Featured The Truth About the Biblical Act of Predestination.

Romans 2 and Romans 9 remind us that not all Israel is Israel. Therefore, your attempt to separate who Paul is addressing is a failed attempt in hair splitting and is in no way supported by the texts that you butcher in your convoluted exegesis.
It is interesting that you cannot accept God's predestination of His elect and adopted children. This can only be due to your failed presupposition.

*Romans 8:28-30*
And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose. For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

*Ephesians 1:3-14*
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places, even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love he predestined us for adoption as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will, to the praise of his glorious grace, with which he has blessed us in the Beloved. In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of his grace, which he lavished upon us, in all wisdom and insight making known to us the mystery of his will, according to his purpose, which he set forth in Christ as a plan for the fullness of time, to unite all things in him, things in heaven and things on earth. In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will, so that we who were the first to hope in Christ might be to the praise of his glory. In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.

 

I said all along that God predestined some like Moses & John The Baptist.. However, everyone else must come to Jesus in repentance, belief & obedience. But salvation is open to all living. that's why He gave us His word, & His preachers. Calvinism is horse feathers & chicken teeth.

 

Paul is not speaking here of individuals(???)

Who is "whom", then, if they are not an individual?

You said we are allowed to "Look at the pronouns."

Did you think "the image of Jesus Christ" means ”to be glorified"?

Instead of, for God's children in their walk of faith with the Lord, in their lifetime, to be conformed to Jesus' "Christlikeness"?

"Moreover whom he did predestinate,

to Salvation,

them he also called:

to Salvation during their lifetime,

and whom he called,

He saved by Pardoning their sins,

them he also justified: and whom he justified...

He Pardoned and Forgave their soul.

Then, in the Predestination of God, those He Predestined to Call and Justify and HE has Saved THEIR SOUL,

WERE ALSO PREDESTINED TO HAVE THEIR BODY SAVED AND DELIVERED WHEN THEY ARE GLORIFIED.

From our perspective, they will be Glorified, but from GOD's perspective they are as good as having already been Gloried.

Like all of your other conditions on God and His Word, such as Predestination not involving an individual, but only the individual's Glorification(?), and that God wasn't allowed to save souls, by the New Birth, prior to Jesus' death, burial, and resurrection(?), including all the saints in the entire Old Testament (?) this restriction on God that "they must wait for all the children to be born so they may be all glorified together at one time", is at least equally bezerk and out of control with excitement.

From here down, this one includes Predestination, but the rest are concerning Foreknowledge, which this one does, too.

Is that supposed to a big deal.

Is that supposed to be your big "clincher"???

Were you wanting to talk about "Predestination"?

"Foreknowledge", in several of the above comments, is a different doctrine.

Let me help you out; you should have foreknown that when you created the O.P.

By the way, you are on a "Baptist Only" Forum.

What are you?

 

I know what you have said. However, the Bible doesn't say what you say...and therein is the problem. You create a gospel that isn't in the Bible.
Now, you can hold to a non-biblical theology if you want, but for you to declare your false gospel as the Gospel of the Bible is just ludicrous and laughable.

 

You would fall into false teaching like you have done.

 

A nation is born in a day? "He" is born again? Born again?

Not a nation of God's witnesses on the Day of Pentecost I take it.

Back to animal sacrifices?

So, somebody told you God wrote those things, but they they don't mean anything to us now?

That's a lot of writing to say, "stand by".

Why would I take an adversarial position?

Like: "How to become a false teacher according to some of the Protestant Baptists on this board, which are pseudo Baptists:"?

 

Nothing false about Jesus saying "whoever", "whoever will", or "whoever believes in Him". Not one "whoever if elect". The false gospel is yours, with your calvinism.

 

What I note is that you are attempting to create a theology from short phrases that are less than a sentence, while not even caring about the context. Share the passage and we can look at it together. What you have here is nothing of value.

 

Nothing false at all. Every Calvinist believes that. It's just that, '.... The natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them because they are spiritually discerned.'

Matthew 11:25-27.
Luke 10:21-24.
John 6:37-40.
John 10:25-30.
John 17:9.
Romans 11:7
Etcetera, etcetera.

 

Then, why don't you talk talk talk about Predestination, instead of only your own personal Determinations?

So, what are you?

And why are you so familiar with and wanting to actually be the one, that genuinely; "will not allow it to interfere with their already accepted system of theology that does not include being true to what is being said in the scriptures of truth"?

 

Amen. And it looks like God said and He believes it, too.

The "whoever" that believe become manifest by God saving them that they were obviously the Elect.

Then, the "whosoever" that don't believe where condemned already and simply manifest their hatred of God, and will not come unto Him that they might have Life.

He talks all about it.

 

The election follows one's calling. It does not precede it. ". . . For many are called, but few are chosen. . . ." Matthew 22:13.

 

Nope, you are wrong. The election, the chosing, the adoption, all were decided before the foundation of the world.

There is a universal message to all. For those who do not respond, it is a message of condemnation. For those who were chosen before the world began, it is the message of their shepherd. (John 10)

 

Your continued denial of scripture is telling there Austin. What I do note is that you want to create a theology based upon imagined meanings of words and verses.

Are you going to deny what these verses say

Mat 10:32 "Therefore everyone who confesses Me before men, I will also confess him before My Father who is in heaven.
Mat 10:33 "But whoever denies Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father who is in heaven.

Mat 12:48 But Jesus answered the one who was telling Him and said, "Who is My mother and who are My brothers?"
Mat 12:49 And stretching out His hand toward His disciples, He said, "Behold My mother and My brothers!
Mat 12:50 "For whoever does the will of My Father who is in heaven, he is My brother and sister and mother."

Mat 18:3 and said, "Truly I say to you, unless you are converted and become like children, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 18:4 "Whoever then humbles himself as this child, he is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 18:5 "And whoever receives one such child in My name receives Me;
Mat 18:6 but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea.

Joh 3:14 "As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up;
Joh 3:15 so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life.
Joh 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
Joh 3:17 "For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him.
Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Joh 4:13 Jesus answered and said to her, "Everyone who drinks of this water will thirst again;
Joh 4:14 but whoever drinks of the water that I will give him shall never thirst; but the water that I will give him will become in him a well of water springing up to eternal life."

Rom 10:8 But what does it say? "THE WORD IS NEAR YOU, IN YOUR MOUTH AND IN YOUR HEART"—that is, the word of faith which we are preaching,
Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;
Rom 10:10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.
Rom 10:11 For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."
Rom 10:12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him;
Rom 10:13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."

1Jn 2:22 Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son.
1Jn 2:23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also.

1Jn 4:13 By this we know that we abide in Him and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit.
1Jn 4:14 We have seen and testify that the Father has sent the Son to be the Savior of the world.
1Jn 4:15 Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God.

1Jn 5:1 Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and whoever loves the Father loves the child born of Him.

Austin where is your whoever is one of the elect verse?

 

I don't deny any of those verses.

Question: Who is the cause of a person believing?

Is the cause the human will or is the cause the Holy Spirit?

 

Well if you do it biblically it is the person that believes in response to the influence of God. God is actively working in and through creation, conscience, His bride, His Holy Spirit filled followers, and His Word to aid humanity in their conversion.

Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.

Eph 3:4 By referring to this, when you read you can understand my insight into the mystery of Christ,
Eph 3:5 which in other generations was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed to His holy apostles and prophets in the Spirit;
Eph 3:6 to be specific, that the Gentiles are fellow heirs and fellow members of the body, and fellow partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus through the gospel,

Rom 10:17 So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.

Act 16:30 and after he brought them out, he said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"
Act 16:31 They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household."