    Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
     
    #54 Sapper Woody, Dec 8, 2017
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  15. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    Answers
    1) No
    2) No
    3) No
    4) No
    5) No
     
    #55 TCassidy, Dec 8, 2017
  16. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Dies God grant to His elect the faith needed by them to be used in order to get saved, yes!
     
    #56 Yeshua1, Dec 8, 2017
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  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Guess the Lord wants to save all sinners, but due to him having to honor 'free will", He tied his own hands up, and this leads straight into open Theism!
     
    #57 Yeshua1, Dec 8, 2017
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  18. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
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    I might agree if I did that more than once. My post was an announcement to him that he has made it to the top of the list, and it was partially a gracious move because when I don't respond to his future posts he will know why, and he won't waste his time posting to me if he knows that I won't even see it.

    Secondly, if you wish to call me names, it would be better to do so to my face. Doing so this way seems to be hypocritical, in light of your post. Some people have a tendency to throw around insults because of their perceived online-autonomy, but they would never speak that way to a brother in person, and they forget that God will hold them accountable for every careless word.
     
    #58 thatbrian, Dec 8, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2017
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  19. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Then you have Classical Arminians, such as myself, who don't believe half of the garbage you think Arminians believe.
     
    #59 Reynolds, Dec 8, 2017
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  20. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    There are plenty examples of men resisting the will of God for their lives. If God. In His sovereignty allows men to resist certain parts of His permissive will, how can you be sure He does not allow them to resist other parts?
     
    #60 Reynolds, Dec 8, 2017
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