1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Translating OT from Septuagint

Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by rlvaughn, Dec 21, 2020.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,454
    Likes Received:
    451
    Faith:
    Baptist
    the guiding by the Holy Spirit in ALL our daily lives is essential. When engaged in the vast subject of textual studies, with so many translations now available, and with different readings, it is here that we need to seek the Holy Spirit, as He alone leads us to the Truth.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  2. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,454
    Likes Received:
    451
    Faith:
    Baptist
  3. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,454
    Likes Received:
    451
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Jerome was a great Bible textual scholar, not Augustine!
     
  4. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2002
    Messages:
    9,760
    Likes Received:
    1,337
    Faith:
    Baptist


    Gosh, I agree with you. LOL

    One common misconception is that there is only one Septuagint.
    • The fact is there are many different versions of the Greek OT
    • Many (many, many) different authors translated what we now call the Septuagint (or LXX) and within each version there is a wide variety of translation methods.

    Merry Christmas

    Rob
     
    #84 Deacon, Dec 25, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2020
  5. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,454
    Likes Received:
    451
    Faith:
    Baptist
    A very Happy Christ-mas to you and your family. May our Great God bless you all
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  6. Conan

    Conan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2019
    Messages:
    2,062
    Likes Received:
    334
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Like I said, no real evidence. False witness, probably originated by one bible "onlyist".

    Here is from his own words, which count far more than suggestions by unnamed people.

    was henry joseph thayer unitarian - Google Search

    he writes to a pastor
    desirous of reading up on the deity of Christ:
    But in preparing to present from the pulpit any doctrine of the truth of
    which I was thoroughly convinced (like the present doctrine), I have usually
    found myself most helped by reading the ablest books on the other side. By
    doing this, one not only best discovers what the actual difficulties of an
    unbeliever are, but has suggested to him (often) the best methods of meeting
    them.

    And

    "
    JOSEPH HENRY THA YER 265
    one who in wide erudition and advanced scholarship "knew it
    all," and yet held fast to every vital point of the old faith.
    Three passages from his letters will illustrate my meaning:

    The really strong argument in support of Christ's pre-existence has
    always seemed to me to be the concurrent, yet (at least as respects its form)
    independent, representations of the biblical writers, not even excepting the
    synoptists; for, although the first three gospels contain no explicit assertion
    of the doctrine, the personage they portray forbids his classification with
    ordinary men, and leaves so unique and exalted a conception of his relation
    to the Father that the explicit declarations of the fourth gospel awaken no
    surprise in the ordinary reader. In fact, the old assertion of the critics, that
    the fourth gospel presents a very different personage from the Messiah of the
    first three, is now, I believe, generally abandoned.
    Indeed, how anyone who admits the exceptional character of Jesus, above
    all recognizes in him the embodiment of the self-manifesting power of God,
    can be stumbled by the statement that he (congruously enough) came into
    the world in an exceptional way, I never have been able to understand.
    On the genuineness of John my opinion remains unchanged. Many of
    the embarrassments I think due to (or greatly aggravated by) misconception
    as to the nature of the gospels in general, and of that one in particular, and
    the consequent application to it of false historical requirements which it was
    not intended to meet.
     
    #86 Conan, Dec 25, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2020
  7. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,454
    Likes Received:
    451
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Why don't you check his Lexicon for yourself
     
  8. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I agree. I think that where we mostly disagree is in exactly what is "inspired". Where you lean towards the words themselves (which is probably the most common position and was the position of the seminary I attended) I lean towards what those words communicated (latitude, I suppose, in how the human authors expressed those words). And I cannot say that I would be consistent in my view (it is a leaning). But I do believe that divine inspiration transcends translation, partly because I also believe that so much of Scripture is missed due to "literal" methods of interpretation - not that the "literal meaning" is incorrect but that often what is being communicated is more significant (again, you can accuse me of inconsistency and that would be a fair accusation).

    But we are all dependent on the work of the Spirit. I absolutely agree with you here.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2017
    Messages:
    7,359
    Likes Received:
    1,465
    Faith:
    Baptist
    And yet your own comment is in the tradition of the latter. LOL.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  10. Conan

    Conan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2019
    Messages:
    2,062
    Likes Received:
    334
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Lies do not make it so. First of it is his translation of someone elses Lexicon. Second the forward written is false, probably by Green. The first false witness of this was in "kingdom of the cults", which was incorrect. It is a plain fact that he was a Congregationalist, not a unitarian. You are passing on false information. I realize you don't mean any thing bad, but your sources are false.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2017
    Messages:
    7,359
    Likes Received:
    1,465
    Faith:
    Baptist
    "Ay, there's the rub." Wasn't Origen's Hexapla purportedly an attempt to compare Greek versions? He does not seem to have considered all of them to be LXX. Nor does Jerome

    Beyond the tradition of 72 translators (forget for a moment the myth that they all translated the OT entire), did they think the LXX a hybrid of translations?
     
  12. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2017
    Messages:
    7,359
    Likes Received:
    1,465
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Do not twist the statement or its intent. That the Holy Spirit should prevail is paramount. But God is not stupid or irrational or illogical, nor is his Word. God is above man's abilities not below them.

    And a man is not the Holy Spirit. Someone imagining or claiming that the Holy Spirit led him into falsehood is deceived, and should in no wise be believed. Anyone imagining such things do not happen is open to being grievously misled. No one engaging in argument is above being challenged on the merits of his argument.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2001
    Messages:
    10,544
    Likes Received:
    1,558
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Joseph Henry Thayer served in the Congregational Church. Here is a journal article: Joseph Henry Thayer: The Man and His Work. Here is a relevant portion:
     
    • Winner Winner x 2
    • Informative Informative x 1
  14. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,454
    Likes Received:
    451
    Faith:
    Baptist
    When you understand textual studies we can have a better dialogue. Until then
     
  15. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,454
    Likes Received:
    451
    Faith:
    Baptist
    People try to support the unsupportable
     
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
  16. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2017
    Messages:
    7,359
    Likes Received:
    1,465
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Your posts make that seem doubtful when they deny, ignore, or omit more basic requisites, including a basic comprehension of what is being said. But you aren't under obligation to reply to my posts.
     
  17. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2017
    Messages:
    7,359
    Likes Received:
    1,465
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Agree strongly. Human nature abhors a vacuum.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2001
    Messages:
    10,544
    Likes Received:
    1,558
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I don't own Thayer's Lexicon and don't own stock in Joseph Henry Thayer. I have nothing to "try" to support. It is historically demonstrable that he joined, pastored, and served within the Congregation Church. Whether or not he was heretical, not trinitarian, or whatever was none of my concern in the post I made. The other (about the Congregational Church) is an historical fact regardless of what anyone might think about him, good, bad, or indifferent.
     
    #98 rlvaughn, Dec 25, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2020
    • Like Like x 1
  19. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,454
    Likes Received:
    451
    Faith:
    Baptist
    :rolleyes:
     
  20. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2020
    Messages:
    10,454
    Likes Received:
    451
    Faith:
    Baptist
    My words were not addressed to you, but to those who still try to defend Thayer as non Unitarian, even though he was
     
    #100 SavedByGrace, Dec 25, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2020
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...