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Bingo!!!!!!!!! (excessive exclamation points to meet the minimum characters)

In my case, I want to do a PhD at a seminary in Cal at the same time finding a group of men who are like minded to plant a church in a major unchurched area in the states. So I think it will be helpful.

That's kind of my question. Is it right for a church to be so heavily and visibly guarded? Or should we be more pacifistic and either car pool or go underground? I'm not sure you can argue religious revolution for the first. At lest not Biblically. Otherwise, it would be a Baptist Crusade...

I have a dream to start a reformed SBC church in the western half of the states and out of the Bible belt. I want to go to places like Oregon or Washington where there is not a great deal of influence for the gospel there. California or Nevada or other places like that are also up for grabs...

I live in Honduras, one of the most dangerous countries in the world right now. I visited a church last year that was fairly large, nice facilities, big parking lot, and a gated property that can only be entered through the guarded gate. What caught my attention was that the guards were all...

This guy is big timin' if he got a visit from Gabriel!!!

That always helps too ;)

I like what Paul says in 2 Cor. 13:5 about testing and examining yourselves to see if you are in the faith. As mentioned above, passages like matt. 7:13ff. speak of knowing them by their fruit. True conversion is observed by true repentance - a hatred toward sin and a desire to please God.

duly noted... thanks for the assistance. Not at all what I meant. I'm not sure how that was communicated. If you could point out how that inference was made, I would appreciate it so as to avoid it later.

Are you being ignorant to frustrate me? I just gave you an explanation!!! I told you what I think the word means. But I'm not a dogmatic fundamentalist who is nothing but combative like you. I am willing to say that I am not certain because I can see some holes in my own explanation. I'm...

My problem with this is that syntactically, that is a hard pill to swallow. W/ your translation provided, you demonstrate the "elect" is used adjectivally. That really makes it seem unlikely that the prepositional phrase would refer to the adjective, and more likely it should refer to the noun.

My only burr is the way you have engaged in this thread. You can't call my argument absurd b/c you can't even engage in it. I'm wondering if you even understand my contention in 1 Peter. But since you are being extremely unhelpful, I will give you my take on foreknowledge. However, I don't...

Sorry, but I have a problem w/ letting one verse from a completely different author dictate the syntax of a different author... especially when their styles are so different. This doesn't have to be a contradiction either. Plus, if you do what you are talking about, it is just another form of...

Are you being snide and snarky on purpose or does it just come naturally? I said I can offer an answer. If you keep pushing, I'll give you one. I just don't know that I have an adequate answer (i.e. that I could defend it). I have an opinion. It is not locked up water tight in my mind. So...

different authors, different contexts, different styles, different syntax (big one). Not saying the ideas are exclusive, just saying that 1 Pet. 1:1-2 is not a verse to prove that point.

Not sure how that proves your point from 1 Peter 1:1-2. From that passage, how do you know election and foreknowledge are 2 ideas coupled together one based on the other? My contention is that the KJV has lead many astray here linking those two together. I'm sure it is not just the KJV, but...

So now that Winman is here, can you address the OP and why you think "elect" must be tied to "according to foreknowledge"??? I want to hear your reasoning, especially considering the many more likely options "elect" refers to.

Thank you for finally addressing the OP in this thread. I think that is a valid option, although I'm not convinced that it has to be taken that way.

This is what this thread is really about. How do you know "elect" and "according to foreknowledge" are tied together the way you translated it.

BECAUSE... as I said, this is not a discussion to define foreknowledge, this is a discussion to speak on the syntax of the verse. Those are two totally different things. Now I could offer some pat answer for foreknowledge. Its not like I can't produce anything. I just don't like any of my...