Study 2 Thessalonians 2:13

[Van]

Once again we see yet another Calvinist effort to rewrite scripture to alter it in accordance with the fiction of Calvinism.

Who said 2 Thessalonians 2:13 says we are chosen "because of our faith?" That would make salvation dependent upon the person that wills to be saved, and therefore contrary to Romans 9:16. But that is the viewpoint, the strawman argument, hoisted in deceit.

The verse is a compound sentence, with subjects, verbs, direct and indirect objects. There is no separate thought.

We should always give thanks to God for you as beloved by the Lord.
Subject, =We; Verb = should give thanks, direct object = God; indirect object for you the beloved.
We should give thanks to God for you as our siblings in Christ!
Why?
Because God has chosen you. Subject = God; Verb = has chosen; direct object = you.
The remaining phrases are indirect objects describing aspects of the action upon the recipient.

When was the action of choosing performed? From the beginning of the New Covenant
What was the purpose of the action? For salvation
What were the instrumental factors? Election by means of transferring the person from the realm of darkness into Christ. Basis of the choice was God crediting the faith of the individual as righteousness.

Thus we were NOT saved because of our faith, our faith only allowed God to credit it or not. Our faith did not deserve salvation or merit salvation, the accreditation was a act of mercy and grace. Salvation does NOT depend upon the person who wills, but upon God who has mercy.

 

[canadyjd]

…..

Who said 2 Thessalonians 2:13 says we are chosen "because of our faith?"

@Van said it in post #123 of his thread “when were we chosen”

Peace to you

 

[Van]

@Van said it in post #123 of his thread “when were we chosen”

Peace to you

Yet another post asking a question rather than addressing the topic. Was an answer to the question, who said "we are chosen because of our faith" provided? Nope.

 

[Van]

Interpretive Translation of 2 Thessalonians 2:13.
We should give thanks to God for you as our siblings in Christ! Because God has chosen you,from the beginning of the New Covenant, for salvation, by the means of setting you apart in Christ based on crediting your faith as righteousness.

It was for this election that God invited you by means of our gospel that you might obtain the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. That glory is the splendour of the Righteousness of Christ! Many are invited but few are chosen.

 

[canadyjd]

Yet another post asking a question rather than addressing the topic. Was an answer to the question, who said "we are chosen because of our faith" provided? Nope.

You asked, “who said we are chosen because of our faith”, and laid out why that’s not true.

I answered your question directly… you said it in your previous thread.

It is impossible to dialog with you. You don’t even know what you’ve said before and claim personal attacks when your own words are repeated back to you

All done @Van.

Peace to you

 

[Van]

You asked, “who said we are chosen because of our faith”, and laid out why that’s not true.

I answered your question directly… you said it in your previous thread.

It is impossible to dialog with you. You don’t even know what you’ve said before and claim personal attacks when your own words are repeated back to you

All done @Van.

Peace to you

I can only hope your are willing to stop with all your false claims and diversionary tactics to derail discussion of scripture.

Interpretive Translation of 2 Thessalonians 2:13.
We should give thanks to God for you as our siblings in Christ! Because God has chosen you,from the beginning of the New Covenant, for salvation, by the means of setting you apart in Christ based on crediting your faith as righteousness.

It was for this election that God invited you by means of our gospel that you might obtain the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. That glory is the splendour of the Righteousness of Christ! Many are invited but few are chosen.

 

[canadyjd]

…..

Interpretive Translation of 2 Thessalonians 2:13.

Or…. I will now rewrite the passage to make it fit my secular philosophy…

We should give thanks to God for you as our siblings in Christ! Because God has chosen you,from the beginning of the New Covenant, for salvation, by the means of setting you apart in Christ based on crediting your faith as righteousness.

It was for this election that God invited you by means of our gospel that you might obtain the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. That glory is the splendour of the Righteousness of Christ! Many are invited but few are chosen.

Ta Da!!!! All you have to do is ignore the meaning of words, be willing to rewrite all passages to fit your beliefs and then personally attack anyone who dares to point out your error…

Vanology in action

Peace to you

 

[Van]

Or…. I will now rewrite the passage to make it fit my secular philosophy…

Ta Da!!!! All you have to do is ignore the meaning of words, be willing to rewrite all passages to fit your beliefs and then personally attack anyone who dares to point out your error…

Vanology in action

Peace to you

Folks, who wrote "I will now rewrite the passage to make it fit my secular philosophy?"

Canadyjd did.

Calvinism in action, misrepresent others and rewrite scripture.

We should give thanks to God for you as our siblings in Christ! Because God has chosen you,from the beginning of the New Covenant, for salvation, by the means of setting you apart in Christ based on crediting your faith as righteousness. 2 Thessalonians 2:13 Interpretive translation.

1) Does the verse refer to only biological brothers of Paul, or to all his siblings, male or female in Christ?

2) Does the verse say God has chosen the individuals of his audience for salvation?

3) When did God begin to choose individuals based on their belief in the name of Jesus? Obviously from the beginning of the New Covenant in His Blood. Were the OT saints even aware God raised Jesus from the dead?

4) Does God transfer those of His choosing into Christ? See Colossians 1:13 if in doubt.

5) Does God credit the faith of those who believe God raised Jesus from the dead? See Romans 4:22-24

All the false teachers advocating Calvinism have is vague innuendo and clear-cut misrepresentation. Using sound hermeneutics to study scripture and reach what we believe in the actual meaning is not "secular philosophy."

"Bible study hermeneutics is the science and art of interpreting the Bible to understand the original meaning of the authors, bridge the gap to modern readers, and apply timeless truths, focusing on context, language, and genre to avoid misinterpretation and derive accurate, relevant lessons for today." [from the internet]

 

[canadyjd]

Folks, who wrote "I will now rewrite the passage to make it fit my secular philosophy?"

Canadyjd did.

Folks, who actually rewrote the passage to fit his secular philosophy?

Van did.

Folks, who cannot stand it when his error is pointed out with abundance of scripture in context?

That is Van as well.

Hey @Van, don’t mention me in your posts and I’ll try to ignore your ignorant gibberish concerning scripture.

Peace to you

 

[Van]

Folks, who actually rewrote the passage to fit his secular philosophy?

Van did.

Folks, who cannot stand it when his error is pointed out with abundance of scripture in context?

That is Van as well.

Hey @Van, don’t mention me in your posts and I’ll try to ignore your ignorant gibberish concerning scripture.

Peace to you

The claim my interpretation constitutes an effort to alter God's message is a falsehood, deliberately posted to avoid discussion of the verse. This is all these false teachers have, because they apparently do not even know how to study scripture.

We should give thanks to God for you as our siblings in Christ! Because God has chosen you,from the beginning of the New Covenant, for salvation, by the means of setting you apart in Christ based on crediting your faith as righteousness. 2 Thessalonians 2:13 Interpretive translation.

1) Does the verse refer to only biological brothers of Paul, or to all his siblings, male or female in Christ?

2) Does the verse say God has chosen the individuals of his audience for salvation?

3) When did God begin to choose individuals based on their belief in the name of Jesus? Obviously from the beginning of the New Covenant in His Blood. Were the OT saints even aware God raised Jesus from the dead?

4) Does God transfer those of His choosing into Christ? See Colossians 1:13 if in doubt.

5) Does God credit the faith of those who believe God raised Jesus from the dead? See Romans 4:22-24

All the false teachers advocating Calvinism have is vague innuendo and clear-cut misrepresentation. Using sound hermeneutics to study scripture and reach what we believe in the actual meaning is not "secular philosophy."

"Bible study hermeneutics is the science and art of interpreting the Bible to understand the original meaning of the authors, bridge the gap to modern readers, and apply timeless truths, focusing on context, language, and genre to avoid misinterpretation and derive accurate, relevant lessons for today." [from the internet]

 

[canadyjd]

All efforts to validate the changing of the meaning of the words in scripture as an “interpretive translation” is the foundation of false teachers.

You do not need to change the meanings of the words in 2 Thessalonians 2:13 to understand what Paul is teaching.

He very clearly states we are chosen from the beginning, by God, for salvation. That is a separate and complete thought in context. When speaking in relation to God, in Jewish thought, the phrase “from the beginning” refers to Genesis.

There are places where Paul refers to the beginning of his ministry among certain Christians. These instances are also very clear in context.

Paul then elaborates on “how” that salvation occurs (not how the choosing occurs). We are sanctified (set apart) by God Holy Spirit which leads to faith in the truth.

This refers to the necessity of, first, the intervention of God Holy Spirit in the person’s life and, second, the preaching of the gospel (truth) concerning Jesus.

All efforts to change the truth of scripture are doomed to fail as Jesus has clearly stated the Word of God shall never pass away.

Come Lord Jesus!!!

Peace to you

 

[Marooncat79]

All efforts to validate the changing of the meaning of the words in scripture as an “interpretive translation” is the foundation of false teachers.

You do not need to change the meanings of the words in 2 Thessalonians 2:13 to understand what Paul is teaching.

He very clearly states we are chosen from the beginning, by God, for salvation. That is a separate and complete thought in context. When speaking in relation to God, in Jewish thought, the phrase “from the beginning” refers to Genesis.

There are places where Paul refers to the beginning of his ministry among certain Christians. These instances are also very clear in context.

Paul then elaborates on “how” that salvation occurs (not how the choosing occurs). We are sanctified (set apart) by God Holy Spirit which leads to faith in the truth.

This refers to the necessity of, first, the intervention of God Holy Spirit in the person’s life and, second, the preaching of the gospel (truth) concerning Jesus.

All efforts to change the truth of scripture are doomed to fail as Jesus has clearly stated the Word of God shall never pass away.

Come Lord Jesus!!!

Peace to you

Well stated

False teachers always have a better interpretation