Henry Morris KJV Study Bible

Does the Word of God matter? Look at Mark 10:6 and elsewhere. Talking about people, Jesus said that God made them male and female from the beginning of creation. Therefore, Adam and Eve were at the beginning of Creation according to Jesus. Does it matter what Jesus said?

 

Dwayne: You claim that the Grand Canyon didn't form quickly, yet we observed the formation of a similar, though smaller, canyon form in the Toutle River drainage over the course of a few days - not over millions of years. The only difference is the magnitude of the event, not the process. I have been to Mt. St. Helens, and I would rather believe my own eyes and the Word of God than your claim which is based on an evolutionary narrative. Most people grossly under estimate the destructive force of moving water. In one year God used it to completely restructure this planet, and He told us all about it in His Word - and He expects us to believe it.

 

It is great that you have been to Mt. St. Helens. Thanks for your post.

Have you looked at what happened in the Lake Missoula Flood? We know that the waters moved at about 100 mph in that flood and raced from Montana to the Pacific Ocean. My geology prof always said that water altered the landscape much more than wind ever would and it is windy out west in the desert.

 

You're getting goofies as you go ! I NEVER said He didn't make'em male & female, same as He did animals.

And He made dinos male & female as well.

Now, try to say I denied Jesus' words from THAT !

 

That destructive force can slowly erode, as it did the Appalachian Mts & the Grand canyon, or it can rend large rocks, etc. to pieces quickly. The GC shows evidence of slow erosion, not the sudden breaking away of boulders & monoliths.

The Appalachians are generally covered in soil, showing a slow process. A tsunami, etc. woulda washed the soil away.

 

Jesus is talking about people, not animals, so forget the part about the land animals such as dinosaurs, which were made on the sixth day.

Jesus said: Mark 10:6 (KJV) But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.

Also, Matthew 19:4 (KJV) And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made [them] at the beginning made them male and female,

So two questions, yes or no:

1. Does the word of God matter?

2. Was Jesus speaking the truth?

If Adam and Eve were male and female from the beginning that means that they were present at the beginning of creation. So do you believe Jesus or not that Adam and Eve were at the beginning of creation?

 

Both questions, yes.

And you're trying to change the subject, which is the age of the earth. And A&E were at the beginning of God's present arrangement of the earth's surface.

 

Dwayne: The "geologic column" is a record of rapid, large-scale events that involve water-laid sediments. The fossil bearing layers are a testament to the speed with which they formed because they demonstrate that billions of plants and animals, on a global scale, were buried alive by sediment-saturated waters. The subduction, uplift and folding of these layers also demonstrate that this whole process occurred in a short amount of time. Even today they find fossil clams within 300 feet of the summit of Mt. Everest, and they were fossilized in the closed position - indicating that they were buried alive. An articulated T-Rex skeleton was found in near Lusk, Wyoming with the lower part of it's rib cage in one rock layer and the upper part in another layer. And there was no difference in the condition of the bones on either side of the boundary, indicating that those two layers formed in rapid succession. As for the Appalachians, the difference may be nothing more than the kinds of sediments that were deposited that far east of where the Rockies were formed.

 

I am not trying to change the subject. You have the overwhelming majority bias that science is better than Moses.

As for your interpretation of Moses that Adam and Eve, whom Jesus said were at the beginning of creation, you change that to contradict both Moses and Jesus by saying that there was a beginning before what you call the present arrangement of the earth's surface. So you admit that you do not believe Jesus.

Luke 16:31 (KJV) And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

 

You contradict Jesus who is quoted in both Mark and Matthew talking about *the beginning*. And Moses says in *the beginning.* So there is only one beginning and Adam and Eve were there.

 

Yes, only one beginning for the current arrangement of the earth's surface.

 

You're trying out different theories to try to justify a "young earth", but the physical, empirical evidence is overwhelming for a very old earth and universe in general. One such proof is the fact that we see the light from luminaries so distant that it takes their light millions of years to reach us.

And you may Google the fact that over 99% of all plant & animal species that ever lived are extinct, with most of them being never seen alive by men. Remember, Noah took a pair, male & female, of EVERY land animal & bird aboard the ark, so if dinos had then existed, they woulda been taken aboard.

 

Jesus said at the beginning of creation.

You seem to disagree. There was only one beginning because both Moses and Jesus use the term the beginning, which is singular.

You probably represent the viewpoint of 90% of Baptists since the 18th century. Even Spurgeon would agree with you about deep time.

Do you agree that earth will die a heat death?

 

Well, there WAS only one beginning for the current arrangement of the earth's surface.

And yes, the current surface will be dissolved in great heat, & God will make a new surface.

 

Dwayne: No, I'm not "trying out different theories"; what I did was demonstrate that there are evidences from modern observation that show that the Earth could be young. And the empirical evidence for an old Earth are hardly "overwhelming". It is a mistake to state emphatically that something is true when it is based only on your chosen interpretation of the evidence. For example, you offer the light from distant stars as "proof" that the universe is billions of years old. Actually that starlight proves nothing. If God could create this entire universe in six days, out of absolutely nothing, then He surely could have created light-waves already in place so that we would be able to see and appreciate His greatness and glory. The idea that the universe was created with the appearance of age is not a novel concept, as God planted a garden for Adam on the same day that He created him. Adam didn't have to wait for years for those trees to mature and begin fruit-bearing, they were created fully grown and ready.

And as for Noah, you don't know that he didn't take dinosaurs into the ark. They may well have been juveniles but that wouldn't do any violence to the Biblical account. And one more thing, it doesn't matter how many species are now extinct, and there is no warrant for you to make the claim that most of them were never seen alive my man. There is no way that you could know that to be true. You are entitled to believe what you want, but you are making up stuff that calls the authority and credibility of the Word of God into question.

 

It is nice that one can pick and choose when to believe and when not to believe. It's like at a cafeteria. Don't ask me to respect either your outdated science or your trashing of Scripture.

 

You're going by guesswork insteada firm empirical proof. Again, just Google the statement that 0ver 99% of all species that ever existed are now extinct.

If Noah had taken dinos, there'd be dinos now, or at least proof that they existed not long ago. And had people seen such gigantic critters asT-Rex or brontosaurus, there would be records & legends about them.

And again, God enabled us to discover the speeda light for a reason.

 

You have a philosophical bias and you say that Scripture is contradicted by science but then about 95% of Baptists agree with you on the old earth notion and the gap theory. Old earthers say that the handful who believe Moses and Jesus are presuppositionalists. They trust their obsolete ivy league educations. Even Gruden agrees with you.

 

Know what "Bah ! Humbug!" means ?

Jesus never said the earth was only a few thousand years old.

And Moses proved it when he wrote that the spirit of God moved over THE FACE OF THE WATERS, showing earth was in existence before God started making the current arrangement.

ALL 'scientific' discoveries are made according to God's will. He enabled us to find the speeda light, how to calculate the approximate distances to interstellar objects. (As earth & all objects in the universe are moving at various speeds, it's impossible to calculate those distances with extreme accuracy.) He preserved fossils for us to find. And that's just the tippa the iceberg for PROOF of earth's great age.

 

What we see far out in space is older than now. And also since the light evidence is it is all* moving away from our galaxy except* the few galaxies moving with the Andromeda coming toward us. What is measured moving away gives an age of our universe to be some 13.7 billion years old.