1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Does "enlightened" mean saved?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Calminian, Sep 24, 2019.

  1. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    5,821
    Likes Received:
    798
    The passages from John I'll be highlighting below were not received well (by some) in a previous thread. By that, I mean, they were virtually ignored and cast aside as irrelevant. This is amazing, as these passages hold they key to understanding the doctrine of enlightenment.

    Here are the actual passages.

    John 1:6 There came a man, sent from God, whose name was John. 7 He came for a witness, that he might bear witness of the light, that all might believe through him. 8 He was not the light, but came that he might bear witness of the light. (emphasis mine)

    John 1:9 There was the true light which, coming into the world, enlightens every man. 10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. 11 He came to His own, and those who were His own did not receive Him. 12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, 13 who were born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. (emphasis mine)​

    John 12:35 Jesus therefore said to them, “For a little while longer the light is among you. Walk while you have the light, that darkness may not overtake you; he who walks in the darkness does not know where he goes. 36 “While you have the light, believe in the light, in order that you may become sons of light.” (emphasis mine)​

    Here are some of the truths about light and enlightenment we glean from these passages.
    • Light and enlightenment are metaphors for knowledge.
    • Jesus is the true light who enlightens.
    • Enlightenment comes (in some way) to every man.
    • Enlightenment comes before faith.
    • Enlightenment must be responded to while it remains.
    • Only those who respond to enlightenment with belief, become saved.
    • Enlightenment itself, therefore, is not synonymous with salvation.
    Very simple and straightforward. These passages are key in understanding the doctrine of enlightenment and should give us insight into other passages in the Bible which speak of individuals being once enlightened, such as Hebrews 6:4-9, Hebrews 10:26-39, 2Peter 2:20-22.

    Heb. 6:4 For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God, and put Him to open shame.​

    So do these hypothetical individuals lose (fall away from) their salvation? No, as it doesn't appear any salvation terms are used here.

    Do they keep their salvation? No, as there is no indication they ever responded to their enlightenment with belief, and were ever saved.

    Then what did they fall away from? In a phrase, the truth! Jesus brought light (truth) to the world—to "every man." This is not to say that all men know the truth all the time, but it does seem to say all men (all adults), at some point, receive some kind of illumination from God, either about their need for Jesus or about their need to seek out further truth. When they receive this, they are obligated to respond with faith while it remains. If they respond in continual unbelief, they are in grave danger of losing this illumination, and by extension their opportunity to believe. Peter says it this way:

    2Pet. 2:20 For if after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. 21 For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment delivered to them.​

    To recap, John's Gospel tells us what happens to those who respond to enlightenment with belief. They become children of God, and sons of Light.

    Hebrews 6, 10 and 2Peter 2, on the other hand, tell us what happens to those who don't respond in genuine belief. They become darkened to the truth with no other hope (which is quite terrifying). But they also let us know that this fate is not the fate of true believers.

    Heb. 6:9 But, beloved, we are convinced of better things concerning you, and things that accompany salvation, though we are speaking in this way.

    Heb. 10:39 But we do not belong to those who shrink back and are destroyed, but to those who have faith and are saved.​

    I would submit, therefore, that it is impossible to have have an intelligent conversation about the meaning of enlightenment in Hebrews 6 and 10, apart from a discussion about John 1 and 12 (and many other verses in John).

    So, tell me why I'm wrong.
     
    #1 Calminian, Sep 24, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2019
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  2. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2018
    Messages:
    17,825
    Likes Received:
    1,363
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Does "enlightened" mean saved?
    No.
    ". . . the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
    He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. . . ." -- John 1:9-10.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  3. mailmandan

    mailmandan Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2011
    Messages:
    239
    Likes Received:
    108
    Faith:
    Baptist
    John 1:9 describes Jesus as the "true Light," giving light "to every man," but this cannot mean the light of salvation, because not every man is saved. The light either leads to the acceptance of Jesus Christ or results in condemnation for those who reject the light.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,030
    Likes Received:
    3,657
    Faith:
    Baptist

    There is no doctrine of "enlightenment" except what you have made up in your mind.
     
  5. Hollow Man

    Hollow Man Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2019
    Messages:
    269
    Likes Received:
    38
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I agree with you. The first passage that comes to my mind is the passage from Hebrews 6, which is pretty clearly talking about those who heard the Gospel but did not respond or could not respond.
     
  6. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    5,821
    Likes Received:
    798
    Doctrine just means teaching. Of course there is teaching about enlightenment in Scripture.
     
  7. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    Messages:
    26,977
    Likes Received:
    2,537
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Psalm 18:28 For thou wilt light my candle: the LORD my God will enlighten my darkness

    Psalm 19:8 The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.

    John 1:9 There was the true light which, coming into the world, enlightens every man.

    Ephesians 1:18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

    Hebrews 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

    photozo
    [UBS] give light to, light, shine on; bring to light, reveal, make known; enlighten, illumine (inwardly)
     
    #7 HankD, Sep 25, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2019
    • Informative Informative x 1
  8. mailmandan

    mailmandan Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2011
    Messages:
    239
    Likes Received:
    108
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yes, enlightenment is exposure to truth, but exposure to truth does not guarantee reception of the truth. Thorns and thistles and falling away with the impossibility of being renewed again to repentance does not accompany salvation. (Hebrews 6:6-9) Spurious repentance yields thorns and thistles, but genuine repentance that is accompanied by saving faith brings forth vegetation. As we can see from Hebrews 6:7-8, the picture is not a field that had vegetation then lost it, but of two different fields, in which one brings forth vegetation/produces a crop that is useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled and receives a blessing from God, but the other is barren and near to being cursed, in which its end is to be burned.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,030
    Likes Received:
    3,657
    Faith:
    Baptist
    It does mean teaching but it doesnt mean "just teaching". It is not a common thing taught. Its something you made up
     
  10. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    5,821
    Likes Received:
    798
    It's something I've derived from Scripture. It's very common. I've cited several passages. You're welcome to tell me where I've gone wrong.
     
    • Useful Useful x 1
  11. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,030
    Likes Received:
    3,657
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Already did you went wrong when you called it a doctrine
     
  12. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    5,821
    Likes Received:
    798
    Enlightenment is not a common teaching in Scripture. Got it! Thanks for your contribution. :Rolleyes
     
  13. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    5,821
    Likes Received:
    798
    And definitely a parallel thought in Hebrews 10.

    Heb. 10:32 But remember the former days, when, after being enlightened, you endured a great conflict of sufferings, 33 partly, by being made a public spectacle through reproaches and tribulations, and partly by becoming sharers with those who were so treated. 34 For you showed sympathy to the prisoners, and accepted joyfully the seizure of your property, knowing that you have for yourselves a better possession and an abiding one. ​

    The author contrasts the two response to enlightenment, the one who turns away and insults the Spirit, and the one who endures responding in faith.

    39 But we are not of those who shrink back to destruction, but of those who have faith to the preserving of the soul. ​
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2012
    Messages:
    4,960
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Enlightenment is actually part of the order of salvation (Ordo Salutis). Enlightenment occurs when the Holy Spirit reveals the glorious truth of the Gospel to the repentant heart. As far as Jesus enlightening every man, it cannot mean that He saves every man. Also, it does not mean that every man receives saving knowledge. I refer you to what Matthew Henry said about Christ's enlightenment:

    Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
     
  15. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    5,821
    Likes Received:
    798
    I believe I agree with MH. The term, enlightenment, itself is a general term, meaning to show light or show knowledge. In Eps. 1:18, Paul prays for believers to become enlightened about the riches of the glory of their inheritance. It's definitely not a specific term for salvation.

    I believe I agree with you also, that's it's an essential part of the salvation process. That seems to be evident in John 1 and 12. And it a strange way, it also seems to be part of the condemnation process, as in Hebrews 6.
     
    • Useful Useful x 1
  16. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2010
    Messages:
    24,988
    Likes Received:
    2,268
    Faith:
    Baptist
    So God enlightens the walking dead unregenerate corpses of EVERY PERSON with the gospel.

    How does this square with Calvinist's teaching of total depravity?
     
  17. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    5,821
    Likes Received:
    798
    Off topic. Really don't want to go there. We can argue the efficacious call vs. non-efficacious in another thread.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  18. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2010
    Messages:
    24,988
    Likes Received:
    2,268
    Faith:
    Baptist
    You're right. Sorry about that.

    As to your OP, I agree with you. "Enlightened" means knowledge of the gospel. Jesus is the light that enlightens. Enlightenment is not synonymous with salvation.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  19. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2012
    Messages:
    4,960
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Do you understand what Henry means by that statement? Not a dig at you, an honest question.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
     
  20. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    6,890
    Likes Received:
    262
    Faith:
    Baptist
    My Bible says everyone has been enlightened.
    Rom 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
    Rom 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
    MB
     
Loading...