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Well, I never understood when the sacrifice occurred; I remember asking the priest that one and was told that the whole Mass was the sacrifice and being vaguely disappointed (what, no knives or mess or anything?). To answer your question though, it's our sacrifice because both priest and people...

No, no! Only Leviticus is a sufficient penance for this, plus four 'Our Fathers', three 'Hail Marys' and two 'Hello Dollys'. Catholic theology states the following in answer to your question: the gifts being brought are the bread and wine which, once consecrated, are offered by the priest and...

It's a grace. If anything re God is a work, I'm well and truly stuffed...

I thought we were talking about baptism, not works?

So, the EOC, in existence as one half of historic Christianity for nearly 2000 years, is a cult....:laugh: And Baptists aren't....:laugh::laugh:

I Peter 3:21 and Mark 16:16

It's enough to be going on with. I'm running a business here so don't have time for more right now.

In what way is that not germane or sufficient to the case in hand?

I have - the exception envisaged by the Constitution was slaves, but see the Thirteenth Amendment there. Subsequent Supreme Court decisions have tended to extend rather than restrict the definition.

Alright, here's your 'starter for ten': The Fourteenth Amendment: Note that the Amendment moves swiftly on from referring to US citizens to 'any person' and stresses the need for 'any person within its jurisdiction' the have the 'equal protection of the laws'. Thus the following principles...

Whaa...?! Do you have the same Bible as I do?

Ann asked why Mary would need to ask God for anything if she were face to face with Him. I merely gave an example when she was face to face with Him and still asked Him for something. [ETA - when I pray, more often than not I ask God for something. Is that not prayer?]

What about the wedding at Cana (John 2)? Mary was face to face with God in the Person of her Son Jesus, yet she still saw fit to mention to Him about the shortage of wine.

Then you need to be more specific in your question; I could write essays otherwise.

Care to enlighten me on what you think I'm missing?

I voted to do what you're told; I had a goatee when I first dated the future Mrs B, and one of the first (of many, many, many, many...) demands she made was for me to head for the razor, if I wanted any more kisses from her! Now we have two children...go figure...

A couple of points, picking up on what others have said thus far. Firstly, Thinkingstuff and others have asked what is meant by the 'Gospel' and in what way I heard this preached in the sermon at Mass the other week. Being an evangelical board, I won't make the 'mistake' of saying "the reading...

Are you going to engage with what I've posted (the legal arguments etc) or must we continue our dialogue of the deaf?

Regardless of what Obama thinks, the main reason is to defeat the Taleban. In any event, this was a crime committed on (or rather, over) American soil, not on Afghan or Pakistani territory.

Or God using Nebuchadnezzar before that to punish the Kingdom of Judah. I would be wary though of trying to second guess God in this way and using it to influence one's voting behaviour - it's one thing for God to act this way, quite another for a mere human, however Christian, to do so.