You deny then that we are are born with a sin nature?
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You shall surely die
- Thread starter JonC
- Start date
I do not know what you are talking about with "sin nature".
I have asked that you provide a passage that you are using so that I can better understand what you are saying, but you have thus far refused.
As far as I know Scripture mentions only two "nature's", the flesh and the spirit.
If you are asking me if the Word became flesh, or if Christ had to be made like us in all things, then I believe so.
If you are asking if Christ was tempted in all points as we are, then yes.
If you are asking if Jesus, having been made like us in all things, sinned then no.
What passage are you referencing in terms of this "sin nature"?
I do not know if I deny it or not because you have not provided any passages about a "sin nature".
I believe we are born of Adam, with a mind set on the flesh, but need to be reborn into the "Last Adam" with a mind set on the Spirit.
But until you provide a passage about this "sin nature" I cannot know what you are talking about, or if it is even remotely biblical.
It looks like you are working very hard to avoid Scripture. But that is where I believe we need to remain. So please just give a passage you are referencing regarding a "sin nature" and let's explore God's Word together.
the natural man, the unsaved, have the nature, per Paul, at war with God, and cannot discern or knew the things of God, as those are spiritually discerned, correct?
So you Do deny that we have a fallen sin nature then, correct?
The natural man has his mind set on the flesh and not the Spirit and cannot discern that which is spiritually appraised. But the spiritual man has the mind of Christ.
1 Corinthians 2:10–16 For to us God revealed them through the Spirit; for the Spirit searches all things, even the depths of God.
11 For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so the thoughts of God no one knows except the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may know the things freely given to us by God,
13 which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words.
14 But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised.
15 But he who is spiritual appraises all things, yet he himself is appraised by no one.
16 For who has known the mind of the Lord, that he will instruct Him? But we have the mind of Christ.
Again, I do not know what you mean so I can neither affirm nor deny. You have simply refused to engage God's Word and I do not know the source from whence your ideas have come.
I am not really interested in exploring Christian philosophies with you, but would love to discuss God's Word.
If you have a passage in mind then post it and let's have a discussion about what God says (not what you or I say, but about God's Word).
If you are asking if I believe natural man is flesh then I do. If you are asking if I believe the Word became flesh, Jesus was made like us in all things, then I do. If you are asking if I believe Jesus was only flesh (like the natural man) then I do not.
But until you come with your Bible I have no idea what you are referencing.
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
Are we looking at the Two Natures of a Saved soul? Sorry to steal the thunder, or bust into your inquiries, JesusFan.
Living in the Spirit
…7 because the mind of the flesh is hostile to God: It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. 8 Those controlled by the flesh cannot please God. 9 You, however, are controlled not by the flesh, but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.…
Berean Study Bible
Living in the Spirit
…7 because the mind of the flesh is hostile to God: It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. 8 Those controlled by the flesh cannot please God. 9 You, however, are controlled not by the flesh, but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.…
Berean Study Bible
I'm not sure what we are looking at.
I believe there are only two nature's - the spirit and the flesh.
We are controlled by the Spirit or the flesh.
The reason I am asking @JesusFan to provide passages is that let's me know where he is. We can discuss those passages - which are objective, absolute truth.
But when we start just posting our own ideas and philosophies things get lost. We could think we disagree when we don't, or think we agree when we don't.
I have no idea what he is referencing, so I have no idea of the context from which he grew his ideas.
I think it best to simply stay in God's Word, even if we ultimately disagree on interpretation.
Do we have a sin nature in us, yes or no?
We all have a sin nature in us that finds it very easy to sin against God!
lets stay here, as paul clearly stated to us we have our sin natures and now the saved!
How can I answer that when YOU refuse to provide the passage you are referencing?
If by "sin nature" you mean "the flesh", then yes. We struggle with the flesh daily, and when we fail to reply on "Christ in us" we have stumbled in our own flesh. And the lost are of the flesh and in need of a rebirth.
If you mean something different from what the Bible says, then no
Do you believe we should abide by God's Word in our doctrine....yes or no?
Which verse in Paul's epistles refers to a "sin nature"? Do you mean "a mind set on the flesh"?
The lost have a mind set on the flesh, which makes it very easy to sin. We should have a mind set on the Spirit, which makes it impossible to sin....but we still struggle with the flesh and sin.
Yes, but you do realize that Jesus was born sinless in his humanity, while we were born as sinners, correct?
The heart is deceitful wicked, and we are sinners, correct?
Do we have a non physical aspect, our soul, that is a sin nature?
The difference between the humanity of Christ and the humanity we have is that the Son of God was not born separated from God.
He is God, and God cannot stop being God.
God bless
I do not know what you mean by "sinless in His humanity".
Jesus had to be made like us in all things....not just some things. He had a human nature as all men have a human nature. And He was tempted in all points just like we are. But He did not sin, where as we do.
Hebrews 2:17 Therefore, He had to be made like His brethren in all things, so that He might become a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people.
Hebrews 4:15 For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.