“I was predestined to be an Arminian or I chose to be a Calvinist.”

[David Michael Harris]

Hello Taffy

Can you deall Welsh wrth Spoken ysgrifenedig. Os so, are you Doctrines of Grace in Faith?:smilewinkgrin:

Just a born again Christian from Cardiff, hold to the Apostles creed, protestant and learning. It's sad that I even have to say I am a protestant to define myself but such is the state of Christianity in 2012 I hold to the 66 books as all my source of doctrine and teaching.

 

[InTheLight]

There is a difference between total incapability to choose any moral good and a total incapability to choose a course of action that has in its purpose solely the glory of God. I hope you can see the difference.

You have not addressed what Benjamin previously objected to when he said,

humans either have volitional abilities or they do not, both cannot logically be true.

You've merely restated that man does have volitional abilities and man does not have them. <shrugs>

 

[InTheLight]

Faith is a gift of God. Faith is the fruit of the Spirit. Faith is not an attribute of the fallen creature. It just simply is not

Please explain why Jesus found faith within unregenerate people?

The Centurion (gentile) in Matthew 8

10 When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.


The friends of the man sick with palsy in Matthew 9

2 And, behold, they brought to him a man sick of the palsy, lying on a bed: and Jesus seeing their faith said unto the sick of the palsy; Son, be of good cheer; thy sins be forgiven thee.


The woman who touched Jesus' garment and was healed in Matthew 9

22 But Jesus turned him about, and when he saw her, he said, Daughter, be of good comfort; thy faith hath made thee whole.


The woman whose daughter was healed of her demon possession in Matthew 15

28 Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.


I could go on and on. The point being here is God, as Jesus, finding faith in people. Any evidence from the context of the scripture that these people were regenerated and/or given the "gift of faith?" No.

 

[psalms109:31]

The Centurion heard all what Jesus could do. He knew Jesus could do what He said He could do without being there to see it or Jesus going there just by His word it will be done that is faith. Jesus told the disciple's that they are going to the other side of the lake. They had little faith because of the storm they are going to the other side of the lake and woke the one who can calm the storm.

Mathew 8:
27 The men were amazed and asked, “What kind of man is this? Even the winds and the waves obey him!”

little faith

Mathew 8:
8 The centurion replied, “Lord, I do not deserve to have you come under my roof. But just say the word, and my servant will be healed.

great faith

 

[InTheLight]

The Centurion heard all what Jesus could do. He knew Jesus could do what He said He could do without being there to see it or Jesus being there that is faith.

So what you are saying is that without a direct intervention by God, the Centurion (and others I cited) had faith. Is that correct?

 

[psalms109:31]

So what you are saying is that without a direct intervention by God, the Centurion (and others I cited) had faith. Is that correct?

What i am simply saying is this

Romans 10:17
Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word about Christ.

If the centurion never heard he would have never had anything to have faith in.

So his faith came by hearing about Jesus and he believed what he did not see that is faith.

 

[David Michael Harris]

What i am simply saying is this

Romans 10:17
Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word about Christ.

If the centurion never heard he would have never had anything to have faith in.

So his faith came by hearing about Jesus and he believed what he did not see that is faith.

Amen. What an amazing Gospel. I was saved in 1984 because someone took the time to pass it on.

 

[Van]

Many of the overarching doctrines of Calvinism nullify the Bible. If the T of the Tulip is true, no Calvinist would bother to present what they think is the correct view, because no one not regenerated could understand it, and everyone regenerated will come to faith no matter how many false doctrines stand in the way. But the view is neither true nor believed. Calvinists constantly post their mistaken doctrines, and Matthew 23:13 teaches false doctrine does stand in the way of salvation.

First they say no one can understand at any time, then they say no one can understand and respond effectively the second time around. But when faced with unregenerates entering heaven, they must say scripture does not mean what it says, i.e. nullification is the last resort of Calvinism.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Many of the overarching doctrines of Calvinism nullify the Bible. If the T of the Tulip is true, no Calvinist would bother to present what they think is the correct view, because no one not regenerated could understand it, and everyone regenerated will come to faith no matter how many false doctrines stand in the way. But the view is neither true nor believed. Calvinists constantly post their mistaken doctrines, and Matthew 23:13 teaches false doctrine does stand in the way of salvation.

I BELIEVE IN IT ...In all the Doctrines of Grace! So what are you now questioning ...."My Salvation" & the salvation of each and everyone who does? NICE.

Id wish you had any real guts because then youd give a solid "YES" to the question. Come on....stand up for your convictions! :godisgood:

 

[David Michael Harris]

Pretty much reformed, protestant here, TULIP, well, I don't really care, maybe right, maybe not 100% right. I don't know. It's clever I admit but with regards to the I... I don't want to rock any boat but I know for a fact I had a choice given to me, then again how can I resist such an offer as put before me. I don't like to admit it but I say unless your an idiot Gods Grace is irresistible, and yet I am a great fan of John Wesley. Shows you my problems eh

 

[InTheLight]

What i am simply saying is this

Romans 10:17
Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word about Christ.

If the centurion never heard he would have never had anything to have faith in.

So his faith came by hearing about Jesus and he believed what he did not see that is faith.

And I agree with you. I disagree with Calvinists that say faith is a gift of God. Calvinists say that you cannot have faith until/unless God regenerates your totally depraved heart so you can accept God's gift of faith. Yet we see in scripture dozens of times where obviously unregenerate people had faith, or faith was found in them. Notice that phrase "faith was found in them," not faith was gifted to them or faith was put inside them.

 

[David Michael Harris]

And I agree with you. I disagree with Calvinists that say faith is a gift of God. Calvinists say that you cannot have faith until/unless God regenerates your totally depraved heart so you can accept God's gift of faith. Yet we see in scripture dozens of times where obviously unregenerate people had faith, or faith was found in them. Notice that phrase "faith was found in them," not faith was gifted to them or faith was put inside them.

Faith is the gift of God, even if I do not agree with these so called calvinist's. At times

 

[InTheLight]

Faith is the gift of God, even if I do not agree with these so called calvinist's. At times

If faith is a gift of God, why did Jesus MARVEL that he had found faith in him?

9 When Jesus heard these things, he marvelled at him, and turned him about, and said unto the people that followed him, I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Pretty much reformed, protestant here, TULIP, well, I don't really care, maybe right, maybe not 100% right. I don't know. It's clever I admit but with regards to the I... I don't want to rock any boat but I know for a fact I had a choice given to me, then again how can I resist such an offer as put before me. I don't like to admit it but I say unless your an idiot Gods Grace is irresistible, and yet I am a great fan of John Wesley. Shows you my problems eh

I have a propencity toward Bunyan, Edwards, Whitfield, Lloyd-Jones, Pink, William Williams & I really like Sinclair Ferguson. For years my fathers side were mostly Welsh Methodists so from that prospective good ole John Wesley was ....er...how should I say it....muddled with some real strange ideas. Great Great Grand Dad did minister to these Arminian Anglicans when they came over here & needed an English to Welsh translator but we've never flipped to that type of theology. In the USA, most do not know that there once was a Calvinistic Methodist Church & that it merged with the Presbyterians & Congregationalists. Welsh is still taught & spoken in some Reformed Churches in Pennsylvania, especially in the Anthracite Coal Mining regions.

 

[David Michael Harris]

Please explain why Jesus found faith within unregenerate people?

The Centurion (gentile) in Matthew 8

10 When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.


The friends of the man sick with palsy in Matthew 9

2 And, behold, they brought to him a man sick of the palsy, lying on a bed: and Jesus seeing their faith said unto the sick of the palsy; Son, be of good cheer; thy sins be forgiven thee.


The woman who touched Jesus' garment and was healed in Matthew 9

22 But Jesus turned him about, and when he saw her, he said, Daughter, be of good comfort; thy faith hath made thee whole.


The woman whose daughter was healed of her demon possession in Matthew 15

28 Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.


I could go on and on. The point being here is God, as Jesus, finding faith in people. Any evidence from the context of the scripture that these people were regenerated and/or given the "gift of faith?" No.

Easy, it was not a saving faith which God gives those saved, it was just the Grace of Christ, from whom we have recieved grace upon grace. I think they were just good people who wanted out. Of whom the world was not worthy. I believed in good even before I was a Christian, I always wanted good. When the Lord Christ is standing before you, tell me what it is like. The Lord knows those who are His. Eveyone is different. The earth is the Lord's and the fullness thereof.

 

[InTheLight]

Easy, it was not a saving faith which God gives those saved, it was just the Grace of Christ, from whom we have recieved grace upon grace. I think they were just good people who wanted out. Of whom the world was not worthy. I believed in good even before I was a Christian, I always wanted good.

These people in the Bible didn't want good or want out. They had faith that Jesus had the power to heal their friends. They (apparently) believed that he was as he claimed--the Son of God. Faith was FOUND IN THEM. Jesus MARVELED at their faith. Why would Jesus marvel at their faith if it was He Himself that had given it to them?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

And I agree with you. I disagree with Calvinists that say faith is a gift of God. Calvinists say that you cannot have faith until/unless God regenerates your totally depraved heart so you can accept God's gift of faith. Yet we see in scripture dozens of times where obviously unregenerate people had faith, or faith was found in them. Notice that phrase "faith was found in them," not faith was gifted to them or faith was put inside them.

Then you did not read my post # 25 regarding total depravity did you.

 

[David Michael Harris]

These people in the Bible didn't want good or want out. They had faith that Jesus had the power to heal their friends. They (apparently) believed that he was as he claimed--the Son of God. Faith was FOUND IN THEM. Jesus MARVELED at their faith. Why would Jesus marvel at their faith if it was He Himself that had given it to them?[/QUOTE

It was a not a saving faith, after the cross, remember He had not died at this time. What did He say, when I am... like the serpant of moses. I will draw all men unto me. Geez work it out. Wish I was there I guess. Yeah He marvelled, what did they have faith in? Not the Lamb of God thats for sure because He had not yet been slain. Your narrow minded.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Faith is the gift of God, even if I do not agree with these so called calvinist's. At times

Why do you prefice your statement with "SO CALLED".....Calvinists? Explain please.

 

[David Michael Harris]

Why do you prefice your statement with "SO CALLED".....Calvinists? Explain please.

James said we all make mistakes, what I meant was that some people who think they know it all, which calvinists seem to say and yet still call sunday the Lords Day the sabbath.

That was a slip, sorry.