Featured Problem of there being an actual crucifixion date.

I do not understand the need to know an exact date.

I believe that God created the world. But I do not know the exact date.

I believe that the Word was made flesh, but I do not know the exact date.

I was saved as a young man, but I do not know the exact date.


Part of the problem we have in determining an exact date is that this was determined in different ways throughout history. In Exodus it was by observing the sun and moon. In the 1st century it was by observation and rekoning as determined by the Sanhedrin. Now it is lunisolar.

Then we get into the fact that the determining day woukd be dependent on 1st century practice in Jerusalm rather than OT passages (and the timing was debated even in the first century, the Jews yielding to Jewish laws).


So it is impossible to know as a fact (we can only have opinions).

We can only know that Jesus died on the afternoon before a Sabbath and that Sabbath was a high day and this was the day after the pasdover was killed..

The two most agreed upon days are Wendsday and Friday.


Opinions are not bad, however becoming dogmatic about those opinions exceed Scripture.

 

We do not know the exact date. We DO know they did not use the Biblical calendar of Exodus but instead used "observation and rekoning".

We do know what they would have used if they had computers. So the exact date is opinion rather than fact. That is why biblical scholars are divided between Nisan 14 on a Wed and on a Fri.

We do not know the Jewish law that may have affected how we would interpret the OT instructions.

We do know that they added a Seder meal for those traveling or not in Jerusalem. This is not in the OT.

To know the date we have to know:
1. The "observation- rekoning"
2. Their day observance
3. The 1st century Jewish laws

What can we know?

Jesus are the Supper the evening after the Passover was killed, Jesus died the next afternoon, the day of the crucifixtion was a preperation day, the next day being a Sabbath which was also a high day.

 

I disagree.

I know a stove is burns because I feel the heat (and have had the experience of touching a burner). That is experience, not opinion.

I know Christ is my Savior because of experience, not opinion.

My point is that we cannot know the exact date because Scripture doesn't give it.


Your opinion is based on the idea that the 1st century Jewish calendar corresponds with the program you used to track lunar cycles, that the Jews adhered to the Law and did not make additional laws that would affect their ceremonies, that they strictly adhered to sunset dating, etc.


I'm not saying you are wrong to have opinions. I am saying you shouldn't insist others adhere to those opinions.

 

The problem comes in with 1st century Jewish traditions.

If we were to stick with the OT we'd never know of the two Seder meals. We wouldn't know the exact timing, etc.

We can know that Jesus was crucified the afternoon that followed the night of the last supper.

We can know that Jesus ate the last supper around sunset after the passover was killed.

We can know that the passover was killed between 1 and 3 pm depending on the day of the week.

We can know that Jesus was buried before the sunset that started tge Sabbath.

We can know that Sabbath was also a high day.


But people put that together differently.

 

Yes.

This is exactly what I am saying.

We are given the conclusion, and may speculate on other things.....but it is the conclusion and not the speculation that is important.

 

I believe Marl 14:12 means exactly what it says - exactly what it should mean.

You suggest it should mean what you think it meant during the Exodus.
BUT I think Mark was writing to an audience about the Disciples experienced (about what they saw) and therefore meant exactly what occurred in the 1st century as practiced in the 1st century.

I am saying that Mark is not giving the info you want of him.

Many Christians fall into that trap (wanting to know more than is given and drawing conclusions to develop their answers).

It isn't necessary a bad thing. By all means, work out to your satisfaction whatever you feel you need to work out.

But don't lean on your own understanding. You simply don't know. Certainly don't become dogmatic about your opinions.


As for the question you asked @Deacon , prior to the 1st century the Jews changed from the Biblical calendar of Exodus to "observation and rekoning", with the Sanhedrin being the determining factor. This occurred after the Bablyonian exile (partially as a result). One issue is that the dates would be different for a period depending on where you were located (the Jews were not in one place either....unlike during the OT).

 

Here is the problem.

Nobody is claiming that there was not a date on which Christ was crucified.

Most Biblical scholars agree it had to be Friday, butca few do hold to a Wed. I am unaware of any Biblical scholar holding it was a Thursday but I don't doubt some people do.

What is not known is the actual date.

There is a lot of speculation, but not knowing the date has no bearing on whether the event occurred.


Think of it this way - if the Bible only said Christ died and was raised on the 3rd day woukd you disbelieve it because no date was provided?

No date is provided, only observations of what occurred as it occurred in the 1st century.

The only hint we get is that Jesus was baptized in Tiberius' 15th year (Tiberius ruled from 14 AD to 37 AD), so Jesus would have been baptized in 29 AD. Some argue for a co-regency to make the crucifixion ifixion earlier but history does not support this idea.

So you could have people saying the only possible date is in 30 AD to keep a calendar and another saying it has to be later because that'd limit Jesus' ministry to one year.

In the end we don't know the date.