The flaws of the KVJ

[agedman]

@Van on another forum thread states:

The KJV is deeply flawed and to deny this basic truth is to engage in disinformation. Full Stop …(rest of post clipped because it is not pertaining to the thread topic)

(bold my add)
​

This thread is to tease out the “deeply flawed” areas of the KJV.

In my opinion, the KJV is a translation that is as solid as any other.

One may certainly find more recently explored manuscripts that might suggest a minor rendering adjustment, but in my own work, the KJV has no doctrinal error.

That is my opinion.

This thread concerns the facts.

Is the KJV “deeply flawed?”

If so, specifically what errors occur, where, and what perversion of doctrine does the “flawed” work lead one to stumble.

 

[Van]

As solid as any other which means no more flawed than others. Will anyone note that the NKJV changes the KJV translation of many words (unicorn anyone) and while the NKJV can be said to have changed some things for the worse, to claim all the changes were for the worse is "the stuff that dreams are made of."

 

[RipponRedeaux]

@Van

​

This thread is to tease out the “deeply flawed” areas of the KJV.

In my opinion, the KJV is a translation that is as solid as any other.

One may certainly find more recently explored manuscripts that might suggest a minor rendering adjustment, but in my own work, the KJV has no doctrinal error.

That is my opinion.

This thread concerns the facts.

Is the KJV “deeply flawed?”

If so, specifically what errors occur, where, and what perversion of doctrine does the “flawed” work lead one to stumble.

Van is equally wrong when he has insisted that the NIV is "deeply flawed." and then he rolls out his absurd "translations." The term deeply flawed needs to proven. Otherwise it's just the whiny voice of child uttering gibberish. What core doctrines, or any doctrines are compromised in the NIV or KJV Van?

 

[Van]

The need for a "New King James Version" (NKJV) demonstrates the KJV is deeply flawed. Unicorns anyone.

 

[agedman]

The need for a "New King James Version" (NKJV) demonstrates the KJV is deeply flawed. Unicorns anyone.

Not when basically the NKjV was exchanging archaic and unused language for the vernacular of the latter 20th century.
Perhaps you need to do a comparison of the two.

I get the sense that perhaps you have bought into a line of thinking that is highly suspect of being sustained.

Dreams can be indicative of underlying problems.

 

[37818]

. . . Unicorns anyone.

A patented process where very young goats have their two horns moved to the center of their forehead to grow as a single horn.

 

[agedman]

A patented process where very young goats have their two horns moved to the center of their forehead to grow as a single horn.

As man made as @Van’s OP.

 

[JD731]

Van is equally wrong when he has insisted that the NIV is "deeply flawed." and then he rolls out his absurd "translations." The term deeply flawed needs to proven. Otherwise it's just the whiny voice of child uttering gibberish. What core doctrines, or any doctrines are compromised in the NIV or KJV Van?

The NIV is clearly a feminist translation, or an equality of the sexes translation.It seems geared to soften the patriarchal structure of family and government that is absolutely essential for an orderly society and seems to be left alone in most translations.

I am not guessing about this. Since the NIV has become the most popular English translation the family and government has fallen apart the church has lost her pilgrim character. Also men are feminized and women have taken over.

It is my personal opinion that the producers of such a translation as the NIV have dishonored the word of God with their gender neutral language and repentance and. change of heart is required in order for some of them to miss hell. Changing what God says is serious business and Christians would not think of doing it..

To the law and to the testimony, if they speak not according to this word it is because there is no light in them. Is 8:20

The NIV crew did not translate the manuscripts, they commented on them, IMO.

 

[RipponRedeaux]

Congrats 731. You are wrong on every count. You especially off the proverbial broken branch by blaming a Bible translation for the breakdown of society. did it ever occur to you that the anarchists of today haven't even bothered to read any Bible translation?

Isaiah 8:20 condemns you :
"Consult God's instruction and the testimony of warning. If anyone does not speak according to this word, they have no light of sawn." (NIV)

 

[Reynolds]

@Van on another forum thread states:

(bold my add)
​

This thread is to tease out the “deeply flawed” areas of the KJV.

In my opinion, the KJV is a translation that is as solid as any other.

One may certainly find more recently explored manuscripts that might suggest a minor rendering adjustment, but in my own work, the KJV has no doctrinal error.

That is my opinion.

This thread concerns the facts.

Is the KJV “deeply flawed?”

If so, specifically what errors occur, where, and what perversion of doctrine does the “flawed” work lead one to stumble.

About the only deeply flawed translations are the paraphrases.

 

[agedman]

About the only deeply flawed translations are the paraphrases.

I agree,

However, I also have the opinion that in the effort too attract sales that some translations have brought too much politically correct thinking into the phrasing and denigrating the most literal meaning.

That is merely my opinion, and is worth very little.

 

[RipponRedeaux]

I agree,

However, I also have the opinion that in the effort too attract sales that some translations have brought too much politically correct thinking into the phrasing and denigrating the most literal meaning.

That is merely my opinion, and is worth very little.

Please give specific examples.

 

[37818]

According to Psalms 119:89 the word of God transends the translations, "For ever, O LORD, thy word is settled in heaven."

Also God said of His word, Isaiah 55:11, "So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it."

Yet us Christians cannot argree on all of God's word, the Apostle wrote, "Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment."

Jesus told the unbelievers, John 8:47, "He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God." So are some of us not yet saved as we think we are?

Jesus warned, Matthew 7:21-23, "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."

Are not false words added to God's word work of iniquity?

God did promise, in the Proverbs 30:5-6, "Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar."

Jesus also promised in John 7:16-17, "Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me. If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself." [Regarding His own words He spoke.]

Again the Apostle wrote, 2 Corinthians 13:5, "Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?"

Yet we all do not believe the same word to be the words of God!

John 1:18
John 13:2
Luke 4:4
1 John 5:6-8
etc.

 

[Van]

Not when basically the NKjV was exchanging archaic and unused language for the vernacular of the latter 20th century.
Perhaps you need to do a comparison of the two.

I get the sense that perhaps you have bought into a line of thinking that is highly suspect of being sustained.

Dreams can be indicative of underlying problems.

Silly claims including mind reading shout deception rather than discussion. Note that outdated terms are now not flaws... Give us a break. Unicorns anyone?

 

[Van]

A patented process where very young goats have their two horns moved to the center of their forehead to grow as a single horn.

The KJV mistranslated a word as meaning the mythical unicorn. Obvious error. Full Stop.

 

[Van]

How does Acts 3:16 read in the deeply flawed KJV?
"And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all."

And how should it read?
Based on faith in His name, the man,
whom you see and know, has been strengthened.
Faith in His name, through Him, gave him
unimpairment in the presence of all of you.

Note in this KJV blunder, the idea is changed from "through Him" to through faith. Not how it reads.

 

[37818]

The KJV mistranslated a word as meaning the mythical unicorn. Obvious error. Full Stop.

Do you actually think I believe that unicorn is the correct translation in the KJV? Deuteronomy 33:17, "His glory is like the firstling of his bullock, and his horns are like the horns of unicorns: with them he shall push the people together to the ends of the earth: and they are the ten thousands of Ephraim, and they are the thousands of Manasseh." The Hebrew translated "unicorns" is singular not plural. ". . . the horns of a unicorn: . . . ." Get it? Horns of a unicorn. The translators delibrately misstranslated the word plural. If you are going to criticize, get it right.

 

[Van]

Do you actually think I believe that unicorn is the correct translation in the KJV? Deuteronomy 33:17, "His glory is like the firstling of his bullock, and his horns are like the horns of unicorns: with them he shall push the people together to the ends of the earth: and they are the ten thousands of Ephraim, and they are the thousands of Manasseh." The Hebrew translated "unicorns" is singular not plural. ". . . the horns of a unicorn: . . . ." Get it? Horns of a unicorn. The translators deliberately mistranslated the word plural. If you are going to criticize, get it right.

Yet another change the subject post. Did the KJV translators "deliberately mistranslate" the word as unicorn? You would have to be a mind reader to make that claim. However, since the actual animal in view had "horns" (plural) they might have changed the singular to plural (thus unicorns) to perhaps gloss over the egregious error. But I would not know if that is true, since it is speculation.

 

[agedman]

Modern and ancient Unicorn.

 

[Dave G]

Will anyone note that the NKJV changes the KJV translation of many words (unicorn anyone)

Noted.
In Late Middle English the term is accurate, though no longer in use today to describe the actual animal:

"Unicorn" meaning "Uni-c-horn" or "Uni-horn" = "One horn" = "Rhinocerous".

and while the NKJV can be said to have changed some things for the worse, to claim all the changes were for the worse is "the stuff that dreams are made of."

I agree.

The need for a "New King James Version" (NKJV) demonstrates the KJV is deeply flawed. Unicorns anyone.

To me, given the changes in English over the centuries, there is a need for a new standard, but it isn't the NKJV.
More than that I force anyone to agree with me on, as to me each person should be persuaded of what translation(s) they should use and take comfort in.

However, in my estimation there will never be agreement on this subject long as those who profess Christ disagree over not only the base texts and manuscripts being used in the translation process, but each and every person who professes Christ must be satisfied with how that translation reads.
Looking past all the rhetoric from both sides, I see that what I have in the KJV is superior to any other translation,
despite the "archaic language" ( read, "words that have fallen out of use over the past 4 centuries ) that people often ridicule it for.

That is my own opinion and subject to my own judgment;
Outside of that it is irrelevant.

The above stated, this issue only gets worse over the years and results in more and wider division...
Not less.
That tells me quite a bit about who and what is behind it...

God is not the author of confusion among His churches and among His people.
Anything that forces them apart is not His doing.