Can Jesus Cast Out Saved Believers?

John 10:16 cites another fold that did not follow His voice, does it not?

John 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

In context, I align that with the sheep that climbed up another way in following a stranger's voice per John 10:1-5

This is referring to false prophets that lead believers to another means for life other than Jesus for why Jesus is stressing Him as being the only door per John 10:7-11 He said all those that come between Him and them is the thief for why the sheep that follow His voice do not follow them. John 10:8 That can be applied to the RCC and those who promote the movement of the spirit to chase after & receive those spirits after a sign, even a sign of tongues proclaiming them to be the Holy Spirit when He is not, even though they address Him in prayer & worship to receive Him again and again and again. That is why Jesus said this.

John 10:1Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber....7 Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep. 8 All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them. 9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. 10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

So the sheep that followed the stranger's voice in John 10:1-5 is the sheep that went astray for why they are not of the fold that followed His voice but He still must bring them because they are His sheep by believing in Him for why they that get left behind, will be resurrected after the great tribulation as they WILL hear His voice literally as their King of kings and be of the one fold & one shepherd for the millennium reign.

Only the Lord can confirm that to you to see that every element of that chapter has been applied to that presentation and scripture elsewhere supports that there are 2 kinds of believers in His kingdom per Matthew 5:19 & 2 Timothy 2:20.

 

John 10:16 cites another fold that did not follow His voice, does it not?

John 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

In context, I align that with the sheep that climbed up another way in following a stranger's voice per John 10:1-5

This is referring to false prophets that lead believers to another means for life other than Jesus for why Jesus is stressing Him as being the only door per John 10:7-11 He said all those that come between Him and them is the thief for why the sheep that follow His voice do not follow them. John 10:8 That can be applied to the RCC and those who promote the movement of the spirit to chase after & receive those spirits after a sign, even a sign of tongues proclaiming them to be the Holy Spirit when He is not, even though they address Him in prayer & worship to receive Him again and again and again. That is why Jesus said this.

John 10:1Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber....7 Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep. 8 All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them. 9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. 10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

So the sheep that followed the stranger's voice in John 10:1-5 is the sheep that went astray for why they are not of the fold that followed His voice but He still must bring them because they are His sheep by believing in Him for why they that get left behind, will be resurrected after the great tribulation as they WILL hear His voice literally as their King of kings and be of the one fold & one shepherd for the millennium reign.

Only the Lord can confirm that to you to see that every element of that chapter has been applied to that presentation and scripture elsewhere supports that there are 2 kinds of believers in His kingdom per Matthew 5:19 & 2 Timothy 2:20.

 

John 10:16 cites another fold that did not follow His voice, does it not?

John 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

In context, I align that with the sheep that climbed up another way in following a stranger's voice per John 10:1-5

This is referring to false prophets that lead believers to another means for life other than Jesus for why Jesus is stressing Him as being the only door per John 10:7-11 He said all those that come between Him and them is the thief for why the sheep that follow His voice do not follow them. John 10:8 That can be applied to the RCC and those who promote the movement of the spirit to chase after & receive those spirits after a sign, even a sign of tongues proclaiming them to be the Holy Spirit when He is not, even though they address Him in prayer & worship to receive Him again and again and again. That is why Jesus said this.

John 10:1Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber....7 Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep. 8 All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them. 9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. 10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

So the sheep that followed the stranger's voice in John 10:1-5 is the sheep that went astray for why they are not of the fold that followed His voice but He still must bring them because they are His sheep by believing in Him for why they that get left behind, will be resurrected after the great tribulation as they WILL hear His voice literally as their King of kings and be of the one fold & one shepherd for the millennium reign.

Only the Lord can confirm that to you to see that every element of that chapter has been applied to that presentation and scripture elsewhere supports that there are 2 kinds of believers in His kingdom per Matthew 5:19 & 2 Timothy 2:20.

 

Which post # please?

We all prophesy in part & know in part; and yet we are required to share any talent the Lord has given us as profitless servants. Granted, He can prune what we have learned to be more fruitful ( John 15:1-2 ) so we should always be open to correction until He brings us Home by His righteousness & His faithfulness.

But you should be the one to convey why you read 1 John in that way even if Dave presented it for your understanding because Dave's presentation may be different from even how you apply Dave's words to mean.

I do not read 1 John in that way at all when John says that believers need to walk in the light in fellowship with the Father & the Son for how His blood cleanses us from all sins and that if anyone did sin, per 1 John 2:1-2, we have an Advocate to forgive us of our sins per 1 John 1:9.

John was addressing believers that believe for one reason or another that sin ceases to be sin for them for why they walk in darkness per 1 John 1:8 & 1 John 1:10 for why they need to confess it as sin in 1 John 1:9 & walk in the light per 1 John 1:3-7

John is not saying we never sin since Jesus did teach us a prayer to the Father to forgive us our trespasses aka debts as we are to forgive others if we expect the Father to forgive us; but we are not to live in unrepentant sins nor walk in darkness.

Matthew 6:.9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. 10 Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven. 11 Give us this day our daily bread. 12 And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. 13 And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen. 14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: 15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Thank you for sharing.

 

What does that mean exactly to your references below?

Your scriptural references posted below since thread is featured to the internet in case readers outside the forum are reading.

John 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

1 John 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. 8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

Are you applying this as meaning you are not saved yet but on your way to salvation as a disciple that continues to love one another? If not, then you are NOT saying salvation begins at discipleship and so I ask how you are applying scripture to mean?

Because Jesus has warned us to forgive others daily as He taught us this daily prayer or else the Father will not forgive us.

Matthew 6:.9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. 10 Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven. 11 Give us this day our daily bread. 12 And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. 13 And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen. 14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: 15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

 

I do not want to get too much in Church's history outside the Bible either but for clarity leading to judgment...

Pope Clement 1 was considered the official Pope of Rome as called as such even though the RCC claimed Peter was the first Pope but was never called as such in the N.T. In light of that, Clement 1 sent a letter to the Corinthians to brow beat them through a slurry of scripture & references of Biblical people & events in scripture into giving to his collectors visiting the churches in Corinth. This covetous practice continues on today where CC are expected to give tributes to those above them.

The doctrine of the Nicolaitanes is conquest of the laity where one is being served by the churches due to covetousness, be it power or money & provisions for support. The deeds of the Nicolaitanes are sexual immorality. Usually power corrupts & absolute power corrupts absolutely as they compromises the church's stance in society by which being outside the church rule the churches to submit or else when they are the ones to be submitting to the Word of God as there are no authority outside the church except Him. That is why presbytery are to be located in that city for which local churches can submit them to the Word of God as they are. Today's Presbytery are out of town and thus no one can correct or rebuke them as they rule.

I expounded further in my second paragraph to show how bad churches are today for having an authority not being submissive to the Word of God outside the church to rule over them. You do not know them, or how they got that position, let alone to remove them when unrepentant in their ruling.

God be willing, I shall reply further on your reply next post by keeping this somewhat short.

 

I understand your application and I can agree in the part of referring to the Marriage Supper because of this reference..

Luke 22:17 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and said, Take this, and divide it among yourselves: 18 For I say unto you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine, until the kingdom of God shall come. 19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me. 20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.

The following verse seems to segue to sitting down with the O.T. saints at this Marriage Supper table in heaven.

Luke 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. 25 When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are: 26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets. 27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity. 28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out. 29 And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God. 30 And, behold, there are last which shall be first, and there are first which shall be last.

But while verse 30 also sort of ties in with what you are saying in how the O.T. saints & N.T. saints will be sitting together at the table, it doesn't in light of how those who profess Him are cast out for being workers of iniquity.

While verse 26 can be applied to how they take communion...believing that His Presence is in the bread & wine and or believing as some Presbyterian Churches begins their communion service by saying, "We come into His Presence today.." which denies Him as being in us always... for we are not walking away from His Presence after communion.

Does it matter that we say what we mean and not say anything or do anything like communion to that effect as denying Him in us always and not receiving Him any more ?

Matthew 12:35 A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things. 36 But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment. 37 For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

2 Corinthians 11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

It does seem it matters. And if they do this, & get left behind. it does not mean they are not saved or not His as the Father will chasten them in that way before receiving per Hebrews 12:4-11 even for the ones left behind & not just in regards to now..

 

I suspect that Hymenaeus and Philetus in 2 Timothy 2:16 is in relation to 2 Timothy 2:15 for believers to read the scripture for their edification while Hymenaeus and Philetus were using tongues for private use such as self edification which is not of Him at all.. I get that as being of the devil per 2 Timothy 2:26 as that which can be applied to Hymenaeus and Philetus for being among them leading others astray.

If you are aware of how modern day tongues assumed to be for private use because it is gibberish nonsense and no foreign language of men, then note how they always associated that tongue by another drink of the One Spirit; hence another baptism with the Holy Ghost by that sign of tongue thus saved believers are committing spiritual adultery per Matthew 12:39

This be they that known the depths of Satan for which they speak in that church at Thyatira as Jesus address those that have not known that tongue in verse 24 to hold fast in Revelation 2:18-25

If you consider the five foolish virgins that were pounding on the door for the Lord to let them in, they were out to the market seeking to be filled with oil ( Holy Spirit ) while the prudent knew that they were for why they were ready to go and they were not. So for believing they can receive the Holy Spirit again by that sign of tongue and others receive the Holy Spirit again in other signs of confusion like slain in the spirit & holy laughter movement & Pensacola Outpouring, & Toronto's Blessings and Ernest Angeley's Healing Crusade back around the 1980's & etc... these saved believers risk being left behind, unless they turn to Jesus Christ for help at that throne of grace to help them to repent and stop chasing after those spirits & shun that vain & profane babblings to pray normally before the Bridegroom comes as greater is he that is in them than he that is in the world 1 John 4:4.

So there is a reason for why believers will be left behind as that is the same reason the churches are to excommunicate.

1 Corinthians 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

So Jesus can eat the Marriage Supper with abiding saints in sincerity and in truth.

1 Corinthians 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.......11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolator, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

 

Okay. Thanks for sharing. Still in disagreement with Dave G's post.

In Matthew 7:13-27, we see false prophets coming into the church as a warning from Jesus in Matthew 7:15-20

This is addressing believers that have gone astray by the iniquity cited in Matthew 7:13-14. That iniquity of broadening the way is how we come to God in worship, fellowship, & prayer which is having believers go to the Holy Spirit rather than the Son. Reproof for that iniquity can be seen by how Christ gives the solution to avoid that iniquity in Luke 13:24-30 for why they are left behind for not applying that solution.

Do not believers fall down in these movement of the spirits as Jesus warned & described in Matthew 7:24-27 for not heeding His words of John 14:6 even when seeking to receive another baptism of the Holy Ghost by a sign of tongues from the Holy Spirit Himself ( John 10:1-5 ) for why many follow a stranger's voice, tongues without interpretation and thus assumed in error for private use & not the real God's gift of tongues as cited by the law & prophets to be doing in being of other men's lips to speak unto the people in 1 Corinthians 14:20-22 and not to serve as a sign or proof for the already saved believers to seek after? Matthew 12:39

So the reason why God will deny saved believers to attend the Marriage supper in Heaven is because they are in iniquity. That does not mean they are not saved. Even former believers left behind, He still abides in them as 2 Timothy 2:11-13 as a faithful saying.

So what the church fail to do in excommunicating wayward & unrepentant believers, God will do at the pre great trib rapture event as He will finish His work in those left behind for He will lose nothing of all the Father has given Him for why they are not cast out of His hand nor cast out of the kingdom of Heaven but cast out from attending the Supper I heaven for not being ready.

Jesus never warned saved believers that they will be left behind for not being saved. but for not being ready. That is why they are still saved. 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 would testify to that effect of that fateful day.

 

In relation to John 10:1-13 is about false prophets that would place another door like climbing up another way or prevent others from entering that door like putting a spirit in between them & Jesus.

That differentiates the fold as ones that follow His voice from those that follow a stranger's voice.

So applying John 10:16 is directed to that other fold not following Him but that is why He must bring them because they are saved & they will hear His voice and be of the one fold & one shepherd in serving Him as the King of kings. When they do not hear His voice spiritually, they will definitely hear Him as their King of kings on earth..