Featured Insincere gospel offer Part 2

I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not. Are you saying that @George Antonios is a Mormon? You had posted meaty like a Mormon and yet I assumed you were just giving a reference that he was presenting something meaty like a Mormon. Then you posted this. Is this in relation to George Antonios because you did not really quote anyone for who you were contending with.

Just asking for clarification since you seem to be reproving a false teaching associated with Mormonism?

 

Are you trying to say something?

Your first 'sentence' has 135 words
and I can't see where anything you said has a statement, a subject, or purpose.

 

The Holy Spirit redirected the journey of Paul, correct?

 

Also wanted him to journey not into Asia, correct?

 

I believe you are applying His words wrong per your references in tying to make your point.

There are scriptural references provided for you to click on to see that it reproves you for how you are applying His words wrong, but of course, it is on God to cause the increase. You are not alone in this shortsightedness for why scripture proves otherwise.

As iron sharpen iron, I seek your good in the Lord as only Jesus can prune the fruitful so they can bear more fruit as He has done for me..

 

With the understanding that the Lord Jesus Christ as Our Good Shepherd & the Head of every believer is leading Paul through the Holy Spirit in Paul. See?

Just like Paul is not really speaking but the by the Holy Spirit in Paul AND YET it is not the words coming from the Holy Spirit as those words are what the Holy Spirit hears & that He speaks as the Spirit of Christ ( John 16:13 ) as coming from Christ's as all power has been given unto Him per Matthew 28:18-20.

 

The Holy Spirit is NOT a junior partner of the trinity, as He spoke and guided and inspired, He IS to us as Jesus was to His Apostles, the member of the Godhead that we deal with now!

 

Does the Son do the Father's will & not His own? The prayer at the Garden of Gethsemane proved that. So why would you believe the Holy Spirit does whatever He wants per His own will? I understand the misconception, in 1 Corinthians 12;4-11 but not everything in that reference is referring to the Holy Spirit for why in alignment with other scripture, the identity of the "he" is Jesus Christ.

1 Corinthians 11:4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord. 6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all. 7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal. 8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit; 9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit; 10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues: 11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.

Who is the author & finsiher of our faith? Jesus Christ per Hebrews 12:1-2

Who will finish the work that was begun in us? Jesus Christ philippians 1;6

Where does all the fruits of righteousness comes from? Jesus Christ Philippians 1:11

Does the Holy Spirit give credit & the glory for the words, fruits, & gifts to Jesus Christ? Yes, He does; john 16:13-15

That is how you prove everything that believers apply in the Bible because if scripture in that Bible opposes what someone is misapplying in teaching, then that is how you correct a false teaching.

But if a modern Bible prevents you from correcting a false teaching, check with the King James bible, hoping in the Lord that He is ministering to cause the increase.

The Holy Spirit is the Comforter per John 14:26.

Jesus Christ is the Bridegroom. Guess what a bride should be doing? seeking His face & trusting Him to be their Good Shepherd thru the Holy Spirit in them. Your response is to the Bridegroom when the Bridegroom relates to you through the Holy Spirit in you & through His words given to you out of love for you..

 

They will always agree, as do their Minds, but the three Persons of the trinity ALL do spiritual work "of their own"

 

You're so far off, I am not even going to quote the references within Matthew 7:13-27, to the lost, lost, lost, lost.

All are lost unless God shows Mercy.

Heretics teach that The garden of Eden is in the present state and all humans have a choice to believe in one Tree in The Garden or the other.

"Jesus is not the Savior" comes in thousands of versions.

The Fact that God Choses some is His Business and the Fact that He Simply leaves the rest and doesn't Grant them the ability to Repent and Have Faith is O.K. with them.

They love darkness rather than Light and Will Be Eternally Judged so.

from: T.P. Simmons

Clear thinking is very much needed when we come to deal with the free agency of man. Some have imagined it a very difficult subject because they have made out of it something other than what it is.

For the same reason some have charged that the doctrine of unconditional election, a Bible and Baptist doctrine, destroys the free agency of man.

Well does Spurgeon say: "In reference to the matter of predestination and free will, I have often heard men ask, 'How do you make them agree?' I think there is another question just as difficult to solve. 'How do you make them differ?' The two may be as easily made to concur as to clash. It seems to me a problem which cannot be stated, and a subject that needs no solution!" (Sermons, Vol. 13, p. 31). I. FREE AGENCY OF MAN A BAPTIST DOCTRINE

The New Hampshire Declaration of Faith, widely accepted among Baptists, declares that election is "perfectly consistent with the free agency of man."

The late George W. McDaniel, while president of the Southern Baptist Convention, said in a personal letter to the author: "The Baptist position recognizes both divine sovereignty and free moral agency." Spurgeon says: "The predestination of God does not destroy the free agency of man, or lighten the responsibility of the sinner" (Sermons, Vol. 18, p. 30).

D. F. Estes (Hamilton Theological Seminary and Colgate University) says: "The moral freedom of man was clearly held by Paul, and none the less positively and tenaciously because of certain other views which he held but which seem to some to be inconsistent therewith" (New Testament Theology, p. 104).

W. W. Hamilton says: "God has united certain great facts in salvation, and we must surely come to grief if we fail to recognize this. Sovereignty and free will are seen closely related when Peter said at the great revival on Pentecost, 'Him being delivered up by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye by the wicked hands of lawless men did crucify and slay." (Bible Evangelism, p. 90).

J. M. Pendleton says: "There are no truths more plainly revealed in the Bible than that God is sovereign and man is free (Christian Doctrines, p. 103).

E. Y. Mullins says: "Free will in man is as fundamental a truth as any other in the Gospel and must never be cancelled in our doctrinal statements. Man would not be man without it and God never robs us of our true moral manhood in saving us" (Baptist Beliefs, p. 26).

J. P. Boyce says: "Free agency belongs to the nature of an intelligent moral creature. He must have freedom of choice, or he would not be responsible for his action. The very essence of responsibility consists in the power of contrary action, had one so pleased" (Abstract of Systematic Theology, p. 224).

A. H. Strong says: "Free agency ... has been shown to be consistent with the decrees (of God)" (Systematic Theology, p. 117).

It is manifest from the above quotations that free agency, according to its use among Baptist authors, must have a meaning different from that which many people understand it to have. Spurgeon, Estes, Pendleton, Mullins, Boyce, and Strong are all clear in their teaching of unconditional election.

"Man cannot do otherwise than continue in sin so long as he is in his natural state (Jer. 17:9; Prov. 4:23; Job 14-4; Jer. 13:23; John 6:65; Rom. 8:7,8; 1 Cor. 2:14).

But his continuance in sin is not due to outside compulsion or restraint, but to his own character which causes him to choose darkness rather than light (John 3:19).

He continues in sin for the same reason that a hog wallows in the mire.

He continues in sin for the same reason that God continues in holiness.

Thus he is fully a free agent."

Man is free and God is Sincere in telling Mankind that all are children of WRATH.

Some do not come to Jesus because they do not want to, based on their Natural Decendancy from Adam, who was in The Garden of Eden and Fell, as Representative of the rest of Mankind.

You Will Not Come unto Me is what Jesus said about their 'will'.

"Whosoever believes" and those God Gives Conviction, Repentance, & Faith are simply THE SAME.

God Does Not Give the Commission to Preach the Gospel to every creature, TO ANY HERETIC.

God Commissions His children through His churches and Gives them His Direction to preach to everyone. No Promise is Made TO EVERYONE.

Jesus DID NOT DIE for EVERYONE, in any respect.

A.) They could have ALL Rejected Him, leaving His Death, Burial, and Resurrection a waste.

B.) No One Jesus Died for Will Go to Hell.

C.) Jesus and a lost person in Hell Did Not Both Suffer the Wrath of God for their sins.

 

He certainly did (you're basically making fun of God's initial set-up there, unwittingly) and he will yet fulfill his original plan out in eternity, as it is written:
Isa 9:7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end,

In both scenarios, the Godhead ends up with the glory. There is no "issue" here.

Call me "cultic" all you want. Any Bible teacher worth his salt knows that there is a grain of truth in every heresy.

And who is sufficient for these things?

 

So the thing is that Asia of the time of Paul, this is not the same as what is meant today by the concept of Asia. At the time of Paul, Asia was the southwestern part of modern Asia Minor/ Turkey. So the Lord seems to have decided to apply Paul's abilities to a wider region than just Asia.
I look English-speaking because of the difficulties of the language, it is difficult to understand how Asia differs from Asia.

 

According to the Father's will & since His ascension, according to His Son's Whom is still submissive to His Father's will, but now as the Head of the Church & all power is given unto Him ( Matthew 28:18 ) for why all credit & glory in ministry, the Holy Spirit gives to the Son per John 16:13-15

1 Corinthians 11:3But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God. KJV

Ephesians 4:15But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: KJV

Ephesians 5:23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. KJV

How you are applying you are applying 1 Corinthians 12:4-11 to mean by applying the pronoun "he" to the Holy Spirit as if in according to His will runs contrary to other scripture, thus proving you are not rightly dividing the word of truth as most modern day tongue speakers & other believers are doing for putting their focus on the Holy Spirit rather than on the Son in living that reconciled relationship with God the Father by.... even in worship. John 14:6 & John 5:22-23 & John 13:31-32

Paul stressed having this mind of Christ in worship for the Philippians believers to do in obedience while in his absence in Philippians 2:5-13

As it is, you are ignoring scripture & what the Holy Spirit is doing in you because He is still pointing you to go to the Son in coming to God the Father by for anything be it in prayer, fellowship, & worship. Are you led by the Spirit of God & scripture or are you led by your assumptions which cannot be supported by scripture out of context without other scripture reproving your application of His words?

 

No.

He said his exposition was 'meaty.'

I said, 'meaty like the Book of Mormon,' meaning simply that the validation of the Book of Mormon is made by eisegesis of the Scriptures of the same nature of George's for his assertions.

His claims are not Mormon per se, but the idea of colonizing other worlds as a primary purpose of creation is a definite tenet of Mormonism, as well as the relegation of the work of Redemption to a contingency. Many Worlds and Many Gods: An Excerpt from

 

Redemption is a small thing after all.

 

I was not addressing what you are trying to prove to us in the thread but addressing how you are not rightly dividing the word of truth per your earlier use of Matthew 7:21-23 as if that applies towards unsaved when it does not.

It is a hiccup in your presentation as the other scripture provided shows how, what you are trying to prove, also runs against those scripture.

If man has free will, how can that be, when he is a slave to sin? That is why God the Father has to draw them unto the Son ( John 6:44 ) to reveal His son to them, even unto babes, ( Matthew 11:25-27 ) so they can believe in Him as that is a work of God also per John 3:18-21.

Does that mean they can never be lost as a saved believer or brother? No. They can go astray as Jesus explained here in Matthew 18:10-17 adding excommunication in verse 17. Then compare that excommunication for the purpose being done by the church on a brother that refuses to repent in verses 4-5 of 1 Corinthians 5:1-13.

And because of the phrase "may be saved", if you are still in that mindset of thinking they were never saved, no where in scripture is it written that any believer in error or in sin is to be judged as not a believer nor saved. They are not instructed to preach the gospel to them but to correct them or excommunicate them if unrepented.

Even Paul addressed the falling away from the faith as those who err believing they can receive the Holy Spirit again ( 2 Corinthians 11;1-4 & 1 timothy 4:1-2 ) are at risk of damnation ( as vessels unto dishonor in His House per 2 Timothy 2:18-21 ) in 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12 for why in spite of reminding believers of the tradition taught of us when we had received the Holy Spirit along with the belief of the truth at the calling of the gospel in 2 Thessalonians 2:13-15, Paul goes on to address those that have fallen away from the faith in 2 Thessalonians 3:1-7 to issue the commandment to withdraw from them that no longer walk after the tradition taught of us but are disorderly as many in those apostate movements of the "spirit" are, but the commandment to withdraw is not to treat them as the enemy, but to admonish them as brothers still per 2 Thessalonians 3:14-15. So the commandment to withdraw is to admonish them as brothers still; not condemned as unbelievers.

Then you have how God will judge every believer in 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 whereby if one has defiled the temple of God & has not repented with His help by the time the Bridegroom comes to judge the House of God in that day, then they will be left behind to be rewarded with physical death ( Revelation 2:18-25 ) but the spirit is saved per 1 Corinthians 3:15-17 )

So there are scripture reproving how you ae applying certain selected scripture to mean & since scripture cannot run against scripture, you should trust Jesus Christ as your Good Shepherd to help you take pause, pray for help to see, before continuing serving Him in ministry because your iron needs sharpening, brother.

 

That's an unjust accusation and a false argument.
As wonderful as redemption is, so abominable is the sin that made it necessary.
God's ideal was a world whereinto sin never entered.
It didn't have to be that way. That's what makes our fall the more tragic.
Foreknowing the future is not predestinating the future.

But I know I'm talking to no avail. It's OK.

 

No, no. I get it. Plan B. I will give you credit for following your views to their logical ends.

 

If Isaiah 9:7 is the basis for how you are applying, you should note that it is the government & peace that shall know no end; not increase of the people. As we live in a world where sin & evil governments reigns; there will be increase of His government & peace where there will be no end. That is not even referring to His millennium reign when after a thousand years, Satan will be released from the pit to lead a last rebellion for a small season before Satan is finally cast into the lake of fire along with hell & death.

In the 1000 year reign, there is no more sea to make room for the generations growing up in His reign. But when death s done away with & under His feet, the Son gives the Kingdom back to the Father.

1 Corinthians 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. 21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. 24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. 25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. KJV

Now if the children of this world marry & are given in marriage which is for family building, but those who partake of the firstfruiit of the resurrection shall neither marry nor be given in marriage but be like the angels in Heaven that can never die...that alone should give you pause about the rest of eternity for the rest of the people, those that are His at His coming at the end of the great tribulation & those who remain loyal to Him after Satan's last rebellion & death is cast into the lake of fire for when afterwards the Son gives up the Kingdom back to the Father.

Luke 20:34 And Jesus answering said unto them, The children of this world marry, and are given in marriage: 35 But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage: 36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection. KJV

Does that mean those not of the firstfruits could still marry & have children afterwards? If that is not the reward for the firstfruits, why would it be for them when death is done away with when the kingdom is handed back to the Father?

When we look at what makes up the whole of His kingdom before giving it to the Father, there is a finality when we see 23 harvests & no other before giving that kingdom back to the Father.

Matthew 13:33 Another parable spake he unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened. KJV

Christ's the firstfruits O.T. saints & N.T. saints abiding in Him as His disciples = 1st harvest
They that be Christ's at His coming "left behind saints & former believers & new believers after rapture event = 2nd harvest
Those loyal to Christ after Satan's last rebellion = 3rd harvest

That is the whole of the kingdom of heaven when death is done away with & the kingdom is handed back to the Father.

So it is in that regard that the increase of His government & peace shall know no end for nothing will decrease it nor take that peace away. So you should discern the eternal state of the firstfruits for why when death is done away with, & the kingdom is handed back to the Father, there will be no more generations following since the firstfruits will not.

 

There are some good points there, things I've meditated on before, but this topic is worthy of its own thread.