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Featured The Willful Sin of Unbelief

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Charlie24, Oct 24, 2024.

  1. MrW

    MrW Well-Known Member

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    I believe in Eternal Security.

    God alone dispenses salvation. It would be an exercise in futility for God to grant the New Testament new birth to one He foreknows will die lost.

    To me, to argue a person can be re-lost is vain. The question is, “Are you absolutely certain of your salvation?”, and if you are, then please live like it.

    (Not addressing you personally, but making a comment on Eternal Security and any and all who profess it, including me, for surely I give myself too much trouble).
     
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  2. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

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    It was two sets of people in the congregation, thats why the but contrast Heb 6:9

    9 But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak.

    Again in Heb 10:38-39

    38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

    39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

    See that ? Its WE and Them, two different hearers.
     
  3. ChristB4Us

    ChristB4Us Member

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    Rededicate their lives?

    You are not referring to that apostate calling of Billy Graham in making a commitment to follow Christ as if keeping it, one can gain the assurance of salvation rather than by faith in Jesus Christ is how we are saved?

    Or any other subsequent man made bondages of vanity like the Promise Keepers' program where men make promises to God and men to make themselves better fathers, husbands, and members of their community as if keeping it by the deeds of the law is the power in living the Christian life rather than by faith in Jesus Christ in how He is our Good Shepherd to help us to follow Him? Galatians 5:1-5 & Philippians 1:6-11 & Matthew 5:33-37 & John 6:28-29
     
  4. ChristB4Us

    ChristB4Us Member

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    The But in Hebrews 6:9 was in regards to the consequence for those that have fallen away in verse 8.

    Hebrews 10:38-39 is to be applied to those that err, thinking they need another sacrifice for sins which was rebuked in Hebrews 10:1-31. Imagine, if you will, the Catholic as they look forward to the Mass each weekend to receive another atonement for sins committed since last Mass... what happens when the Bridegroom comes before that next Mass? They will draw back unto perdition because their hope was on the Mass and not on Jesus Christ.

    So Paul in verse 39 is addressing those believers that were not led astray by such an errant offensive line of "communion" since their hope is on Christ for why abiding believers will not draw back.
     
  5. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Never in dispute. What you ignore was Paul's decision to embrace the gospel of Christ. Take note of Acts of the Apostles 22:16 where Paul "called on His name!"
     
  6. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    1) Please stop suggesting I am endorsing the heresy of the month.

    2) If a person receives the gospel partially, such as Soils # 2 and 3 of Matthew 13, they may in the future rededicate their lives to Christ, fully committing by forming a deep root of commitment in themselves or tossing out the priority of other earthly treasures and making Christ the overriding priority of their life.

    3) I am discussing what scripture teaches, not whatever outreach you find fault with.

    4) Progressive sanctification has born anew believers striving to think and act more like Christ and to become more effective witnesses for Christ. You seem to dismiss this as striving to obtain or sustain Positional sanctification. Nonsense.
     
  7. ChristB4Us

    ChristB4Us Member

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    You posted that but then you posted this.

    "2) If a person receives the gospel partially, such as Soils # 2 and 3 of Matthew 13, they may in the future rededicate their lives to Christ, fully committing by forming a deep root of commitment in themselves or tossing out the priority of other earthly treasures and making Christ the overriding priority of their life." ~~ end of quote

    No matter how much the spirit is willing, the flesh is weak therefore any believer looking to themselves in doing the best they can in following Christ will be using the grace of God in living a life of sin by continually breaking that commitment every time they sin. They give grace to themselves to keep trying to keep that commitment or promise, and yet I have seen the same condemn others as if they are not truly believers or they were never saved in the first place when they had fallen away.

    Then it adds sin to that self witness by the believer testifying of their commitment or promise is by keeping is how they are able to follow Jesus which is a false witness. John 5:31 & John 7:18

    Then you posted this

    "3) I am discussing what scripture teaches, not whatever outreach you find fault with." ~~ end of quote

    Galatians 5:1Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.... 5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

    Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:..... 11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

    it is living by faith in Jesus Christ or it is by doing the best you can striving to keep that commitment as if that is the power for us to follow Him by.

    How can you apply Galatians 5:1 to your testimony or to your walk with Jesus Christ when any believer's commitment to Christ is a promise to Christ and it is you telling God and men that you are going to do it by the deed of that law and yet we can do nothing without Him?

    Then you posted this

    "4) Progressive sanctification has born anew believers striving to think and act more like Christ and to become more effective witnesses for Christ. You seem to dismiss this as striving to obtain or sustain Positional sanctification. Nonsense." ~~ end of quote

    Where is that rest in Jesus Christ for how we are to follow Him by faith in Him alone?

    Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

    How can any striving of the believer be seen as resting in Jesus Christ?

    The only striving the believer is to do is to avoid following the crowd that broadens the way in coming to God the Father by including the holy Spirit or the blessed trinity" as if that is another way we can approach God the father by when God has provided only one way to come to him and that is by His Son.

    By continuing to go to the Son for all things, in fellowship, prayer, and worship, we are coming to God the Father. The striving is explaining the necessity and the urgency of narrowing the way back to the straight gate to avoid that work of iniquity of following the crowd or the church in coming to God the Father by another way like the Holy Spirit or even by the broad way like by way of the blessed Trinity.

    Luke 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.

    Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

    John 10:1Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber....

    ....7 Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep. 8 All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them. 9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

    John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

    That is the only striving I see is how we are to approach God the Father by in these latter days where the way has been broadened but by continuously going to the Son in coming to God the Father, is how we can rest in Him for all things including how Jesus Christ is the power we have for following Him because He is our Good Shepherd and not just our Saviour.

    Puts a whole new meaning to "the just shall live by faith.....:".
     
  8. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Notice these rejections of Matthew 13 and the need for progressive sanctification. We are to confess our sins and strive to do better, not using grace to justify continued sin.
     
  9. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Living by faith is doing our best to live by faith. Duh
     
  10. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    It seems some do not accept the premise of progressive sanctification. Is this a sneaky defense of "Easy Believism?"
     
  11. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Folks, our progressive sanctification refers to growing from a new born believer to a mature Christian.
     
  12. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

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    The but is because some actually had salvation and some didn't
     
  13. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

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    It was Gods will that Paul became a believer, Jesus had to save Him from sinful unbelief,then give him faith to believe
     
  14. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    ...as in babes in Christ. 1 Corinthians 3:1 :)
     
  15. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Behold a denial that Paul called on the name of the Lord.
     
  16. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Agreed, once we fully embraced the spiritual milk "as unspiritual lost people" we became "babes in Christ.
     
  17. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

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    He did after God gave him repentance. Repentance is a change of mind, Acts 5:31

    31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

    No one calls upon the Name of the Lord until they are saved with the Gift of repentance from the Lord.
     
  18. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    I am sorry but you are claiming "gave repentance" means enabling and compelling repentance. Shear nonsense.

    To grant repentance means to allow or permit repentance. It refers to the absence of having a hardened heart caused by God.
     
  19. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

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    Oh no,giving repentance is the giving of the entire conversion experience, it comes with faith and new spiritual life as well.

    Christ causes it all Acts 3:26

    26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.
     
  20. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    LOL, how are sinners heading in the wrong direction turned to God? Through the Good News of the Gospel. Not through the fiction of Irresistible grace

    The unforgivable sin is rejection of the gospel.

    Once a person is sealed in Christ with the Holy Spirit, that union is forever according to scripture. Yes we can "quench" the Spirit, close down its influence on us, but we will never "force it out."

    When and if we diligently follow the Helper's leading, we will engage in effective ministry, earn rewards and enter heaven "abundantly!"


     
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