Can Non-Cals Explain the Sovereign Grace Of Almighty God?

What is typical is your rudeness that you have just displayed.

 

First, you did not point out any truth. You in fact slandered him by accusing him of not being able to answer without a sliver of evidence.

Second, he chose to answer the way he wanted to and you act as if there is only one possible reason that he did so. Its a logical fallacy.

Third, even if what you said was truth, and it wasn't, they way in which you said it is still rude. Your post lacks compliance with posting rule number 3:

"Show grace to the other posters. When someone disagrees with you, discuss it; but be slow to offend, and eager to get into the Word and find the answers. Remember, when discussing passionate issues, it is easy to go too far and offend. Further, if we are "earnestly contending for the faith" it would be unrealistic not to expect at times to be misunderstood or even ridiculed. But please note that your words can sometimes be harsh if used in the wrong way. The anger of man worketh not the righteousness of God."

Further, your post was a personal attack since it was an accusation without foundation against him. You are an admin. Act like it.

 

Well Cals are wrong when you take the wraps off on just what they mean, "none of us" Jesus went to the cross. We didn't. Jesus descended and then ascended after three days. We didn't. Jesus went before the Father God in the Holy of Holies with his precious blood. We didn't ! Salvation was then accomplished. He did it all. We didn't!

Now he asks will you receive this great gift. We receive it knowing he did all to provide it. And that's were Cals get confused. Jesus did ALL to provide it but he did not do ALL to make us receive it. He encourages us to do so, but make us...NO. I encourage my readers to consider such would be in violation with God's gracious character of LOVE.

Well my friend it's grace BUT you've got to have a more accurate understanding of what grace means.

Well what happened with the story of the prodigal son? Who was waiting for the prodigal at home? Who was the one who made the decision to go back to the Father's house?

God convicts the heart and and encourages repentance but he doesn't make them to repent.

All God's Sovereign acts are connected to all the other aspects of his character. He does not deny himself nor change in that regard. It becomes a foolish position to take as to say God can do anything he wants to do when there clearly are things God would never do that don't make sense. Would God attempt to make a square circle? Yes a foolish crazy question. Other things are just as foolish like to say God would go cross grain of LOVE to do something unlovely, as in punishing people for something they couldn't change.

 

What mind? God pulls a string and I say a phrase. The only person Calvinist can possibly debate is God. I was programmed by God to tell you that you are wrong.


"Why would a man who hates God, can't understand what God is offering, and doesn't want it anyway, accept anything?"

Ask a man who hates God. Tell us about that moment while you hated God *snap* you are regenerated.
When you went from gosh i hate God so much lemme hear this gospel here to whoops what?


Reminds me of 12 steppers, drug users or alcoholics who are convinced everyone else must be rock bottom too.

"Yes, including the fact that we did not reach out for it. We did not embrace Christ. Christ embraced us. All of Him. None of us."

Well unregenerated Cassidy while hating God decided to hear the gospel God one day. Wait that can't be right.

Someone must have forced you to hear it, tied you up at gun point, some churchers broke in the house.

Since a unregenerated God hating couldn't possibly decide to hear he gospel.


I don't think non-christians convert to Calvinism. I think only Christians who hit rock bottom intensely remorseful of their sins get the wrong kind of help on their shoulder become Calvinist.

Christians are the prime target, not unbelievers.



" And why would you reach out for a box of stinking dung, which is how the lost man views God and His "gift?""


Well there is these other pagan folks over here who say they threw their innocent sinless god-baby bubba into the volcano to appease their loving and perfectly Just volcano god. And they claim I think their holy and loving perfect volcano god is dung and I can't understand and receive their gnostic magic powers unless I was chosen and drawn by the great fire of the umpaloompa.

Everyone naturally hates the volcano god unless you accidentally read the book of mork during your natural hatred. Then he can zap you to instantaneous reconstruction.

I told those pagans about Calvinist. They said wow thats crazy, how else do you explain our earth not being one big ball of molten hot lava?

 

No need to reply. What part of "total control of the entire process" are you having trouble understanding?

Not once have I avoided answering honest questions from sincere members with no hidden agenda.

Fallacy as determined by your faulty theology.

I don't think anyone on here was surprised by your answer.

Tom, even IF I didn't have an answer, in this day and age, I could go find the answer. When I do not answer your "honest questions," it is because I choose not to. Like I said, I don't have time to play games. [Prediction - I'll be criticized for thinking the discussion of man's salvation is a "game."]

Yet when one doesn't, you level baseless accusations.

Case in point.

To say that I do not post opinions that line up with Calvinistic doctrine is a complement, Tom, not an insult.

I responded properly and thoroughly to the OP. You couldn't help but try to dissect my post. I chose not to take the time or energy to give answers with which you would never be satisfied.

 

And well that's not exactly what Calvinism does??...robs God of his Glory as being a God of Love by commanding sinners to repent, knowing there's no way they can even from birth and to add insult to injury hold them accountable for not doing so? That would be leading people on giving them false hope telling them to repent which insinuates they have the ability to do so, but nope not according to Calvinists. Sorry "T" that's not very satisfying at all.

Nor is it satisfying to hear people of your way of thinking pointing fingers at ones who simply obey God and do what he says in repenting and have you claim they didn't do it....GOD DID. You need to consider they repented many people because of the goodness of God ...when they saw his good, gracious loving character it moved them to repentance. You all actually are diminishing the character of God and how people view him therefore potentially are making people want to pull away or being disillusioned the rest of their lives, and trust me I've seen that with some.

 

As a warden has ultimate control of a prison and a prisoner has limited movement within a cell, God had Sovereignty over all but allows sinner and saint to operate within their free will. God will not allow one to conduct outside of His permissive will. Someone cannot blow up the world just because they wish.

God is fully God allowing one to have free will. God does not want us to love Him without free will. Free Will must exist or God caused sin in the first place.

 

"Do let me put this very plainly. Faith which receives Christ is as simple an act as when your child receives an apple from you, because you hold it out and promise to give him the apple if he comes for it. The belief and the receiving relate only to an apple; but they make up precisely the same act as the faith which deals with eternal salvation. What the child’s hand is to the apple, that your faith is to the perfect salvation of Christ. The child’s hand does not make the apple, nor improve the apple, nor deserve the apple; it only takes it; and faith is chosen by God to be the receiver of salvation, because it does not pretend to create salvation, nor to help in it, but it is content humbly to receive it." All of Grace: An Earnest Word with Those Who Are Seeking Salvation by the Lord Jesus Christ - Charles Spurgeon [emphasis mine]

 

I'm not trying to disprove 5-point Calvinism; I am pointing out that you are indeed in error when you stated above, "we did not reach out for [the gift of eternal life]." If you misspoke, just say so. Or, if Spurgeon is wrong, just say so.

He makes that very clear in the title, "An Earnest Word with Those Who Are Seeking Salvation by the Lord Jesus Christ."
Sounds like a "whosoever" kind of guy to me.

 

Having Faith does not mean exercising to believe in Christ. Many have faith but not in Jesus

 

Neither one? You're not blowing smoke here "T"? Spugeon as pointed out said what he said about faith receiving and you've said the opposite and you claim you're not in disagreement with a very well known Calvinist? Whats fact aren't in evidence?

The Spurgeon Quote
The child’s hand does not make the apple, nor improve the apple, nor deserve the apple; it only takes it; and faith is chosen by God to be the receiver of salvation, because it does not pretend to create salvation, nor to help in it, but it is content humbly to receive it." All of Grace: An Earnest Word with Those Who Are Seeking Salvation by the Lord Jesus Christ - Charles Spurgeon

Cassidy's Statement
Yes, including the fact that we did not reach out for it. We did not embrace Christ. Christ embraced us. All of Him. None of us. Post #12

So again who is right. Cassidy or Spurgeon?

 

Well nice try "T". What did Spurgeon say? ==>"The child’s hand does not make the apple, nor improve the apple, nor deserve the apple; it only takes it..." You say it was placed in the kid's hand. When the last time you heard someone say, "Take this!" when all the time they've got it in their hands???

So why don't you just admit it. You and another leading Calvinist are not on the same page? I mean I don't agree with your position but your acknowledging of at least this doesn't mean you're wrong. It just has to be assessed. But you want to make it seem to appear there's no division among your ranks. Seriously ...not rather foolish?

 

It appears that our brother failed to take into account that Jesus was the "Lamb slain before the foundation of the world." If Adam could be saved, and I believe he was, then every man after him could be saved as well.