Romans 11

paul stated clearly what the mystery was. Romans 11:25 to 27. And verses 28 and following tell us who this mystery is about. The ones who are enemies on account of the Gospel but are beloved on account of election due to the promises made to the patriarchs

and God used their blindness to include the Gentiles, but once the fulness of the Gentiles are come, the blindness is removed

you all need to let the text say what it says, and stop eisegeting based on your traditions.

 

not me, Paul. Read Romans 11:28 and tell me who he is talking about.

also, who is the question in Romans 11:11and who is Romans 11:15 talking about?

 

sorry, the second coming is not mentioned in the text. The fulness of the Gentiles has to do with when the full number of Gentile elect are gathered. It does not say when the fulness of the elect, which would be at the second coming. It says Israel’s blindness will be removed when the fulness of the Gentiles is come

have you never read the Prophets?

 

Calvin's commentary on Romans 11

That blindness in part, etc. “In part,” I think, refers not simply to time, nor to the number, but means, in a manner, or in a measure; by which expression he intended, as it seems to me, only to qualify a declaration which in itself was severe. Until does not specify the progress or order of time, but signifies the same thing, as though he had said, “That the fullness of the Gentiles,” etc. The meaning then is, — That God had in a manner so blinded Israel, that while they refused the light of the gospel, it might be transferred to the Gentiles, and that these might occupy, as it were, the vacated possession. And so this blindness served the providence of God in furthering the salvation of the Gentiles, which he had designed. And the fullness of the Gentiles is to be taken for a great number: for it was not to be, as before, when a few proselytes connected themselves with the Jews; but such was to be the change, that the Gentiles would form almost the entire body of the Church. (363)

The word for “blindness” is πώρωσις, hardness, callousness, and hence contumacy. “In part,” is generally regarded as having reference both to extent and duration: the hardness did not extend to all the Jews, and it was not to endure, but to continue for a time; and the time is mentioned, “until the fullness of the Gentiles come in.” This is obviously the meaning, and confirmed by the whole context. The attempt of [Grotius ] and [Hammond ], and of some of the Fathers, to confine what is said to the Apostolic times, is wholly irreconcilable with the drift of the whole passage and with facts.

Much as been written on the words , ἄχρις οὖ τὸ πλήρωμα τῶν ἐθνῶν εἰσέλθὟ. That the event was future in the Apostle’s time, (and future still as history proves) is evident, especially from the following verse, “and so all Israel shall be saved.” The plain construction of the passage is, “until the fullness of the Gentiles shall come.” What this “fullness” is to be has been much controverted. But by taking a view of the whole context, without regard to any hypothesis, we shall, with no great difficulty, ascertain its meaning. The “fullness” of the Jews in Romans 11:12, is determined by Romans 11:26; it includes the whole nation. Then the “fullness of the Gentiles” must mean the same thing, the introduction of all nations into the Church. The grafting more particularly signifies profession. It then follows that all nations shall be brought publicly to profess the gospel prior to the removal of the hardness from the whole nation of the Jews. There may be isolated cases of conversion before this event, for “in part” as to extent the hardness is to be: but all shall not be brought to the faith, until the faith spread through the whole world: and the effect of their restoration will be a great revival of vital religion among the professing Gentiles, according to what is said in Romans 11:15. This is clearly the view presented to us in this extraordinary passage, when all its parts are compared with each other.

[Hammond ] tells us, that many of the Fathers wholly denied the future restoration of the Jews, and we are told by [Pareus ] , who mentions some of the same Fathers, that they maintained it. But it appears from the quotations made by the first, that the restoration disallowed was that to their own land, and that the restoration referred to by the latter was restoration to the faith; two things wholly distinct. That “Israel” means exclusively the Jewish nation, was almost the unanimous opinion of the Fathers, according to [Estius ]; and that their future restoration to the faith is here foretold was the sentiment held by [Beza ], [Pareus ], Willet, [Mede ], and others, and is generally held by modern divines. — Ed.

 

I like this simple and concise explanation better...

{13} For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your {b} own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be {c} come in.

(13) The blindness of the Jews is neither so universal that the Lord has no elect in that nation, neither will it be continual: for there will be a time in which they also (as the prophets have foretold) will effectually embrace that which they now so stubbornly for the most part reject and refuse.
(b) That you are not proud within yourselves.
(c) Into the Church.

Geneva Study Bible

 

WHY did you exclude THIS PART of Gill's commentary?!You cut it off before it got to this part.

which in the latter day will be very great; when the earth shall be filled with the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea; when the kingdoms of this world shall become the kingdoms of our Lord and his Christ; and the abundance of the sea shall be converted, and the forces of the Gentiles shall come to the church, and multitudes of them shall flock thither, as doves to their windows: and since the blindness of the Jews is not yet removed, it seems plain that the full number of God's chosen ones among the Gentiles is not yet completed in regeneration; for as soon as ever they are all called and brought in, the vail will be taken away from the Jews, and they will be turned unto the Lord.

Romans 11 Bible Commentary - John Gill’s Exposition of the Bible

 

I did not come to my position reading commentaries, but by reading scripture. But it appears that Calvin and Gill (two quite different traditions) came to the same conclusion I did.

 

.
So you put part of Gill's commentary and leave the part out you disagree with? I wouldn't do that personally.

 

The message of Romans 11 is clear to everyone who reads it without "tradition goggles" on. That would include Calvin, Gill, and others. I was SURPRISED that Calvin had basically the same view on Romans 11 as I do, I thought he would have had a different view, so I went online to see what his view was. Nope. He understood Romans 11 basically the same way I do. BECAUSE IT'S CLEAR when you read it and take it for what it says

 

This explanation, which includes elements of what I have said and elements of what others have said, (I think) is a good interpretation of the text.; Not every ethnic jew will be saved, but the Holy Spirit will be poured on Israel as a corporate body.

SEE also Zechariah 12:10

As we have noted in our last few studies, Paul foresees that the widespread Jewish opposition to the gospel will not last forever. At present, there is a “partial hardening” of ethnic Jews against Jesus (v. 25)—but not a full one, as Paul, Peter, and Jewish Christians throughout history testify to the fact that the Lord always has a remnant of believing ethnic Jews in the church (vv. 1-6). This hardening will occur “until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in” (v. 25). At some point, the number of redeemed Gentiles will reach its God-appointed fullness. Then, and only then, will the pervasive hardening of Israel be lifted. Through the hardening of Israel as a corporate body (but not every ethnic Jew) and the salvation of the fullness of elect Gentiles, Israel as a corporate body (but not every ethnic Jew) will be saved. Dr. R.C. Sproul writes in his commentary Romans, “The full complement of God’s elect from [ethnic] Israel will be saved and … this will come in a new redemptive-historical visitation by the Holy Spirit when the time of the Gentiles is fulfilled.” https://www.ligonier.org/learn/devotionals/israels-temporary-hardening/

 

Romans 11:25 and verses following is the scripture that we have.

 

Calvin's commentary on Romans 11

That blindness in part, etc. “In part,” I think, refers not simply to time, nor to the number, but means, in a manner, or in a measure; by which expression he intended, as it seems to me, only to qualify a declaration which in itself was severe. Until does not specify the progress or order of time, but signifies the same thing, as though he had said, “That the fullness of the Gentiles,” etc. The meaning then is, — That God had in a manner so blinded Israel, that while they refused the light of the gospel, it might be transferred to the Gentiles, and that these might occupy, as it were, the vacated possession. And so this blindness served the providence of God in furthering the salvation of the Gentiles, which he had designed. And the fullness of the Gentiles is to be taken for a great number: for it was not to be, as before, when a few proselytes connected themselves with the Jews; but such was to be the change, that the Gentiles would form almost the entire body of the Church. (363)

The word for “blindness” is πώρωσις, hardness, callousness, and hence contumacy. “In part,” is generally regarded as having reference both to extent and duration: the hardness did not extend to all the Jews, and it was not to endure, but to continue for a time; and the time is mentioned, “until the fullness of the Gentiles come in.” This is obviously the meaning, and confirmed by the whole context. The attempt of [Grotius ] and [Hammond ], and of some of the Fathers, to confine what is said to the Apostolic times, is wholly irreconcilable with the drift of the whole passage and with facts.

Much as been written on the words , ἄχρις οὖ τὸ πλήρωμα τῶν ἐθνῶν εἰσέλθὟ. That the event was future in the Apostle’s time, (and future still as history proves) is evident, especially from the following verse, “and so all Israel shall be saved.” The plain construction of the passage is, “until the fullness of the Gentiles shall come.” What this “fullness” is to be has been much controverted. But by taking a view of the whole context, without regard to any hypothesis, we shall, with no great difficulty, ascertain its meaning. The “fullness” of the Jews in Romans 11:12, is determined by Romans 11:26; it includes the whole nation. Then the “fullness of the Gentiles” must mean the same thing, the introduction of all nations into the Church. The grafting more particularly signifies profession. It then follows that all nations shall be brought publicly to profess the gospel prior to the removal of the hardness from the whole nation of the Jews. There may be isolated cases of conversion before this event, for “in part” as to extent the hardness is to be: but all shall not be brought to the faith, until the faith spread through the whole world: and the effect of their restoration will be a great revival of vital religion among the professing Gentiles, according to what is said in Romans 11:15. This is clearly the view presented to us in this extraordinary passage, when all its parts are compared with each other.

[Hammond ] tells us, that many of the Fathers wholly denied the future restoration of the Jews, and we are told by [Pareus ] , who mentions some of the same Fathers, that they maintained it. But it appears from the quotations made by the first, that the restoration disallowed was that to their own land, and that the restoration referred to by the latter was restoration to the faith; two things wholly distinct. That “Israel” means exclusively the Jewish nation, was almost the unanimous opinion of the Fathers, according to [Estius ]; and that their future restoration to the faith is here foretold was the sentiment held by [Beza ], [Pareus ], Willet, [Mede ], and others, and is generally held by modern divines. — Ed.

 

1689 as in 1689 Baptist confession of faith? My position is fully compatible with Calvinism.

Calvin's commentary on Romans 11

That blindness in part, etc. “In part,” I think, refers not simply to time, nor to the number, but means, in a manner, or in a measure; by which expression he intended, as it seems to me, only to qualify a declaration which in itself was severe. Until does not specify the progress or order of time, but signifies the same thing, as though he had said, “That the fullness of the Gentiles,” etc. The meaning then is, — That God had in a manner so blinded Israel, that while they refused the light of the gospel, it might be transferred to the Gentiles, and that these might occupy, as it were, the vacated possession. And so this blindness served the providence of God in furthering the salvation of the Gentiles, which he had designed. And the fullness of the Gentiles is to be taken for a great number: for it was not to be, as before, when a few proselytes connected themselves with the Jews; but such was to be the change, that the Gentiles would form almost the entire body of the Church. (363)

The word for “blindness” is πώρωσις, hardness, callousness, and hence contumacy. “In part,” is generally regarded as having reference both to extent and duration: the hardness did not extend to all the Jews, and it was not to endure, but to continue for a time; and the time is mentioned, “until the fullness of the Gentiles come in.” This is obviously the meaning, and confirmed by the whole context. The attempt of [Grotius ] and [Hammond ], and of some of the Fathers, to confine what is said to the Apostolic times, is wholly irreconcilable with the drift of the whole passage and with facts.

Much as been written on the words , ἄχρις οὖ τὸ πλήρωμα τῶν ἐθνῶν εἰσέλθὟ. That the event was future in the Apostle’s time, (and future still as history proves) is evident, especially from the following verse, “and so all Israel shall be saved.” The plain construction of the passage is, “until the fullness of the Gentiles shall come.” What this “fullness” is to be has been much controverted. But by taking a view of the whole context, without regard to any hypothesis, we shall, with no great difficulty, ascertain its meaning. The “fullness” of the Jews in Romans 11:12, is determined by Romans 11:26; it includes the whole nation. Then the “fullness of the Gentiles” must mean the same thing, the introduction of all nations into the Church. The grafting more particularly signifies profession. It then follows that all nations shall be brought publicly to profess the gospel prior to the removal of the hardness from the whole nation of the Jews. There may be isolated cases of conversion before this event, for “in part” as to extent the hardness is to be: but all shall not be brought to the faith, until the faith spread through the whole world: and the effect of their restoration will be a great revival of vital religion among the professing Gentiles, according to what is said in Romans 11:15. This is clearly the view presented to us in this extraordinary passage, when all its parts are compared with each other.

[Hammond ] tells us, that many of the Fathers wholly denied the future restoration of the Jews, and we are told by [Pareus ] , who mentions some of the same Fathers, that they maintained it. But it appears from the quotations made by the first, that the restoration disallowed was that to their own land, and that the restoration referred to by the latter was restoration to the faith; two things wholly distinct. That “Israel” means exclusively the Jewish nation, was almost the unanimous opinion of the Fathers, according to [Estius ]; and that their future restoration to the faith is here foretold was the sentiment held by [Beza ], [Pareus ], Willet, [Mede ], and others, and is generally held by modern divines. — Ed.