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Featured Does the Word of God evidence the Trinity or is the Godhead simply reasoned out from Scripture?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by JonC, Mar 22, 2022.

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  1. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    Well, why didn't you say so, Patrick!?

    Of course God is one being in three equal persons.

    Now, go find that word trinity in that Bible of yours their Patrick...I mean really, Patrick... :Laugh:Roflmao
     
  2. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

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    Can you give an example of someone doing this?
     
  3. JamesL

    JamesL Well-Known Member
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    I agree that God is One, and that He is Triune in some manner.

    I can't get on board with 3 Persons.
    I think people want so badly to see their doctrines in scripture that they won't allow themselves to be honest.

    There is a way to understand the Tri-Unity of God without "Persons"

    And most who have chimed in have gone outside the parameters of the OP and have made mere assertions that cannot be found in any text of scripture.

    Those people should be disqualified from the discussion, imho
     
    #23 JamesL, Mar 22, 2022
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2022
  4. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Karen,

    I do not know what you are talking about. I thought the thread was self explanatory. Others seem to get it.

    Best of luck.
     
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  5. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I did say so, Karen.
     
  6. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    You found a glorious way to muck it up.
     
  7. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Guess I did, Karen. Glad most got it. Feel
    free to leave the muck.

    Patrick
     
  8. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    Hey, I told you, you finally cleared it up. You should have just stated it in the first place. This thread would not still be going if you had just been forthright.
    I am sure you think you are speaking clearly. You can see it in your mind. You just struggle to explain your thoughts to others. I am pretty sure you were never a teacher.
     
  9. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I taught, but not kids. I taught thology to adults, preached and taught an adult study. But not kids. I do not have the patience I once had....which is strange.

    I thought the older you got the more patient you became, but the older I get the less foolish I seem willing to tolerate.

    Anyway, glad you got what I was saying, Karen. I do post from my phone these days and are not nearly as careful with my wording.
     
  10. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    Just to make myself clear from all misrepresentations, I believe that the Scriptures are perfectly clear that God is a Trinity.
    The doctrine is portrayed almost as clearly as that of Penal Substitution.
    In either case, only those determined not to believe will refuse to do so.

    In particular, if you could establish that 1 John 5:7 is original, you would be on firmer ground, but you can't. None of the other texts you quote establish the Deity of the Spirit in a way that would convince a Unitarian. He would believe that the very mention of 'The Spirit of God' means that the Spirit is the non-personal active force of God.
    There is a way of presenting the Deity of the Spirit, but simply saying 'The Spirit of God' and expecting a JW to roll over and holler "uncle" is a vain hope.
     
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  11. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I was not trying to convince anybody of the Trinity. I was just pointing out the verses are in the text of Scripture.

    If your post were true then you would be able to provide a few simple texts of Scripture....like we can with the Trinity....that actually states - IN SCRIPTURE - those things that make your theory distinct.

    But you can't.

    The reason is, unlike with the Trinity, there are no passages that - none you can even collect that together woukd - say Christ suffered God's wrath instead of us.

    You are doing what the Jehovah Witnesses do. You are equating your belief to Scripture, adding to Scripture. They believe Russell properly interpreted Scripture. You believe the Reformers properly interpreted Scripture.
     
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  12. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    ...how about "God is a Spirit"? John 4:24
     
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  13. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    You believe you properly interpret scripture. Who is closer to Charles Taze Russell, Martin or Jon?

    For anyone wondering, the answer is Jon.
     
  14. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Well....since I have stick with Scripture (whether interpreted correctly or not) while Russell and Martin have focused on what they think Scripture teaches by adding to God's Word, Martin is much closer to Russell than I.

    You oppose my view based on my rejection not of "what is written" but on what you believe Scripture "teaches". I oppose your view based on those same "teachings".

    That is the difference. I can provide verses stating what I belueve even if my understanding of those passages is flawed.

    You cannot provide passages stating what you believe but can only reason out what you think the passages teach.

    This is exactly what the Jehovah Witnesss do. They provide Scripture but insist on what they believe the passages teach as being true. That is why their doctrine fails the test of "what is written". You do the same thing.
     
  15. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    Jon, you've told yourself (and us) this lie so long that you actually believe it. Problem is...no one else actually believes it.
     
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  16. Aaron

    Aaron Member
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    Look, Sally, Look!
    CJon throw a hissy!
    OJon!

    :Roflmao
     
  17. Aaron

    Aaron Member
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    Because that's exactly what's going on. AustinC had said that JonC's demanding to be shown the word 'substitute' be found in the Scripture before conceding to the fact that Christ is our substitute, though the role is clearly defined, is like demanding to be shown the word 'trinity' before conceding to the fact that God is One in three Persons.

    As is his custom, JonC reimagined AustinC's eminent rebuttal into what you see in the OP.
     
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  18. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    Once again, this verse will not convince Unitarians. They will tell you that the Word was 'a God,' not in the sense of there being more than one God, but in the sense of Psalms 82:6 and John 10:34ff.
    And here again, as I already pointed out to you, Unitarians will say that John 10:30 cannot mean that The Father and Son are one Being because elsewhere, the Lord Jesus says, "The Father is greater than I." Therefore (they say), the verse must mean that Father and Son are one in agreement, specifically on the protection of the sheep.

    You may say that these are silly and specious arguments, but they are no more silly and specious than your arguments against Penal Substitution.
     
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  19. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    I watched Greg Boyd go off the deep end and fall into open theism. I feel sorry for anyone you may have taught. They had to be more confused after they left your class.
     
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  20. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    I have shown you. Do you bother to read posts? Would you like me to post them again?
     
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