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What is Catholicism?

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by atpollard, Mar 25, 2021.

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  1. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    You are disobeying Jesus baptizing as the Pope says you should. He is the Antichrist afterall. Peter and the others baptized in the Name of Jesus Christ.
     
    #61 1689Dave, Mar 27, 2021
  2. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    It's Peter's understanding of Christ's words. The Papal Antichrist changed it to what you have now. Who will you obey?
     
    #62 1689Dave, Mar 27, 2021
  3. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    Ha! I was baptized as a Lutheran infant and raised Atheist ... and God was still able to save me with THAT “baptism”. So let that be a lesson on just how long the arm of my God is! :Cool
     
    #63 atpollard, Mar 27, 2021
  4. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    But the truth should mean more to you than that. When I studied baptism, the first thing I did was to be re-baptized in the Name of Jesus Christ. Infants are not even baptized. It is for believers by immersion in water, only. So you were never baptized.
     
    #64 1689Dave, Mar 27, 2021
  5. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    There is no “the Antichrist”.
    Show me the Bible verse that talks about “the Antichrist”.

    • [1Jo 2:18, 22 KJV] 18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time. ... 22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

    • [1Jo 4:3 KJV] 3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that [spirit] of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

    • [2Jo 1:7 KJV] 7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

    ἀντίχριστος antíchristos, an-tee'-khris-tos; from G473 and G5547; an opponent of the Messiah:—antichrist

    These verses describe any opponent of Christ as “antichrist” and were not capitalized because it is not the title of a single individual. Modern Christians (and especially Dispensational Theologians) have created the boogeyman known as “the Antichrist”.

    The Pope is an old Roman Catholic Priest that occasionally says very biblical things and occasionally says some very silly things. He is not Lucifer incarnate.
     
    #65 atpollard, Mar 27, 2021
  6. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    ... and yet God was able to transform my heart and mind. How can such a thing even be POSSIBLE? :Coffee
     
    #66 atpollard, Mar 27, 2021
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  7. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    Paul's "Man of sin" is the Antichrist John speaks of.

    “Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.” 1 John 2:18 (KJV 1900)

    Did you know Antichrist = "in place of Christ"? And "Vicar of Christ" = "in place of Christ"?
     
    #67 1689Dave, Mar 27, 2021
  8. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    If you have a love of the truth, enough to be baptized in the biblical sense, you would be more convincing.
     
    #68 1689Dave, Mar 27, 2021
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  9. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    I know

    (antí)christos Greek (anti) G437 = opposite = “opposed to” or “in place of” Christ.

    vicar = Middle English = Second in command, Deputy
    • from vicarius = Latin = “a substitute, deputy, proxy” from the adjective vicarius = “substituted or delegated”.


    So antichrist “opposes and takes the place of Christ” while Vicar of Christ is “a delegated representative sitting in for Christ”. While I reject Petrine succession and Papal dominance over the other apostles as unbiblical, it is not accurate to equate the terms “Antichrist” with “Vicar of Christ”.
     
    #69 atpollard, Mar 27, 2021
  10. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    So water saves?

    I reject the premise.
     
    #70 atpollard, Mar 27, 2021
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  11. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    If you believe, baptism proves it. So far you're all hat and no cattle.
     
    #71 1689Dave, Mar 27, 2021
  12. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    Same thing.
     
    #72 1689Dave, Mar 27, 2021
  13. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    This is your assertion.
    Nowhere do we see re-baptism in the Bible. Nowhere do we explicitly see infants being baptized.
    The bigger question is whether believers are in a covenantal relationship, which includes their children. If there is a covenant of grace with the church, then baptism would express the covenant of the church to raise these little sinners to know God's gracious redemption.
    Roman Catholics, Lutherans, Orthodox and Anglicans claim this baptism is regenerational in and of itself. Reformed and Presbyterian view it as securing a potential regeneration that must be confirmed.
    The issue is whether you believe God has a covenant with his people or whether his relationship is purely individualistic.
    For the Reformed and Presbyterian, there is no need for a second baptism after redemption is confirmed. Therefore atpollard would have no reason to be rebaptized since his baptism is confirmed by his faith.
     
    #73 AustinC, Mar 27, 2021
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  14. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    I bet your great at parties. :D
     
    #74 utilyan, Mar 27, 2021
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  15. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    Only in the way a coup and an election are both the same thing (change of leadership).
     
    #75 atpollard, Mar 27, 2021
  16. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    If you think you were baptized and were not, according to scripture, corrected re-baptism is your only baptism. Many disobey Jesus and follow the Papacy (Antichrist) using his formula instead. Why would I go to all the trouble if I thought I was scripturally baptized the first time? God sends strong delusion to those who have no love for the truth.
     
    #76 1689Dave, Mar 28, 2021
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2021
  17. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    What evidence do you have that the reading of Matthew 28:19 is not original?
     
    #77 37818, Mar 28, 2021
  18. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    It is original, but you did not receive the same revelation about its meaning Peter and the early Church did. You believe the Antichrist Papacy instead.
     
    #78 1689Dave, Mar 28, 2021
  19. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    Interesting, no scripture provided for your assertion.
     
    #79 AustinC, Mar 28, 2021
  20. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Your false accusation is not making any sense. To Peter in Matthew 16:17,". . . for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven," with John 6:44-45, "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: . . . It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me."
    Your accusation is problematic. Since all genuine Christians are taught by God.
     
    #80 37818, Mar 28, 2021
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