Featured Faulty Logic, Faulty Theology

when Adam sinned we all sinned

Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

 

I don't understand the thinking that Adam is something other than a normal human being just because he was created perfect.

Genesis 2:7 (KJV) And the LORD God formed man [of] the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

 

Who argued that he was something other than a normal human being?

 

It also destroys the theology of Paul in Him contrasting Adam and the second Adam!

 

Well saying that he didn't or couldn't die spiritually makes him abnormal in my book, doesn't it in yours?

 

Ah I see what you are saying. What I still don't understand from @JonC is what does being dead in sin mean exactly? How does that relate to us? How does it relate to Adam pre-fall and post-fall?

 

You're right I didn't say that well and as a result what I said was wrong.

I meant to disagree with the idea of two different deaths being alluded to in the passage of Genesis. Sometimes people see the "die die" in Hebrew to mean two different deaths and I disagree with that.

For me, the more proper way of thinking is that sin leads to death. Ezekiel 33:12 - 16 I don't believe in the "spiritual death" in the Greek philosophical sense but rather in the Old Testament sense. This is how Ephesians reads in the NLT.

Ephesians 2:1-3 NLT
Once you were dead because of your disobedience and your many sins. [2] You used to live in sin, just like the rest of the world, obeying the devil—the commander of the powers in the unseen world. He is the spirit at work in the hearts of those who refuse to obey God. [3] All of us used to live that way, following the passionate desires and inclinations of our sinful nature. By our very nature we were subject to God’s anger, just like everyone else.

Notice the wording of the first verse is just completely different. As a result, the passage reads quite differently. At the same time I did look up the preposition for translated to "in" in greek in the ESV and KJV and can't really find a reason for that choice. Regardless, I was looking and thinking of the following passage when I replied to you:

Romans 5:15 NLT
But there is a great difference between Adam’s sin and God’s gracious gift. For the sin of this one man, Adam, brought death to many. But even greater is God’s wonderful grace and his gift of forgiveness to many through this other man, Jesus Christ.

I won't quote the entire passage 12-21. But that was the passage I was thinking of when I responded to you.

Sometimes on this forum, I am overly contentious. As a result I have to take a step back and re-examine what I wrote as I do make mistakes.

 

You can look these up in the NLT and see how different many of them are.

Also read my response and clarification to my previous wrong answer in #107

 

The death Paul speaks of as spiritual is not death as in not being mobile, but death means separated from God we become separated because of sin. This is the death Paul is speaking about. We are not born dead spiritually but we are once we sin. We are not responsible for Adam's sin Adam is.
MB

 

Adam dying on the day he sinned is not in scripture therefore is not an interpretation but speculation.
MB

 

That is your opinion, I disagree.

 

That is what they continually fail to address.

 

Apparently he was a golem.

 

He was a golem.

 

No God is not a liar Adam did die but his death was of the body. God did not say he would die spiritually, or when. This is the Calvinist Idea and it isn't true or God would have said he would die spiritually. I'm sorry but you seem to be full of assumptions. Take God's word for what it says and stop adding to it.
MB.

 

God does not create men dead in there sins. Men are born in to sin not born sinners. You need to read it again. With out your presumed ideas
MB.

 

Is the spirit of Adam haunting the doors of your church?