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Featured Ex-Calvinism (Why I am no longer a Calvinist)

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by JonC, Jan 24, 2020.

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  1. Particular

    Particular Well-Known Member

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    Jon, you are being vague. Is this intentional? If so, why?
    What presupposition do you now ascribe to? Jesus had a pet turtle?
     
    #161 Particular, Jan 28, 2020
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  2. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    My current presupposition is that fundamental doctrines (those we build upon) need to be stated in the Biblical text itself. That is where I separate from Calvinists.
     
    #162 JonC, Jan 28, 2020
  3. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    Are Turtles a clean or unclean animal? ;)
     
    #163 atpollard, Jan 28, 2020
  4. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Hmm. . . .
    Romans 6:23, "For the wages of sin is death; . . ."

    Ezekiel 18:4, ". . . the soul that sinneth, it shall die."

    Romans 5:8, ". . . while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."

    Isaiah 53:12, ". . . he hath poured out his soul unto death: . . ."

    Isaiah 53:6, "All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all."
     
    #164 37818, Jan 28, 2020
  5. Particular

    Particular Well-Known Member

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    This is an incredibly vague comment by you. Are you intentionally avoiding telling us what you believe and how scripture supports your belief?
     
    #165 Particular, Jan 28, 2020
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  6. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I told you we can discuss my view on a thread started on my view if you would like.

    BUT you are asking me to explain my views and defend my views on post #165 of a thread about another topic.

    Do you think that an honest request?
     
    #166 JonC, Jan 28, 2020
  7. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Six hour warning - thread will be closed sometime after 5pm EST
     
    #167 JonC, Jan 28, 2020
  8. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    I beg to differ. I do embrace TULIP but I am not a Calvinist. A Calvinist is a follower of all Calvins teaching including baby baptism and jumping hoops of sacraments. Plus they define predestination as involving Gods scripting every fiction of your life. I don’t believe that!
     
    #168 Earth Wind and Fire, Jan 28, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
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  9. Particular

    Particular Well-Known Member

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    I think this thread is dishonest in that the op is vague and explains nothing about Calvinist presuppositions and why they are not supported biblically. I think you have provided no biblical reason for why you reject Calvinist presuppositions.
     
    #169 Particular, Jan 28, 2020
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  10. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    To be clear, I affirm Calvinism EXCEPT for the idea divine justice is in accord with the 15th century humanistic legal philosophy as I believe that philosophy inherently wrong.

    If Calvinism does not hold that presupposition then I have affirmed Calvinism. If it does then I only reject the presupposition and its fruit.
     
    #170 JonC, Jan 28, 2020
  11. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    that would be presbie Reformed, but not us Baptist reformed!
     
    #171 Yeshua1, Jan 28, 2020
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  12. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    You are rejecting penal Substitution, correct?

    And also that Adam experienced spiritual death in the fall?
     
    #172 Yeshua1, Jan 28, 2020
  13. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I am rejecting a form of the philosophy of justice called "rertibutive justice".

    If Penal Substitution Theory depends on that philosophy then yes. If not then no.
     
    #173 JonC, Jan 28, 2020
  14. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Is there any other basis for it though?
     
    #174 Yeshua1, Jan 28, 2020
  15. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    Yes baptism and sacramental worship but what about prestination?
     
    #175 Earth Wind and Fire, Jan 28, 2020
  16. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    Then you resemble the Franciscans!
     
    #176 Earth Wind and Fire, Jan 28, 2020
  17. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    If they had a shaved head then I do. I'm letting it grow out though.
     
    #177 JonC, Jan 28, 2020
  18. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Calvinist can and do affirm either single or double predestination, but only Hyper ones affirm Fatalism!
     
    #178 Yeshua1, Jan 28, 2020
  19. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    A very different way of living Jon
     
    #179 Earth Wind and Fire, Jan 28, 2020
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  20. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Well, I could not have hair for 23 years. (I know nothing about that group)
     
    #180 JonC, Jan 28, 2020
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