Featured The Role of Women in the Family and Church

The whole issue of women in the Church, is becoming more and more unbiblical. Too many churches have more or less abandoned what the Bible clearly says of the role of women, as in the passage that you quote from 1 Timothy.

Romans 16:1, is clear that women can be Deaconess' in the Church, "I commend to you our sister Phoebe, a servant of the church at Cenchreae", where the word "servant", is in the Greek, "διακονον", which is feminine.

It must never be forgotton, that only the man is created in the "glory" of God, and not the woman: " For a man ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God, but woman is the glory of man" (1 Corinthians 11:7). Becuase man, and not woman, is "the head", and man was created first, and then the woman, as a "helper", for the man, which is a subordinate role, which is what 1 Corinthians 14:34 says, "let the women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but let them be in subjection, as also saith the law." It is possible, that the word "speak" here, λαλέω, can be understood as "preaching", as it is so used in Acts 10:44, "While Peter yet spake (λαλέω) these words, the Holy Spirit fell on all them that heard the word".

 

Every now and then I will come on here and tell a true story, that has been handled down, though out my church life of 50 years... In the Old Line Sovereign Grace Primitive Baptist Church I grew up in, a woman preacher was unheard of... None ever graced our pulpit or any of the sister churches we were in fellowship with... A friend of mine Joe Holder who is also a preacher, invited a friend of his a preacher Elder Sonny Pyles, from Texas, to fill an appointment at his church Little Zion in California, which he did.

At the conclusion of Elder Sonny Pyles sermon, a song was sung and the right hand of fellowship offered, prayer followed an everyone was milling around, welcoming friends and the visitors that came... To all those that knew of him he preferred to be called Brother Sonny and talking with, his friend Brother Joe that invited him and was in conversation with other preachers that had come to hear him... A woman interrupted the conversation and said: Brother Sonny, I believe the Lord has called me to preach?... I'm sure many preachers would have whipped out their Bibles and showed her in the Bible, that preachers are men only, quoting 1 Timothy 3... He could probably quoted the whole thing as he had a photographic memory and in over his many years preaching, knew his Bible, but he didn't.

Around the same time the conversation was going on the children as all children are inclined to do, had made new friends and as they were getting reacquainted, carrying on and chasing each other around the church and having a great time... Brother Sonny, in the mean time was pondering what she said and putting his hand cupped to this chin and nodding his head up and down said... Hummm!... You don't say?... I add here after hearing the man all my life he had a quick wit also and what he was about to say was a doozy... Sister he said, putting his hand gently on her shoulder and turning her to where the children were raising a ruckus... Looking her straight in the face, then turning away, while pointing at the children said... Well Sister!... There is your congregation!... Exasperated!.. She then turned and walked away... Brother Glen

Btw... This was back in the day when Women preachers were unheard of and I suppose if a preacher did this today, the woman in question might have walked out... And filed a lawsuit!

 

Women preach to women and kids. Women don't preach to men. Women do not teach men.

 

@Steven Yeadon

In the short time that I've been on this forum, I've seen several threads about this subject.
My replies have always been basically this:

1) God's word states, in no uncertain terms, who He holds responsible as head of the family...
The man.

2) God's word states, in no uncertain terms, what the role of precious sisters actually is...
To raise the family and to minister their gifts to the church within the bounds of her being a woman.


For example, I see Scripture plainly declaring that women cannot hold the offices of preacher, teacher, elder ( pastor / bishop / deacon ), because that is not who the Holy Ghost makes overseers within the local body of believers.
However, woman are not relegated to "secondary roles"...
They have theirs, and men have theirs.

Each according as God has blessed the body.

As for the the "brewing war" between "conservatives and moderates"?
To me, it's very obviously a war between professing Christians who want to obey the Lord in everything, and those who do not.

I hold that every word matters...
But there are many that I run into ( and even some on this forum ), who do not share my convictions.

 

SO, you are right that men need correction. There is absolutely no doubt about that. What is not in order is women trying to do that correction. That may be frustrating, especially for smart women, but it is not unique to them.

What your worldview seems to ignore is that men also have a chain of command and ways that things must be handled. Bosses at work, other men in the church, etc., etc., etc. We all find this frustrating at times, sometimes extremely frustrating.

That said, wise men will want to know what the wise women are thinking. It’s not illegal to ask. When asked, a wise woman will not tend toward usurping authority through the answer.

 

IMO, there should be.
But can it be done carefully, responsibly and with an eye towards respecting all that the Lord has set forth in His word?

See my above.
Yes men are often wrong, at fault, etc.

Do you think that this is the right place to discuss it?

If so, can it be done graciously and Biblically...
despite the frustration from women who see that nothing is apparently changing?

For a woman to be highly knowledgeable in the Bible I think is very commendable...
Teaching and preaching within the assembly, pastoring, etc. the Lord still holds men responsible, not women ( 1 Timothy 3 and many other places ).

 

As for conduct:

If half the men I know of that profess Christ took His words about their roles within the church and within their families seriously,
I don't think that threads like this would even pop up.
In addition, how many women do I know of who profess Christ, are headstrong and absolutely will.not.ever. do as the Lord commands?

At this point, I will refrain from making my specific views known about this in public...
Because to me, it's simply not profitable, respectful and ( most importantly ) neither is it edifying, to engage in this sort of "bashing".

I admit that both men and women are at fault in their respective areas;
There are problems on both sides and have been for a very long time.
But even more so, this subject, unless dealt with very carefully, can and often does result in deeply hurt feelings;
and this is why it should be done graciously and with patience.

Presenting this from a man's point of view, I will say this:

I value a Proverbs 31 woman ( who is not perfectly obedient to the Lord but desperately wants to be ) who exhibits the qualities found in Ephesians 5:22-33, 1 Timothy 2:9-15 and many other places.
Granted, we all have an untrustworthy flesh that tempts us to all kinds of things.
But both women and men in the body of Christ are to strive for godliness...

Not against it.

But I did not.
In fact, I sympathize with your apparent feelings...

Now, are you serious about how the Lord wants women to conduct themselves?
I do hope so, because in my estimation,
that would make you one of very few that I know of who profess Christ that is determined to follow the Lord in everything.

I already see the mess from the man's point of view,
and I can say with all honesty that it is a very big problem and one in which I, myself, am determined to follow Him no matter what.

I cannot speak for other men, but that's me speaking for myself.

 

Well, I haven’t been on the board long, and don’t generally participate much in certain types of threads, so I certainly wouldn’t have the same perspective as you. You hit on a lot of things, some church related, some not. Admittedly, I didn’t try to address all of that, and no doubt missed the point you really wanted to stress.

But I will hit one point here as a problematic example. The thing about Kamala. If you feel no one has said anything similar about any men in politics here, you just haven’t bothered to notice. And there have been plenty of related comments about men in other fields as well. Am I wrong about that?

 

Must avoid both extremes, one being a woman can basically do nothing within the assembly of the Church but be a babysitter, while other is that they can be the senior pastor!

 

men and Women are both fully equals in the sight of God, but have different roles and responsibilities!

 

Kamala is just another liberal who does not believe in Jesus is Lord!