Bible Scavenger Hunt

[1689Dave]

Does scripture directly support any of today’s most popular doctrines?

The 7 year tribulation?

The pre-trib rapture?

The restored Roman Empire?

The rebuilt Temple?

The return to animal sacrifices?

Russia marching on Israel?

A Gap between Daniel’s 69th and 70th weeks?

 

[Mikey]

Does scripture directly support any of today’s most popular doctrines?

The 7 year tribulation?

The pre-trib rapture?

The restored Roman Empire?

The rebuilt Temple?

The return to animal sacrifices?

Russia marching on Israel?

A Gap between Daniel’s 69th and 70th weeks?

Bible Scavenger Hunt sounds vaguely familiar. Perhaps Christian Forums has an answer

 

[atpollard]

The 7 year tribulation?

• [Mat 24:21, 29 NASB] 21 "For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever will. ... 29 "But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.
• [Mar 13:19, 24 NASB] 19 "For those days will be a [time of] tribulation such as has not occurred since the beginning of the creation which God created until now, and never will. ... 24 "But in those days, after that tribulation, THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT,
• [Rev 7:14 NASB] 14 I said to him, "My lord, you know." And he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

I sort of think that scripture is pretty clear that there is a great tribulation. Do you have any scripture in mind to suggest that it is some length other than 7 years?

 

[church mouse guy]

Does scripture directly support any of today’s most popular doctrines?

The 7 year tribulation?

The pre-trib rapture?

The restored Roman Empire?

The rebuilt Temple?

The return to animal sacrifices?

Russia marching on Israel?

A Gap between Daniel’s 69th and 70th weeks?

All but the Darby thing!

 

[1689Dave]

• [Mat 24:21, 29 NASB] 21 "For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever will. ... 29 "But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.
• [Mar 13:19, 24 NASB] 19 "For those days will be a [time of] tribulation such as has not occurred since the beginning of the creation which God created until now, and never will. ... 24 "But in those days, after that tribulation, THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT,
• [Rev 7:14 NASB] 14 I said to him, "My lord, you know." And he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

I sort of think that scripture is pretty clear that there is a great tribulation. Do you have any scripture in mind to suggest that it is some length other than 7 years?

Where is the 7 years? And doesn't Matthew speak of the great tribulation of 70AD in which Christians fled Jerusalem. And then the end of the world where the power of the heavens are shaken?

 

[1689Dave]

Bible Scavenger Hunt sounds vaguely familiar. Perhaps Christian Forums has an answer

I put it up on a couple of other forums trying to get solid scriptural support for these doctrines. Nothing so far.

 

[Mikey]

I put it up on a couple of other forums trying to get solid scriptural support for these doctrines. Nothing so far.

I get it, nothing wrong with it. I thought it was funny that it was copy and pasted exactly

 

[1689Dave]

I get it, nothing wrong with it. I thought it was funny that it was copy and pasted exactly

I use my skinny picture for my icon snap on this forum, and my fat picture on the other forums, in case you are wondering. Also I go by 1689Dave or Dave L. elsewhere.

 

[atpollard]

Where is the 7 years? And doesn't Matthew speak of the great tribulation of 70AD in which Christians fled Jerusalem.

Answering a question with the exact same question is bad form.
What evidence is there that AD 70 was the Great Tribulation?
Was that worse than the Nazi Holocaust? Worse than the Black Death? Worse than the first destruction of Jerusalem? So bad that if God had not shortened the days no one would have survived?

This is YOUR claim, not mine ... so it is yours to present evidence for.

And then the end of the world where the power of the heavens are shaken?

• 29 "But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.

You and I must have different definitions of the word "immediately".

 

[atpollard]

Does scripture directly support any of today’s most popular doctrines?

Does scripture directly support any of yesterday’s most popular doctrines?

Amillennialism?

***********

Isn't the nature of Daniel and Revelation such that clear proof of meaning is lacking and interpretation of prophetic visions is required? That is why I avoid eschatology discussions based on either Daniel or Revelation. I am content to allow God to just surprise me with the details and trust to the Gospels for what I absolutely need to know.

A.T.Pollard's Eschatology:

• There will be trouble.
• Jesus will return.
• Endure until the end.
• Focus on the TWO Greatest Commandments in the mean time.

 

[1689Dave]

Does scripture directly support any of yesterday’s most popular doctrines?

Amillennialism?

***********

Isn't the nature of Daniel and Revelation such that clear proof of meaning is lacking and interpretation of prophetic visions is required? That is why I avoid eschatology discussions based on either Daniel or Revelation. I am content to allow God to just surprise me with the details and trust to the Gospels for what I absolutely need to know.

A.T.Pollard's Eschatology:

• There will be trouble.
• Jesus will return.
• Endure until the end.
• Focus on the TWO Greatest Commandments in the mean time.

Yes! If you cannot find a millennium.

 

[1689Dave]

Answering a question with the exact same question is bad form.
What evidence is there that AD 70 was the Great Tribulation?
Was that worse than the Nazi Holocaust? Worse than the Black Death? Worse than the first destruction of Jerusalem? So bad that if God had not shortened the days no one would have survived?

This is YOUR claim, not mine ... so it is yours to present evidence for.

• 29 "But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.

You and I must have different definitions of the word "immediately".

Where is the 7 year tribulation in scripture?

 

[atpollard]

Yes! If you cannot find a millennium.

[Rev 20:2, 4, 6 NASB] 2 And he laid hold of the dragon, the serpent of old, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; ... 4 Then I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them. And I [saw] the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand; and they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. ... 6 Blessed and holy is the one who has a part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with Him for a thousand years.

... but 1000 years is a Millennium and it is easy to find. Understanding what it means is harder.

So by YOUR criteria, amillenialism is refuted by Revelation Chapter 20. (That was easier than I expected.)

 

[1689Dave]

[Rev 20:2, 4, 6 NASB] 2 And he laid hold of the dragon, the serpent of old, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; ... 4 Then I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them. And I [saw] the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand; and they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. ... 6 Blessed and holy is the one who has a part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with Him for a thousand years.

... but 1000 years is a Millennium and it is easy to find. Understanding what it means is harder.

So by YOUR criteria, amillenialism is refuted by Revelation Chapter 20. (That was easier than I expected.)

The 1000 years in Revelation 20 are not the Kingdom. They are the binding of Satan. When they end Satan is loosed. Satan attacks the kingdom when the 1000 years end.

 

[atpollard]

Where is the 7 year tribulation in scripture?

I already showed you where the Tribulation is in scripture ... reread post #3.

So your only complaint is the claim that it is exactly 7 years.
Got it.

Sorry, I can't help with that. I think I heard that it has something to do with the 70th Week in Daniel, but I don't try to figure out Daniel or Revelation eschatology symbolism.

 

[1689Dave]

I already showed you where the Tribulation is in scripture ... reread post #3.

So your only complaint is the claim that it is exactly 7 years.
Got it.

Sorry, I can't help with that. I think I heard that it has something to do with the 70th Week in Daniel, but I don't try to figure out Daniel or Revelation eschatology symbolism.

There are different tribulations in scripture and none of them call for 7 years.

 

[atpollard]

The 1000 years in Revelation 20 are not the Kingdom. They are the binding of Satan. When they end Satan is loosed. Satan attacks the kingdom when the 1000 years end.

• 4 Then I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them. And I [saw] the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand; and they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
• 6 Blessed and holy is the one who has a part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with Him for a thousand years.

It sure looks like a "millennial kingdom" to me, what with all of the talk about reigning with Christ for a thousand years and all.
I await your "proper" exegesis to enlighten me.

 

[1689Dave]

• 4 Then I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them. And I [saw] the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand; and they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
• 6 Blessed and holy is the one who has a part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with Him for a thousand years.

It sure looks like a "millennial kingdom" to me, what with all of the talk about reigning with Christ for a thousand years and all.
I await your "proper" exegesis to enlighten me.

It cannot be a millennial kingdom. Satan attacks the kingdom when loosed. John says when the 1000 years are finished, Satan is loosed. This means the 1000 years represent Satan's binding and nothing more. Let's be careful not to add to John's words.

 

[atpollard]

There are different tribulations in scripture and none of them call for 7 years.

So just how long is THIS tribulation?

• [Mat 24:21, 29 NASB] 21 "For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever will. ... 29 "But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.
• [Mar 13:19, 24 NASB] 19 "For those days will be a [time of] tribulation such as has not occurred since the beginning of the creation which God created until now, and never will. ... 24 "But in those days, after that tribulation, THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT,
• [Rev 7:14 NASB] 14 I said to him, "My lord, you know." And he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

... which is IMMEDIATELY followed by "THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken".

 

[1689Dave]

So just how long is THIS tribulation?

• [Mat 24:21, 29 NASB] 21 "For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever will. ... 29 "But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.
• [Mar 13:19, 24 NASB] 19 "For those days will be a [time of] tribulation such as has not occurred since the beginning of the creation which God created until now, and never will. ... 24 "But in those days, after that tribulation, THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT,
• [Rev 7:14 NASB] 14 I said to him, "My lord, you know." And he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

... which is IMMEDIATELY followed by "THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken".

The great tribulation happened in 70 AD. When Jesus returns, they will be marrying and giving in marriage. Big difference. But the heavens will start passing away with a great noise.