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Exodus 12:18
- Thread starter 37818
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37818
Well-Known Member
Check out: Mark 15:42
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
That's fine that you think you know but there in lays the problem, you think you know but you have no way of being 100% sure.
I am not saying you should not follow your path in this, just that it is not essential to be able to state an exact day/date.
We know that Christ was crucified, buried and raised again.
In your posts you even pointed out that there were different dates put forward.
My point is that we do not need to know the day/date but rather that it did happen just as Christ said it would.
As @JonC said in a prior post there are a number of things in the bible for which we do not know the date but that does not mean they did not happen.
As for the Friday April 7 30 AD come form? The only answer is someones best guess. Just as all the other dates are just a best guess.
You can point to various videos but they all come down to the same thing, best guess.
I have (and I have no issue at all with the passage).
My point here was not about going down timelines but explaining why we cannot know the exact dates.
There are three calendar periods - the Biblical, Talmudic, and Post-Talmudic.
The Biblical Calender is based on visual observation. It is the accurate in regard to lunar cycles.
The Talmudic is a little more accurate to lunar cycles.
The Post-Talmudic actually calculates lunar cycles (no visual observation needed).
My point is that the Biblical accounts relayed what occurred. The Jews used the Biblical calendar. We can't know what was observed. So we can't know an exact date.
That's all I was saying.
When it comes to Mark's account you are making assumptions as well. We can't know that your assumptions are accurate.
It is fine to hold opinions. It is not fine to preach those opinions as if they were facts.
What was the exact date? I don't care, it does not matter, and we cannot know.
37818
Well-Known Member
Your opinion. And "I don't care." Truth matters.
Julian date 30 AD Friday April 7th.
Sir Isaac Newton calculated a couple Friday dates. 33 AD April 3rd.
Mark 14:12 proves that 33 AD date is wrong.
But you ."don't care." Really? You claim "It does not matter."
I think it does.
The three fold evidence of the resurrection of Christ
Truth does matter.
And the truth is the 1st century Jews did not use the post-Talmudic calendar. They used the Biblical calendar....regardless of your opinion.
I am not sure why you dismiss history. I actually enjoy reading Jewish and your dismissal of historical facts is why I've been replying. That and your dismissal of Scripture (as the Jews interpreted it). They were a bit legalistic, but they were at least trying to adhere to God's command insofar as observing the "lights in the heavens".
The more interesting thing is the days of the week. Since we can't know the exact date we may be able to at least guess at the days.
37818
Well-Known Member
The three fold evidence of the resurrection of Christ
Point 3.
Mere denial does.not disprove corroboration.
Prove the current calculated Jewish Calendar is wrong.
Calendar Converter
Point 3.
Mere denial does.not disprove corroboration.
Prove the current calculated Jewish Calendar is wrong.
Calendar Converter
Here is one scenario (there are probably others that would fit as well):
Two days before Passover and the Festival the Jews concluded to kill Jesus before the festival (Mk 13:1).
Thursday afternoon (around 2 to 3 pm) the Passover was sacrificed at the Temple (if 15 Nisan fell on a Sabbath the Pasdover was sacrificed earlier per Jewish custom).
Jesus was outside the city Thursday afternoon (evening, literally "between the evenings") and sent disciples ahead.
Jesus arrived when the sun had set ("I'm when evening had come) that Thursday and ate the Passover. He was arrested and the next morning.
Friday afternoon Jesus was crucified and He was buried in a nearby tomb because it was approaching the Sabbath.
Jesus arose on Sunday before it was light.
Another scenario is that the Passover lamb being killed when Jesus was outside the city was the meal travelers partook. I'm not sure this is valid as they were close to the city.
Two days before Passover and the Festival the Jews concluded to kill Jesus before the festival (Mk 13:1).
Thursday afternoon (around 2 to 3 pm) the Passover was sacrificed at the Temple (if 15 Nisan fell on a Sabbath the Pasdover was sacrificed earlier per Jewish custom).
Jesus was outside the city Thursday afternoon (evening, literally "between the evenings") and sent disciples ahead.
Jesus arrived when the sun had set ("I'm when evening had come) that Thursday and ate the Passover. He was arrested and the next morning.
Friday afternoon Jesus was crucified and He was buried in a nearby tomb because it was approaching the Sabbath.
Jesus arose on Sunday before it was light.
Another scenario is that the Passover lamb being killed when Jesus was outside the city was the meal travelers partook. I'm not sure this is valid as they were close to the city.
You are denying that the 1st century Jews used the Biblical calendar. But there is no evidence to support your theory.
There is evidence to support that they used the Biblical Hebrew Calendar. For example, Gamaliel II's controversy, the Samaritan fires, Judah I's concerns about having missed the moon due to lack of visibility, and Hillel's inclusion of calculations to prevent future error.
BUT you miss the point.
The calculated calender is right insofar as telling is about the moon.
The problem is they didn't use it until long after the 1st century AD.
Prove the Disciples recorded what should have happened per accurate calculation rather than what did happen per the system used in tge 1st century.
37818
Well-Known Member
Mark 14:12 and context disallows that.
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37818
Well-Known Member
Your mere argument doesn't make it so. Mark 14:12 is explicite, "And the first day of Unleavened [Bread], when they killed the passover, . . ."
Not theory, but Biblical fact.
You misunderstood.
Mine is not an argument.
I am saying that I believe the 1st century Jews used the Biblical Hebrew calendar, which was based on visually observing the "signs".
It does not make it so, but it does state what was so. That is actually a matter of historical fact.
We know this because we know that the Jews had missed what would have been 1 Nisan several times. Any literate person can read history and know it.
Not my argument. I offered two explanations that Biblically deal with the timeline.
You have the problem of excluding how things were actually done historically in favor of how you believe they should have been done.
I'm not saying that the Temple priests were right. But you have to remember that this was the same group that said it was OK to worship Zeus in the Temple if you were worshipping God in your heart.
So......to get your time right.....
You are saying that the Jews sacrificed the Pasdover on 14 Nisan between 12pm and sunset (Deuteronomy 16:6) and actually observed Passover on 15 Nisan.
That's fine. Like I said, there are many views that fit the narrative in Mark.
We can know He was buried on Friday before sunset and arose on Sunday before sunrise. That's enough. No need to rely on speculation.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
@37818 no one is questioning the resurrection of Christ. It is your contention that we can know the day/date on which He was crucified. You need to provide the proof to back up your position which you have not done. What you have done is provide a best guess.
There are various versions of the day/date and you are content with the one that you have accepted but it is not proof.
Just so you understand, I do not have to prove the current calculated Jewish Calendar is wrong, you have to prove that it is right.
37818
Well-Known Member
I have.
What do you even understand?
What are the two main proofs we have for the resurrection?
The three fold evidence of the resurrection of Christ
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